It's Just Food. Eat It.

[robyn]

Hate to do a Paris Hilton impression - but that Asian dude with the famous New York restaurants - can't remember his name or the name of his restaurants - sorry - I only get to New York about once every 5 or 10 years and don't feel like doing a Google search now - has a point. When did taking pictures of food - or writing about food - become more important than eating food? How many food blogs are there these days - thousands - tens of thousands? Written or photographed mostly by people who wouldn't know the difference between a bistro and a 3 star Michelin place. And it isn't only a generational thing. We just returned from Chicago - where we dined at a really good restaurant with my nephew (and his fiancee) - our nephew is a 20 something who does web design and is a really excellent photographer. It was more important for him to dine with us and enjoy the dinner than to take excellent pictures of the meal (and I'm sure his pictures would have been better than about 99% of the food pictures out there).

Anyway - New York Asian restaurant dude - I think you're right. Eat and enjoy. Robyn

[Fresser]

Hate to do a Paris Hilton impression - When did taking pictures of food - or writing about food - become more important than eating food?...Anyway - New York Asian restaurant dude - I think you're right.  Eat and enjoy. Robyn

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Many of us will never eat at French Laundry or perhaps even Katz's, but at least this way we can savor part of the experience. And the able noshers who DO eat at these places and write about it like to share whatever part of the meal they can.

Perhaps I take you too literally (or seriously), but to rank food-related blogging and photography just above navel-gazing misses what lots of us are trying to convey. Snapshots of emerald-green relish and odes to divey fried-chicken joints are how we share our passion for various arts: photography, writing, metaphor and, yes, even poetry. Lots of what goes on here is an intellectual exercise, and a passionate one at that.

Call it mental masturbation if you wish, but vivid description of food is tantalizing. And it can be downright sexy.

Edited August 8, 2008 by Fresser (log)

[heidih]

In the same vein as Fresser, I value the blogs as a window on food that I may never eat, or will not eat soon, but am fascinated by. The photography on the blogs I visit is lovely and I am enriched by the "arm chair travel" afforded by a few simple clicks. I truly believe these people are passionate about the food and related experiences and that the photo and blog aspect allows them to share their joy. As opposed to some of the self serving "look at me" aspects of the internet, this is an area I applaud and look forward to.

[daisy17]

I've photographed some of the more memorable meals I've had (French Laundry, Fat Duck, Alinea, shrimp empanadas and tacos al pastor on the streets of Mexico) for no purpose other than to be able to look back at them and remember the happiness they brought me. They're not posted on a blog, not even on eGullet - they're just for my own pleasure. I'm not sure what the objection from anyone else is, even if I did plaster them on a blog and share them with the world. As long as my flash is off, which mine always is, why do you care whether I'm taking photos or not?

And who says that it's more important than eating what's in front of me? I'm never more present and focused on the joy of the moment when I'm eating. I see taking photos as just prolonging the enjoyment, giving myself the opportunity to reminisce and relive the experience later on, albeit in a different way. I'm still moved when I look back at my French Laundry photos - it was a long-awaited dream, and they transport me back to that perfect night. Other people photograph vacations, experiences relating to their hobbies, and what they love in order to remember it. I happen to travel for, read about, and think about food - photographing food is a given to me.

[robyn]

For those of you who are substituting looking at pictures with living life - my main words of advice would be "get out and do it". Perhaps you will never get to a 3 star Michelin restaurant ever - anywhere - but I had some pretty good eats in the greater Detroit area (an unlikely venue) a couple of weeks ago. And - at home - I am a pretty good cook. Which means time in the kitchen - not looking at pictures on a computer. It isn't in the cards for me to ski again - but I don't sit home looking at Warren Miller movies - I go out and do stuff I can do.

And just FWIW - after years of experience - if you can't remember a meal/dish without looking at a picture - it wasn't a memorable meal/dish. I can still remember some great stuff I had almost 40 years ago.

