Your menu/shopping decision process

[JAZ]

A friend of mine and I were talking about how we decide what to make for dinner, and we realized that there are several ways to go about planning a meal, or even a week's shopping, if you plan that far in advance (which I generally do not do).

Sometimes, I want a particular ethnic or regional cuisine, so that's my starting point. So, say, I want Mexican food. I then think about what ingredients I have on hand, and what I can make with minimal extra shopping. If I go the the store and a necessary ingredient is not at hand, though, I'm screwed. That is, if I have pork shoulder at home and I've decided on chili verde but the store has no tomatillos, I have to make a new decision. Do I try to improvise, or do I scramble for a new plan? (I should mention that I don't have a car, so driving to another market is not an option for me). If I have to go with a new plan there in the market, it can be sort of fun if I have a lot of time, but it can also -- well -- suck.

Other times, though, I'll have one or more ingredients on hand, and my decision process starts with "what can I make with X, Y, and Z?" I'll have a piece of salmon that needs to be used, and some broccoli that's not getting any younger, and that will determine what the the rest of the meal will be. Then I'll come up with a menu based on the salmon and broccoli and go buy what I need to fill it out. Again, if I'm in the store and I can't find the ingredients to complete my meal, I have to wing it. But in this case, it's usually not too tough, because I've started out with the main elements. I might have to change from an Asian-influenced menu to a Mediterranean one, but I'm pretty good dealing with that.

When I have time (and no particular menu in mind) I like to go the store and just wander around for inspiration. Usually, I start in the meat/fish section. I see what looks good or what's on sale, and I plan from there. This is generally less efficient than other starting points -- I'll have to try to remember what I have on hand (Jeez -- do I have cream in the fridge or not? I'd better buy some just in case) and also remember what I actually need to make the recipes I've come up with. But -- if I have the time -- it can be really enjoyable.

And sometimes, honestly, my meal planning begins and ends with "what can I make without going out?" and I'll end up an omelet and a salad, because I have eggs and cheese and greens. Or I'll end up with potato gratin and an Italian sausage, because that's what I have.

I cook for myself most of the time, which I know affects the way I plan and shop. I'm sure those who cook for a family plan differently.

So how do you go about planning meals and shopping? What does your meal planning decision tree look like?

[David A. Goldfarb]

I pretty much always cook around what looks good in the market. Once in a while I want to try some particular recipe or dish or concept, but with the prior assumption that I can get the ingredients needed in season, which isn't to say I won't go out of my way to hunt down unusual ingredients when seasonality isn't an issue, as for a spice that is normally dried or for a fermented sauce.

[nakji]

Since I have a fairly limited range of things to buy from - no processed foods; and very little selection of traditional western staples like cheese or beef - my decision making process is pretty simple. I work within a range of recipes that can be executed with the ingredients and substitutions I have on hand.

On the weekend, I usually go through my tabbed cookbooks to see what dishes I want to make that week. I have a whiteboard in the kitchen, where I schedule the meals, based on what's happening in the evenings during the week. Usually I choose dishes that will yield leftovers for a packed lunch the following day. Right now I'm on a roasting chicken kick, because I want to get good at roasted chicken. So I buy one once a week, cook it on either Saturday or Sunday, then have to do something to address the leftovers and the stock it yields. Last week it was a curry and Thomas Keller's lentil soup. This week I think we'll do risotto (using a mix of glutinous and plain rice) with the stock, and maybe tackle a chicken pot pie recipe. I buy meat, bread and any staples on the weekend. During the week I pick up vegetables on an as-needed basis from the wet market on my way home from work.

If I didn't plan, I'd never be able to cook at home. Supermarkets in China don't invite contemplation of the ingredients to decide something on the spur of the moment. They're too bustling. I need a game plan when I get home in the evening, or I'll just give up and grab something on the street.

[Darienne]

Over the years, Ed and I have devised menus to suit our needs for eating and the fact that we live at least 1/2 hour from any store. Also our 'city' does not carry unusual or exotic foods. I've seen kumquats once in several years.

I have made a computer generated columnized list of foods and stores which carry only certain foods (like the health food store or the liquor store...in Ontario we have separate liquor stores, asian store) and I generate copies of this list which are then fastened with an earth magnet to the fridge wall with a hanging red pen to circle items which we need, are out of, want to buy, need to write in, etc.

