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Kobe Beef Dogs


John

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I've always been curious about Kobe beef dogs; how they would taste and whether or not I would like them any better than a regular beef dog. But not so curious that I would travel to New York to sample one. Or pay the inflated price. Once I paid $15.00 for a pound of Lobel's franks. This was about 8 years ago. They cost so much because the beef used is prime. A very good dog, but not a standout. In fact, I compared it next to a Niman Ranch ($8.99 per lb) and a Nathan's natural casing frank. My preference was 1) Nathan's 2) Lobel's 3) Niman Ranch. The 2 pricier dogs were good, but not worth the price.

I figured the same would be true of a Kobe beef dog. I've read opinions ranging from "the best dog I've ever had" to "overated" and "nothing special". Some have said that the dog was mushy, perhaps due to the use of high quality beef that has a higher marbling/fat content. Still, I wanted to sample one for myself. I found a restaurant about 4 or 5 miles from home that offers one for about $20.00. I had been holding off but finally decided that it would be worth the high price just to satisfy my curiosity. I planned to go soon.

Yesterday I happenned to be in a King's supermarket when I came across a package in the deli section containing 2 Kobe Beef hot dogs. The cost was $7.99 per pound. The total weight for 2 dogs was .65 lbs and the cost was $5.19. That translates to about $2.60 for a fat dog slightly bigger than a 4 to a lb. I scoffed them up.

I prepared one last night. I happenned to have an 8 to a lb natural casing Best frank left in the freezer that I defrosted for the sake of comparison. Both dogs were simmerred in hot (not boiling) water and heated on low heat in a skillet.

The Kobe beef frank had a tough casing that was definitely from a hog or pig intestine. Usually thicker dogs like this need a tougher casing while smaller dogs (like the Best) use a sheep or lamb casing. I've had hog casings before, but the one on the Kobe frank was much too tough. I actually would have preferred a skinless dog to one with a casing this tough. And I am a big fan of dogs with a casing.

The dog had a decent consistency. It wasn't mushy as some have described a Kobe dog. Then again there is more than one company that makes these type of dogs. There was no info on the label except the price, weight, that it was a Kobe beef frank and that it came from King's. As for flavor, it was ok, but very average. Although not kosher, it was quite salty like a kosher dog. Because of the size, it looked like a knockwurst or "special". Tasted like a straightforward salty beef dog with little complexity. Medium to slightly higher than average spice level for an Eastern U.S. Beef dog.

The Best's dog was much better. Better casing, better size, better flavor,and a better, more complex spicing. It tasted even better than it usually does because it was compared to a dog that wasn't nearly as good.

In my opinion Kobe dogs are overated and not worth the high price. At least the Kobe dog I had. The spicing and recipe is more important than the meat mixture, although good beef dogs do use quality cuts of beef. Best uses a mix of choice and lean beef. Sabrett, Hebrew National, Usinger's, Boars Head, and others also use quality beef.

I had the second dog just before posting here. I simmerred it in water again, but this time I put it on the grill in the yard. It tasted the same as last night. These dogs are fairly juicy, and while I think they are nothing special, they're ok and some may like them.

John the hot dog guy

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Sounds like a product for complete suckers if you ask me.

No matter how precious the source livestock is, it will still produce its share of byproduct and scraps. So someone decided to take Kobe scraps, make them into crappy hot dogs and laugh all the way to the bank at the fools forking over their cash for a highbrow wiener.

Hey, can I make Kobe scrapple and sell it at Whole Foods?

Edited by chappie (log)
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I posted about this on a few other sites as well as here. It was pointed out to me that I made a generalization about Kobe beef dogs based on only sampling one. This is true, but I will say that Kings has a very good reputation and I'm sure their product is from a reputable supplier. I've also heard the same criticism from people whose opinions I respect.

Years ago Usinger's was chosen by the Olympic Comitee and the people at Certified Angus Beef as the best beef dog in the country. They were asked to make a frank with their (Usinger's) recipe, but with Angus beef to be sold at the Olympics. Usinger's made this frank available through their website. I bought it and compared it with their regular beef frank. Both were the same size and made to the same recipe. They tasted EXACTLY the same. I was told that the angus frank was a little juicier but I would have been hard pressed to tell.

A selling point of kobe/wagyu beef is that it is tender and has a higher fat content. Makers of hamburgers and hot dogs are putting the beef through a grinder to make it more tender plus they can adjust the level of fat thereby rendering the point moot. The recipe and spicing are more important than the grade of beef used.

John the hot dog guy

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I think the issue is that, once you start grinding meat, its original marbling is irrelevant. The appeal of Kobe and Kobe-style beef is its marbling. If you eat a piece of Kobe strip, it is incredibly tender because it has so much marbled fat. If you stick that in a grinder, it doesn't matter that it had all that marbled fat. It's just as easy to add some fat to the grind from elsewhere in the animal in order to achieve whatever percentage of fat is desired in the final product. Nobody is going to be able to tell the difference. There might be some benefit to using something like grass-fed beef, which has a great flavor but tends not to be as tender as grain-fed beef, in a hot dog. But even that might be overshadowed by the spices. Hard to know for sure without experimenting.