Also - for many people (althougn not all people) - if you want to eat certain meals in certain places - if there's a will - there's a way. Robyn

[feedmec00kies]

Robyn: Not that it's important to your point, but I believe you're referring to David Chang, of the infamous Momofuku's. It was what he apparently said when questioned why he banned photography from Ko.

I don't know, I've never had much interest in taking pictures or notes of what I eat. However, when I first started becoming more interested in beer, I started to try and rate everything. That lasted maybe... through 40 or 50 different beers. I stopped because I found it too distracting. Although it helped immediately to get me to think about what I was drinking, I started to find it distracting and disruptive to my own enjoyment. The only issue is that I no longer can look back on what I've drank and see exactly what I said about it, but I'm not the type to effectively collect ratings like some of the people I know. If I like the beer, I remember it. If record-keeping is why a person takes pictures of what they eat, though, I respect it. I just don't really care for it myself.

Here's where I get annoyed about the photos and essays. I'm not opposed to looking at someone else's photographs or notes once in a while out of curiosity, but the cynical part of me gets annoyed about how those pictures and essays get posted on the internet and shared. I feel like they just serve to increase hype and are a way for people to brag that they have the money/awesomeness/luck in front of the computer screen at 10am a lot of the time (not always, but often enough to piss me off). And hype turns me off almost automatically. I personally just like to make my own impressions about the food without the influence of others. I just avoid most of those things because, for whatever reason, I feel like there's a certain bit of arrogance in making them public, and it makes me as angry as YouTube comments do.

Yeah, I'm sure you all outnumber me and think I'm being self-righteous and I'm out of my mind, but it's just how I feel. It is just food to me.

(edited for clarity)

Edited August 8, 2008 by feedmec00kies (log)

[Timh]

I agree. The last thing I am thinking about when i go out to eat is if I have my camera so that i can show everyone that I eat out at the cool places. I eat out for me, not for everyone else.

[jumanggy]

When did taking pictures of food - or writing about food - become more important than eating food?  How many food blogs are there these days - thousands - tens of thousands?

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When indeed? I don't think this has happened. I like to think that the eating is still the most important aspect to most people. Just because they photograph their meal doesn't mean they don't appreciate it the way they should. But that's just my theory. I can't possibly claim to know what people who photograph meals (all/ majority/ some/ few/ one) in restaurants are thinking.

I live in a 3rd world country and am more likely to buy a happy meal when I'm out (okay, that's... An exaggeration ). I don't read restaurant reviews and such because they're not very useful to me. But browsing the corresponding cookbooks of big-name chefs and restaurants at the shops (yep... Can't afford 'em) does give me a lot of inspiration and with some luck I hope I can approximate the experience at home.

[Chufi]

For those of you who are substituting looking at pictures with living life - my main words of advice would be "get out and do it". 

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who said that looking at pictures is a substitute? would you say the same thing to people taking pictures of their newborns, their parent's 40th wedding anniversay, their first christmas as a couple, the long awaited vacations to far away places? perhaps you are someone who does not like to take or look at pictures (my husband is one of those people) but for many people, taking pictures is something they do to hold on to precious memories.

Food is my passion, and photography to me is just another way to enjoy this passion. I like to write about food, read about food, photograph food, eat food, cook food, think about food, shop for food, look at other people's food, read what other people have to say about food. Not what everybody has to say about food is interesting, and not everybody's pictures are. There are tons of blogs out there with crappy pictures and bad writing. But there are also lots of blogs and websites with great pictures that inspire me, and beautiful writing that moves me. It's up to you to find the ones that are worth your while. As feedmecookies said, there are annoying and arrogant blogs out there... I stumble upon them, then don't read them anymore.