When we lived in Moab last year, where different foods were available/not available and different stores were there, I simply used the home list to edit into the 'Moab' list and generated that list.

If anyone would like a copy of the list to use, they can PM me for it.

Once a week after breakfast, we discuss the week's menus and try to make sure we can make the dishes. Then there are the whim meals, like grilled cheese sandwiches or popcorn and orange juleps. There are always on hand cheese, bread, popcorn, oranges, milk, oj, etc. And canned items like chickpeas and tomatoes.

We eat much more simply than most folks on this list and tend to eat the same things in a month probably. And a LOT of Chinese food which means mostly egetables and bottled stuff, like Oyster sauce, Hoisin, etc with bits of meat.

I make a number of basic things like yogurt, granola, etc.

We have just joined Costco and this week we'll see exactly where it can fit into our shopping list.

[weinoo]

I pretty much always cook around what looks good in the market. Once in a while I want to try some particular recipe or dish or concept, but with the prior assumption that I can get the ingredients needed in season, which isn't to say I won't go out of my way to hunt down unusual ingredients when seasonality isn't an issue, as for a spice that is normally dried or for a fermented sauce.

I'm with David, though I should add that sometimes I shop based on what looks good FOR THAT price. I'm also fortunate enough in that I live within close walking distance to quite a few very excellent places to shop...

So, for instance, the other day I went to the market which is 1 minute away (via foot). It's a market where I NEVER buy beef, but I will buy their kosher chicken or I will buy pork. I mostly use it for staples, but like I said, if they're having a sale on something like pork shoulder, I'll pick that up. And, I wrote a bit of a piece for my blog after I did just that.

Lazy (and Cheap) Man Roast Pig

[Doodad]

I try to plan out at least 5 days and generally will cook up some large items that can share an oven or grill to hold for during the week. Say a pork shoulder that is a roast for Sunday dinner, carnitas style tacos another night, and twice cooked pork for an asian night.

This works fairly well, but inevitably the store is out of something or another item looks or costs better and I just adjust. And then I play during the week with short trip for sides needed or if another main just sounds better.

Bread and fish for example I only buy the day of cooking. I just can't buy fresh fish or shrimp and then freeze it. Feels wrong.

[TimS]

I do the food shopping and cooking for the family. Being the father of 3 school-aged children and working full-time, I first lay out the events for the week that are going to impact cooking times--evening sports practices, etc. That's the biggest driver to my planning. I generally keep the meals simple when cooking times are restricted, and I do my best to steer clear of processed foods. If any foods require prep in advance of a meal (dough, marinating, etc.), I'll write those on the menu too, to make sure I do what needs to be done in time.

Weekends are for experimenting with technique and new dishes. Weekends usually generate enough excess for a 'leftovers' meal either Monday or Tuesday.

Planning the menu before shopping, and shopping on the same day each week keeps the impulse-buying to a minimum (that's why I do the shopping ). Exceptions to the once/week trip are things (fish, shellfish, ground beef, etc.) that I prefer/need to cook same-day; those are grabbed on the way home from work, when needed.

Posting the menu on the fridge lets everyone know what to expect. The kids (and wife) are always free to nominate dishes by writing it at the bottom of the menu, and I'll try to incorporate it into the following week's meals.

Edited March 6, 2010 by TimS (log)

[Darienne]

TimS...you are an angel in human dress.

[Jacquester]

I basically rely on a combination of the above. I sometimes am a moody foodie and will get into a regional mood like asian, cajun, french etc. and sometimes I'm thematic, like seafood, or "fatso" night, but when I'm building a menu I start with an idea for a main theme then I walk around my greengrocer for inspiration. I'll build a dessert around whatever fruit looks good, and if a vegetable catches my eye, I'll pick it up and work it into my menu. My menu will also depend on the guests, and the type of dinner I'm having, so those 2 factors will inspire me. If possible I keep tabs on what my friends etc. like and dislike and this will factor in too.

Edited March 6, 2010 by Jacquester (log)

[judiu]

I basically rely on a combination of the above. I sometimes am a moody foodie and will get into a regional mood like asian, cajun, french etc. and sometimes I'm thematic, like seafood, or "fatso" night, but when I'm building a menu I start with an idea for a main theme then I walk around my greengrocer for inspiration. I'll build a dessert around whatever fruit looks good, and if a vegetable catches my eye, I'll pick it up and work it into my menu. My menu will also depend on the guests, and the type of dinner I'm having, so those 2 factors will inspire me. If possible I keep tabs on what my friends etc. like and dislike and this will factor in too.