Steven A. Shaw aka "Fat Guy"
Co-founder, Society for Culinary Arts & Letters, sshaw@egstaff.org
Proud signatory to the eG Ethics code
Director, New Media Studies, International Culinary Center (take my food-blogging course)

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That's hard to answer. I would like a hot dog to contain decent cuts of quality beef and/or beef and pork. You're not going to get a quality frank from cheap scraps of meat mixed with a lot of cereal and filler. There are many factors here. The meat, the recipe, the spicing, even the water. Newark, N.J. where Best Provisions is located, is known for the quality of their water. The plant manager there told me that it is one reason why their hot dogs are so good. He also told me that Hebrew National moved their production facility a few years back in part due to concerns about the water.

Anheuser Busch opened their second brewery in Newark because of the water source.

John the hot dog guy

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  • 2 weeks later...
I posted about this on a few other sites as well as here. It was pointed out to me that I made a generalization about Kobe beef dogs based on only sampling one. This is true, but I will say that Kings has a very good reputation and I'm sure their product is from a reputable supplier. I've also heard the same criticism from people whose opinions I respect.

Years ago Usinger's was chosen by the Olympic Comitee and the people at Certified Angus Beef as the best beef dog in the country. They were asked to make a frank with their (Usinger's) recipe, but with Angus beef to be sold at the Olympics. Usinger's made this frank available through their website. I bought it and compared it with their regular beef frank. Both were the same size and made to the same recipe. They tasted EXACTLY the same. I was told that the angus frank was a little juicier but I would have been hard pressed to tell.

A selling point of kobe/wagyu beef is that it is tender and has a higher fat content. Makers of hamburgers and hot dogs are putting the beef through a grinder to make it more tender plus they can adjust the level of fat thereby rendering the point moot. The recipe and spicing are more important than the grade of beef used.

In a blind tasting I conducted with the aforementioned Usinger's Olympic dog and a Vienna Beef hot dog, the Vienna was chosen by all three tasters. In a comparison of Nathan's Natural Casing and the Vienna dog(my standard). the Vienna again was chosen the best. Usinger's does make a veal wiener if you special order a box. It is a very good weiner also. I get Vienna at the Factory Store and my Usinger's at the factory also. Both are great, just different.

Since hot dogs are essentially a blend of meat, fat and spices, I wouldn't expect a Kobe dog to taste any better than any other dog. My instinct also tells me that the dog does not contain real Kobe beef but American Waygu.-Dick

Edited by budrichard (log)
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Unfortunately Usinger's isn't available near me so I have to order them through their site. Vienna isn't available near me either since the one guy that sold them closed. But I did have a Vienna frank yesterday at the Hot Dog Hootenanny in New York. They were shipped in for the occasion. I guess it depends on your taste but I and most others I spoke with preferred the Papaya King (Sabrett) dog to the Vienna Beef frank. Usinger's, Sabrett, and Nathan's all are more boldly seasoned than Vienna which is relatively mild in comparison. But it blends in well with all of the other ingredients on a Chicago hot dog.

John the hot dog guy

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John,

Vienna has the advantage of making its products available almost nationwide, or at least the northern tier, via Sysco. So does Boar's Head & Hebrew National, albeit through other distributor chains. The point is that ordianry people with ordinary purses can find them without too much of a strain on the budget caused by increasing postage costs. Even your favorite Admiration makes itself abundantly available, and very reasonably priced, although in large sizes, at many institutional food suppliers.

Best & Sabretts [Marathon?] seem less serviced by distributors and keener to service smaller orders [10 lbs or less] via mail. Would this be a correct assumption on my part? As with Usingers and Nolecheks, the reasonable unit cost essentially doubles [or even more] and begins to approach the $10/lb level, even for upstate NY, because they will only ship 2nd day express.

That makes these brands an unaffordable luxury for many. Too much to spend on hot dogs. I am not sure you will agree. However, by making their product available to smaller regional distributors who are happy to handle smaller amounts for specialized outlets & needs, e.g. Regional Access of Trumansburg, NY, that services a huge swathe from NJ to VT, they could make themselves more accessible to a significant niche market.

Even Admiration could employ this mode, with smaller sizes or single gallons for home use, marketing these alongside the dogs. Best has a lot of good pastrami etc. that will attract interest as well.

Edited by v. gautam (log)
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A lot of franks are only available via mail order. And it is expensive when you have to pay for shipping. Which is why I only order from Usinger's once or twice a year. I didn't know that Vienna was available through Sysco. This might help restaurants and people running hot dog stands, but it doesn't do much for people like me who like to sample these dogs.

Sabrett's ships; Best's does not. I know the plant manager and he refuses to ship his franks to a friend of mine in Maryland even though he is willing to pay whatever it costs for shipping.

I agree with you that making product available to small distributors for niche markets would be a good thing. I know that there are a few distributors that carry Best and distribute them south of their regular market.

John the hot dog guy

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I really believe that what you grew up with is what you will like.

You are correct "Nathan's all are more boldly seasoned than Vienna which is relatively mild in comparison". To my Midwestern dog palate, the Nathan's natural casing is a very tasteful dog with lots of fat and salt but that is not what I'm used to. I would try Sabrett's if available locally. I have curtailed much of my shipping because for next day, the cost of shipping is almost equal to the cost of the product!.-Dick

Edited by budrichard (log)
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