Taking pics of food in restaurants here (in the Netherlands) is not so common that it's starting to annoy restaurant owners to the point where they forbid it - but it's also not so UNcommon that people look at me weird when I take a picture of my plate before I eat it. It's all over in about 15 seconds anyway, and then I eat. And enjoy. And while I eat, I try to taste as best I can, but I never discuss the food while I'm eating. That is truly distracting to me. Usually it takes me until about an hour after dinner before I can express my thoughts on what I ate. Sometimes it takes me till the next morning!

Edited August 8, 2008 by Chufi (log)

[philadining]

I just think it's funny that participants in a food discussion board would be rolling their eyes at people who are a little bit more obsessive than they are.

If it's only food, and we should just eat it, what are any of us doing here on eG?

[Chufi]

I just think it's funny that participants in a food discussion board would be rolling their eyes at people who are a little bit more obsessive than they are.

If it's only food, and we should just eat it, what are any of us doing here on eG?

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hehe. I was just thinking some more on this subject and this was exactly what I thought. let's all switch off our computers and go eat something! Right Now!

[Jason Campbell]

I think humans have always had a deep relationship with food, early cave paintings showing the hunt are not so very different to photographing your supper in their intent. Of course it is only food, just as sex is only sex [not that this has stopped a billion dollar porn industry], so by extension we should refrain from any celebration of either?

If it's just food, to be eaten, then we could start by telling the Jews and Muslims to stop being such fussy eaters.

It seems strange that a cook should worry about what a customer does with his food. As long as the customer is paying and leaves happy then surely the work has been done? Burger King don't let you take photographs in their restaurants, but I always thought that was because they didn't want you reminding yourself that your lunch looked nothing like the picture on the overhead menu. I also can't see how it can be enforced, will customers be frisked before being seated, or ejected once they have committed the sin?

[Fat Guy]

If somebody is taking photographs unobtrusively, without flash, why should anybody else find that objectionable? Who cares what that person's motives are?

Hate to do a Paris Hilton impression - but that Asian dude with the famous New York restaurants - can't remember his name or the name of his restaurants - sorry - I only get to New York about once every 5 or 10 years and don't feel like doing a Google search now - has a point.

As mentioned above, his name is David Chang. He runs three restaurants: Momofuku Noodle Bar, Momofuku Ssam Bar and Momofuku Ko. At one of those restaurants, Momofuku Ko -- not the other two and not any other restaurant I know of anywhere -- photography is not allowed.

Momofuku Ko is the most difficult restaurant reservation in New York right now, and probably one of the two most difficult restaurant reservations (El Bulli being the other) in the world. I'm pretty handy at getting reservations at restaurants, so I've been to Momofuku Ko a few times. I'd like to be able to show you all some photos of my recent meals there, but I can't. Sorry. Those of you who won't be able to make it to Momofuku Ko will just have to settle for the older photos from before cameras were banned.

The last time I was at Momofuku Ko, a guy down the counter from me (the restaurant has just 12 seats, all at a long counter) took out a small camera and was about to photograph his food. I didn't notice it. I did notice, however, when one of the restaurant's employees told him he couldn't use the camera. It was an uncomfortable moment and an utterly inhospitable act. This guy just wanted to take some photos of his food. Who cares why? He should have been allowed to.

When did taking pictures of food - or writing about food - become more important than eating food?

This is a straw man. Since when does taking photos of something make the photos more important than the thing?

[Jason Campbell]

So, if it is really difficult to eat at this restaurant then I would imagine that the customers are a rather exclusive bunch, who probably wouldn't want to be pictured eating their supper?

Here in the UK my child's school asked for written permission before they would allow photos to be taken of the children[school trip]. I sense that the decision to ban cameras[and mobile/cell phones? A more disruptive crime than taking a photo IMHO] is motivated by some legal complication rather than the cook's opinion?

[daisy17]

who said that looking at pictures is a substitute? would you say the same thing to people taking pictures of their newborns, their parent's 40th wedding anniversay, their first christmas as a couple, the long awaited vacations to far away places?

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Perfectly said, Chufi.