OK, I'll (pardon) bite; what's 'fatso' night?

[Shalmanese]

I live about 10 minutes walk away from a supermarket but only 100 yards away from a greengrocer so my general strategy is to see what meat is on sale that week and structure the menu around that. I'll buy the meat and come home and portion it out, maybe start marinating some pieces of it etc. Then, when I need to cook it, I can usually cobble together something from inspiration.

[JAZ]

I do the food shopping and cooking for the family. Being the father of 3 school-aged children and working full-time, I first lay out the events for the week that are going to impact cooking times--evening sports practices, etc. That's the biggest driver to my planning. I generally keep the meals simple when cooking times are restricted, and I do my best to steer clear of processed foods. If any foods require prep in advance of a meal (dough, marinating, etc.), I'll write those on the menu too, to make sure I do what needs to be done in time.

Weekends are for experimenting with technique and new dishes. Weekends usually generate enough excess for a 'leftovers' meal either Monday or Tuesday.

. . .

Posting the menu on the fridge lets everyone know what to expect. The kids (and wife) are always free to nominate dishes by writing it at the bottom of the menu, and I'll try to incorporate it into the following week's meals.

So your menu choices for the week are based on what requests you get? Do you have standards that are on the menu regularly? What if no one has any suggestions?

[Dakki]

Depends on a few factors.

I have a few things I eat almost daily like green salad and frijoles charros. Obviously I need to keep the ingredients at hand so when I run out (or close) these go on the list.

I've been trying my hand at baking recently so a lot of times I'll look up a recipe for whatever I want to do this time (cheesecake, apple pie, whatever), check against my pantry and list the ingredients missing. These often include stuff I don't use a lot of (milk, eggs) and freshness is important for baking so I usually buy the smallest packages available.

Sometimes I'll see a lovely ingredient on sale at the supermarket and build meals around that. This is especially true of meats and seafood but also sometimes of the more expensive vegetables. Recent stuff I've gotten this way: sweetbreads, red snapper, artichokes.

[David A. Goldfarb]

I'm with David, though I should add that sometimes I shop based on what looks good FOR THAT price.

I definitely do that too. Whole pork shoulder dropped to 99-cents a pound at my usual supermarket-kind-of-market last week, so I took the biggest one in the bin and cut up the whole thing for sausages--about 3 pounds fresh and 7 pounds for <i>saucisson sec</i>, and then cursed when I saw pork shoulder at another market a few days later for 69-cents a pound.

[maggiethecat]

I buy what's cheap and move on from there. I never go out thinking "Carnitas. Beef Welly. Roast Chicken. Asparagus with Hollandaise." I know I can wrassle a dinner from whatever's on sale.

[Porthos]

I buy what's cheap and move on from there. I never go out thinking "Carnitas. Beef Welly. Roast Chicken. Asparagus with Hollandaise." I know I can wrassle a dinner from whatever's on sale.

That is the basic tact my DW and I take. We shop together.

My DW had bariatric surgery last year and so now meal planning (using what's in the larder) is based upon getting her enough protein. I'm unemployed right now so planning and cooking dinner is something that I do. When we are both employed (my DW is employed) then we take turns figuring out dinner. The one thing we have figured out that does influence what meat we buy is that fact that lean pork and chicken breasts tend to be too dry for her to digest easily so we are avoiding buying those for the time being.

[torakris]

I work part time out of my home and have 3 school aged children to feed as well as my husband. I usually plan my meals by the week using a notebook that I write my menus in. The menus are based on a variety of factors, I teach until 5:30 2 nights a week so on these days I need to get the prep done before 3pm or plan meals that can be thrown together in less than an hour. 2 other days a week I am driving the kids around to various lessons with both days ending at 6:30 so on these days I need things that I can cook and let sit or simmer. Once a week and on the weekends are the days that I can spend a little more time in the kitchen.

I keep my pantry fully stocked, we could probably eat for 2 weeks just using food from the pantry/freezer. Japanese supermarkets have really good sales and I plan that week's meal based on what is on sale. I sit down with the flyers and my notebook and plan anywhere from 4 to 7 days depending on how busy I will be during the week and if I can make a couple more shopping trips. I usually leave one day empty so that I can just see what else at the store looks good. My shopping trip this morning (Sunday) will last me through Friday, when I have another trip planned. I use up the most perishable items first (fish, greens, etc) and save the sturdier items for later int he week.

As to getting ideas for what to cook, I regularly page through my cookbooks and cooking magazines and marking the pages of things I want to try, when I see the ingredients for the dish on sale I add it to my menu notebook. Sometimes I use sites like Epicurious or Cookpad (a Japanese site) for ideas, I input the ingredients that I want to use and see what comes up. We almost never eat the same dish twice in a month and if I say that I make a certain dish often that means we may eat it about 6 to 8 times a year.

I never ever go to a store with out a shopping list, I can't even imagine how much money I would end up spending. By only shopping sales I can easily feed our family for $100 a week.

[TimS]

So your menu choices for the week are based on what requests you get? Do you have standards that are on the menu regularly? What if no one has any suggestions?

The requests amount to maybe one meal/week. From the older kids/wife, I generally get 'when are you going make X again?,' or 'why don't you try making Y?' My youngest likes to pick dishes she finds in a cookbook she got me for Christmas, based on the pictures (one-dish meals, or something like that).

In lieu of suggestions, I'll base the menu on things I'm pretty sure everyone will like. Luckily, everyone but the youngest is OK with trying new stuff (and I'm certainly open to criticism if they think I shouldn't attempt a given dish again). I make a note of particular favorites, and use that list to populate my menu as well.

There are definite standards rotated in: easy pasta dishes (puttanesca, clams & spaghetti, etc.), various roasted/grilled meats and veggies, etc.

Though I try occasionally, I don't have the skillset to 'throw something together' like many here do, other than the basics. I'm working on it though, and working on stocking my pantry better to allow me to do so.

[Dave the Cook]

. . . .

What does your meal planning decision tree look like?

This is an interesting notion that I think many of us are minimizing. We like to say that we "throw things together," but that understates how the process works. When you choose a protein, starch or unusual vegetable, you start a chain of events: a series of subsequent decisions that ends in a meal. Being able to construct that chain successfully is the result of luck, product availability and -- most of all -- experience.

It's not just the result of having cooked lots of things, though. When I cooked for five, I did just what TimS does, and I wasn't very good at throwing things together. First, the budget was more constrained; second, there were more palates to please; third, time was a critical factor. None of that invites improvisation. Now that I cook mostly for myself and work from home, I've become much more opportunistic and adventurous, and my ability to wrassle a meal has improved greatly. Nevertheless, I'm sure that some of the things I do now I could have done years ago; they just never occurred to me. Maybe we could pick this process apart a little more.

[nakji]

This is an interesting notion that I think many of us are minimizing. We like to say that we "throw things together," but that understates how the process works. When you choose a protein, starch or unusual vegetable, you start a chain of events: a series of subsequent decisions that ends in a meal. Being able to construct that chain successfully is the result of luck, product availability and -- most of all -- experience.

Part of the ability to be creative and menu plan on the fly depends on how broad a selection of "staples" you keep on hand, I think.

I always have in the cupboard/fridge:

Fish sauce

dark/light soy sauce

miso

mirin

gochujang

oyster sauce

black bean sauce

olive oil

peanut oil

sunflower oil

sesame oil

cooking sake

Shiaoxing wine

cheap white wine

Dijon mustard

some sort of chutney

garlic

lemon

ginger

cumin

chili

gochugaru

bay

cinnamon

star anise

sichuan peppercorns

sesame seeds

garam masala

sea salt

pickling salt

sugar

pepper

sticky (mochi) rice

plain rice

long-grain rice

canned tomatoes

dried penne

parmesan cheese

sherry vinegar

smoked bacon

butter

stock (homemade or powder)

Any of these things runs out - it's an automatic re-load. Fortunately, they don't run out at the same time, or it would cost a fortune! Experience has taught me that if I want to run a flexible kitchen, this is my range. It's not very deep into any cuisine - I can't make a biryani or a Thai curry without buying specific things. But from this, I can make anything from a nice roast chicken to dry-fried green beans, depending on what's on sale or in season.

So when I'm at the market, I can look at a pumpkin and think - Pumpkin with sesame - Japanese. Or Curried pumpkin soup. All I need to get is the pumpkin.

Usually I go through my cookbooks at the weekend and decide. If ingredients are fragile, like tofu, then I plan to shop the day I want to cook it. I always try and keep a "cupboard" dinner - pasta amatriciana is a good one for that - for later in the week, or for days I can't get to the market.