It's funny, because i take photos of very few things these days, but my new niece and food are still being snapped.

And just FWIW - after years of experience - if you can't remember a meal/dish without looking at a picture - it wasn't a memorable meal/dish.  I can still remember some great stuff I had almost 40 years ago.

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I don't think anyone said this.

I'm still not sure I understand your point. Go to good restaurants and enjoy them without taking or looking at photographs? Again, not sure I get why you care. Plenty of people go to 3 star Michelin restaurants because they can afford to, or because a book or magazine or friends told them it's a hard reservation to get. They don't necessarily go because they want to have an amazing meal that moves them. At my mind-blowing dinner at Alinea we sat near an older couple who barely looked at their food. No excitement, no joy, no nothing. But they weren't taking photos, and we were. Hopefully they have better memories than I do.

Edited August 8, 2008 by daisy17 (log)

[prasantrin]

who said that looking at pictures is a substitute?

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FWIW, someone did imply that above.

I like looking at picture of food, and I sometimes take pictures, but only if it's something I feel I want to share with others. For example, when I went to Ryugin, I had not intended to take pictures, but when I saw the food, I was so delighted I wished I had someone with whom I could share that delight. I was dining alone, so the next best thing was to take some pictures and send them to my mother, whom I knew would appreciate the whimsy of the food.

Generally, however, I do find picture-taking during meals to be distracting. If someone at a table next to me does it, I notice but don't really care if it's not interrupting my meal. But if I'm dining with one or two other people for the purpose of spending time with them, and am required to wait (in order to eat or converse) while the others take pictures of everyones's food and take notes, I get a little tired of the whole thing. At those times, I tend to think, "It's just food...eat it."

That being said, I wish I had taken pictures of the pizza at Spacca Napoli, so I could show the pictures to every single owner of wood-burning oven pizza places in Winnipeg. I want them to see what real Neapolitan-style pizza should at least look like!

Edited August 8, 2008 by prasantrin (log)

[robert40]

I can still remember some great stuff I had almost 40 years ago.

That is a gift that we all don't share. Five years ago I could hear a old song on the radio and tell you where I was and doing when I heard it 25 years before.

Now sometimes I have to think twice on how to write a post on this site.

I guess the bottom line is we really never know the underlining reason why diners at the next table are taking photos. But in the end if their not disturbing others who cares?

Edited August 8, 2008 by robert40 (log)

[Chris Amirault]

I find often that a photograph captures something ineffable about a dish. Take this example of yours, robyn: lots of description about variations in texture and hue. As you wrote,

Now take a look at this picture. It's the exact same thing - just shot from a different angle. Has more of a sense of motion - and it draws you into the subject more. It's a more interesting picture.

[cakewalk]

When did the enjoyment of eating food and the photographing of food become mutually exclusive? If I do one, it means I can't do the other? I think there's something wrong with the logic here.

[johnnyd]

I see the point that there are those who take snapping their plates too far and without respect for those around them and some of those blogs should be swept into the internet rubbish heap. But nevertheless they are a scrapbook, or creative outlet for their authors so by all means, let 'em go for it.

Then there are the compulsive chefs who forbid this or that in their restaurants - a price for whatever genius got them to whatever level of greatness. By all means, let 'em go for it too.

I think all of us are here because we share a passion like Chufi's

Food is my passion, and photography to me is just another way to enjoy this passion. I like to write about food, read about food, photograph food, eat food, cook food, think about food, shop for food, look at other people's food, read what other people have to say about food. Not what everybody has to say about food is interesting, and not everybody's pictures are. There are tons of blogs out there with crappy pictures and bad writing. But there are also lots of blogs and websites with great pictures that inspire me, and beautiful writing that moves me.

I enjoy the different views we at eG share on certain foods or cooking and we're richer for it, but had the internet never been invented and all of this impossible, for me, the table would still be a temple, and the plate it's alter, and I'll photograph what interests me - conditions permitting - as long as I can.