[MelissaH]

We generally think about things a week at a time. For us, the first consideration is the week's schedule. Specifically, are there things going on that will affect our dinner plans? Are there nights when we're going to have company? If there's a hockey game, we know we'll need something fast and easy that night. If there's a concert, we'll generally have a little more time than we will for a hockey game. In either case, sometimes we're able to work our schedules such that we can eat lunch together, which means we don't need to worry so much about dinner.

Sometimes one or the other of us has a meeting over dinnertime. Those nights, whoever's not at the meeting often uses the opportunity to make something that the other doesn't particularly like...or downright hates!

Some days, we're lucky and one of us has a clear schedule to make something that takes a little more effort, either because we get home early enough or because we'll have time to do the prep the evening before. If we're thinking a couple of days ahead, we'll pull something from the freezer in enough time for it to thaw.

We also consider the weather as we plan our meals. Will there be a "soup day"? Or will it be nice enough outside that we don't mind firing up the grill?

That said, sometimes our plans fall through. Those are the days we rely on our pantry and freezer staples, such as pasta. If we were so inclined, we could probably eat from pantry and freezer for a month, with fresh milk and veg supplements added in.

We generally try to construct our meals such that we can eat leftovers for lunches, or renovate leftovers into a different meal. Case in point: last week we had stir-fry with rice on Saturday, and meatloaf on Sunday night. Tuesday night we had a friend joining us for a quick dinner before an 11 PM skate-and-shoot session on the ice. The local supermarket had decent-looking red peppers at a decent price. I combined leftover rice and chopped-up leftover meatloaf with a little shredded cheese binder and used the mixture to stuff the peppers.

As far as shopping, the one supermarket left in our town is really lousy for most things, although occasionally they'll have better prices than the Wegman's in the city (closest one is 45 minutes away) on produce but quality can be dubious. We have a small market in town with a terrific meat counter and terrific sausages they make themselves, but very limited produce and dairy. We have a farm market the other side of town from the meat-counter market that's a very good place to buy produce. And about once a week, I find myself in the city for other reasons, and on those visits I try to go to Wegman's, where I don't mind shopping or spending time but try not to make special one-purpose trips.

Generally speaking, we look at the ads to see what's on special that week. If there's something notable, we put it on the list and find a way to work it into the week's menu. We're both thankful that we have enough of a knowledge base that we can punt, if need be. We usually don't plan out each week's meals to the hilt; we leave a day or two open, which gives us the flexibility to use the fresh ingredients we buy for other purposes than whatever our initial intent was, because it seems like we never have a week go exactly as planned!

One thing that's saved us more than once is that both of us like to cook, and have enough of a solid knowledge base that we can improvise as needed. When we've had students over, this is the thing that surprises many of them.

MelissaH

[ElaineK]

Twice a week, my husband has night classes and I eat whatever I can scrounge out of the kitchen. Since the pickings were slim tonight, I thought of this thread and did a little meal planning for the rest of the week. It went like this:

What random things are malingering in my refrigerator? Marsala, which I bought to make chicken marsala. That was popular, but I haven't made it since. I should make it again. I don't need to buy anything but chicken, woohoo! Chicken goes on the list. "I'm buying everything else on this list at Costco. I could buy chicken at Costco, but what will I do with the rest of it? I could freeze half..." Chicken salad? Gloppy, and sort of unappealing. Chicken on a green salad? What do we have to put on a salad? Green bell pepper, which small-child insisted be purchased, and she'll eat two mouse-bites of. Greek salad! I have olives that have been malingering! Mmm, and I like feta cheese.

So, this week's dinners are set.

Tuesday is Chicken Marsala with asparagus (purchased on spec on Sunday because it was cheap, and I like asparagus), spinach (as salad or sauteed, because it needs to be used up) and brown rice pilaf (because the brown rice has been hanging about entirely too long).

Wednesday I'll broil up some chicken and make big salads with bell pepper, cucumber, olives, feta and probably no tomato. Mmm, and homemade breadsticks.

Thursday is another class night, and I'll eat some combination of leftovers (probably just another greek salad, unless there's Chicken Marsala left)

Friday I'll make rice salad out of whatever hasn't been eaten up yet. If we've eaten too much - it'll be fried rice instead.

Saturday we're doing landscaping, and I'll make pizza. Now if there's just room in my fridge for all this.