Incidentally, I recently received a big box of slides from my aging dad. I found a few of a huge raucous feast in Brazil from back in the sixties. Thank god he'd had the foresight to snap a few back then because it's history now.

Edited August 8, 2008 by johnnyd (log)

[cdh]

Of course food is food and not artwork... eating it should be the primary concern. But I don't think most food blogging, illustrated or not, has its priorities so out of kilter that people are seeking the experience of blogging the food rather than eating it. The blogging is just a convenient way to share/brag about it (depending upon tone and content, which can be perceived differently by different viewers).

Of course, bragging is likely to annoy some people, and rightly so... But telling the world to shut up and eat it isn't going to get very far.

Edited August 8, 2008 by cdh (log)

[Kim Shook]

I can never figure out why people care what I do. It's one thing if I am snapping away like Richard Avedon and causing bridal reception blindness with my flash. But I take one discreet shot of each plate, maybe a couple of my companions and never, ever use a flash. My picture taking would never draw attention. So why would anyone care? I get pleasure from looking at those pictures later. I am an inverdant memory keeper - I love keeping a record of the things that are special in my life - photos, matchbooks, letters, etc. I enjoy this. I have not a clue why that would annoy anyone else. Excuse my sentimentality, but I picture a frail old lady looking back over the special times in her life with the assistance of these pictures that some seem to hold in such contempt.

I have this same thought when someone seems to care what I eat. Why does my friend care that I like oysters and she doesn't? Or that I don't like her favorite restaurant? Or that I like catsup on my scrambled eggs, for God's sake??? What does it take away from you when I am different from you? It's hard to express tone in a forum like this, I don't mean to rant, I am truly perplexed.

[racheld]

I snap or not, but only at home. A lot of the meditation is in the preparation, the choosing of a dish, a garnish, an angle. I love the golden light of setting down a dish of food for my family onto the dining table, and I love the fleeting moments when the dish is there and then not, as we laugh and talk and enjoy.

And I love preserving a record of the hundreds of dishes I've made for other people's lovely occasions. I don't sing or draw or do any of the lasting, worthwhile, beautiful things that would be considered art. But the enjoyment of arranging a dish in a pleasing way, of seeing the colors and the textures and the shine---that feels like art, the only one I have.

I look through my gallery of photographs on the computer, settling in sometimes in the sleepless hours, and just reflect on the times and the work and the people whose enjoyment of my offerings means most. The looking back on the moments, seeing what was missed in the flurry of the crowd or the schedule---I like that. Memories do not eclipse the actual seeing of the thing, and being able to call up the photographs and reminisce or just take in the pretty of it---why not?

And I also love a lot of the blogs which show the work of artistic hands, and those which show more love than finesse---they all have a place, and if they're beautiful only to the one who brings them into being---that's enough.

[jumanggy]

I don't sing or draw or do any of the lasting, worthwhile, beautiful things that would be considered art. But the enjoyment of arranging a dish in a pleasing way, of seeing the colors and the textures and the shine---that feels like art, the only one I have.

I was about to write a joke-- something along the lines of, "NO! Just EAT IT!!!"

But Rachel, I'm a little choked up inside! What a lovely sentiment you've written here. Keep on keepin' on. (Er, is that the expression?)

[Kim Shook]

I don't sing or draw or do any of the lasting, worthwhile, beautiful things that would be considered art. But the enjoyment of arranging a dish in a pleasing way, of seeing the colors and the textures and the shine---that feels like art, the only one I have.

I was about to write a joke-- something along the lines of, "NO! Just EAT IT!!!"

But Rachel, I'm a little choked up inside! What a lovely sentiment you've written here. Keep on keepin' on. (Er, is that the expression?)

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Me too, Mark.

Except, Miss Rachel, you misspoke. You do have another gift, an art. Your gift for language is immense and even if we cannot share in your table art, we can, though your generosity, share in this other art!