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Rogan & Company


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Went today after reschuduling the booking 3 times. Everytime I thought I had a free weekend, something came up! Always the way. I nearly changed the date again as it was Cartmel race weekend, but luckily, the races are only on Sat, Mon and Weds. So arrived and managed to park in the central square of the very picturesque village. Wandered over to near by antiques shop, very smart, lovely stuff in, saw a very nice dresser/bureau, mere snip at £18,000!! Quickly exited. Had quick drink in kings arms, then onto Rogans.

gallery_58357_5844_228028.jpg

This is situated where smart antique shop used to be, they obviously have spent a bit of cash on the place. Wine bar downstairs, with tables that you can eat at as well.

View form bar:

gallery_58357_5844_227754.jpg

gallery_58357_5844_155877.jpg

Downstairs there is the main area, plus one room of to the side with a few more tables in, plus loos. The bar is at the back of the building. Himself had a white wine, I opted for a pineapple juice. Took a seat, then was shown upstairs. This is where the restaurant is, so to speak. There is a smaller bar and small lounge area, then towards the frount, main dining area, and again to the side a smaller room with more covers. Upstairs, probably 40 covers?? I did take a pic, but it came out crap, sorry. So, food. There was 1 menu on. I don't know if this was a lunch menu, or if this was literally it. I think it was 7/7/7 choices, starters £5.25 - £6.25, mains £12 - £18.50.

I opted for Roast veal sweetbreads, compote of red onion and truffle viniagrette.

gallery_58357_5844_32761.jpg

This was really tasty, quite liked this actually!

Main, I went for Herb crusted halibut, anchovy fritter, asparagus, herb risotto.

gallery_58357_5844_31446.jpg

Again, nice, simple but tasty dish. Came with little pan of risotto.

gallery_58357_5844_252608.jpg

Himself, went for roast beef. They had beef or pork on, for £9.95. Beef was nice and rare. Came with little pan of veg. He didnt fancy any of the starters?!

For my dessert, Warm chocolate mousse, with pistachio ice cream and caramel.

gallery_58357_5844_162039.jpg

It was like a melting middle choc pud!! Very gooey in the middle, quite rich. The ice cream was spot on too. His lordship had a cherry and lemon triffle.

The food was lovely, the place really smart, it was the service which needs work. There were a few young waitresses, all wearing jeans and rogan and co polo shirts, when we commented that himselfs pudding came out on its own, we watched as his sorbet slowly melted, then 5 mins later my dessert came out, one just said "I do apologise" ie "I couldn't give a badgers ass". Why didnt they send them out together?? There was no frount of house manager or anything. Thats what it needs. Someone to oversee everything, the pacing was a bit slow. But the food was spot on. I was expecting more bistro type affair, but this place holds it own. Def worth checking out if in area. Total bill was around £60 (With 1 bottle of red minus 1 dessert as we mentioned the wait!) It's early days for it though, I for one will be going back soon!

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Ah that's a shame, worth an email surely?

But Oliver what are you doing to that poor tortured dog... it having an existential crisis?

Edited by adey73 (log)

“Do you not find that bacon, sausage, egg, chips, black pudding, beans, mushrooms, tomatoes, fried bread and a cup of tea; is a meal in itself really?” Hovis Presley.

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i though this was going to be the place in henley or has that been scrapped?

That's been scrapped. There was a third party involved and I understand that the partnership fell through for reasons beyond Rogan's control.

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We were in Cartmel when it had its opening. Having eaten at L'Enclume the night before, Mrs W blaggd her way into the opening party where a) Simon was very nice and (b) Mrs Rogan wandered past every couple of minutes shooting us poisonous looks as being out of place. As going to dreadful opening parties is stock-in-trade for both of us, and therefore something of a busmans' holiday, we escaped through a fire door before Novelli arrived to open and went to the pub next door. Where the locals spent their time complaining about how none of them had been invited and how the Rogans took the village/town for granted.

Apparently a new team, be interesting to see how SR balances his time between the two ventures. Interesting menu though.

It no longer exists, but it was lovely.

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Went today after reschuduling the booking 3 times. Everytime I thought I had a free weekend, something came up! Always the way. I nearly changed the date again as it was Cartmel race weekend, but luckily, the races are only on Sat, Mon and Weds. So arrived and managed to park in the central square of the very picturesque village. Wandered over to near by antiques shop, very smart, lovely stuff in, saw a very nice dresser/bureau, mere snip at £18,000!! Quickly exited. Had quick drink in kings arms, then onto Rogans.

gallery_58357_5844_228028.jpg

This is situated where smart antique shop used to be, they obviously have spent a bit of cash on the place. Wine bar downstairs, with tables that you can eat at as well.

View form bar:

gallery_58357_5844_227754.jpg

gallery_58357_5844_155877.jpg

Downstairs there is the main area, plus one room of to the side with a few more tables in, plus loos. The bar is at the back of the building. Himself had a white wine, I opted for a pineapple juice. Took a seat, then was shown upstairs. This is where the restaurant is, so to speak. There is a smaller bar and small lounge area, then towards the frount, main dining area, and again to the side a smaller room with more covers. Upstairs, probably 40 covers?? I did take a pic, but it came out crap, sorry. So, food. There was 1 menu on. I don't know if this was a lunch menu, or if this was literally it. I think it was 7/7/7 choices, starters £5.25 - £6.25, mains £12 - £18.50.

I opted for Roast veal sweetbreads, compote of red onion and truffle viniagrette.

gallery_58357_5844_32761.jpg

This was really tasty, quite liked this actually!

Main, I went for Herb crusted halibut, anchovy fritter, asparagus, herb risotto.

gallery_58357_5844_31446.jpg

Again, nice, simple but tasty dish. Came with little pan of risotto.

gallery_58357_5844_252608.jpg

Himself, went for roast beef. They had beef or pork on, for £9.95. Beef was nice and rare. Came with little pan of veg. He didnt fancy any of the starters?!

For my dessert, Warm chocolate mousse, with pistachio ice cream and caramel.

gallery_58357_5844_162039.jpg

It was like a melting middle choc pud!! Very gooey in the middle, quite rich. The ice cream was spot on too. His lordship had a cherry and lemon triffle.

The food was lovely, the place really smart, it was the service which needs work. There were a few young waitresses, all wearing jeans and rogan and co polo shirts, when we commented that himselfs pudding came out on its own, we watched as his sorbet slowly melted, then 5 mins later my dessert came out, one just said "I do apologise" ie "I couldn't give a badgers ass". Why didnt they send them out together?? There was no frount of house manager or anything. Thats what it needs. Someone to oversee everything, the pacing was a bit slow. But the food was spot on. I was expecting more bistro type affair, but this place holds it own. Def worth checking out if in area. Total bill was around £60 (With 1 bottle of red minus 1 dessert as we mentioned the wait!) It's early days for it though, I for one will be going back soon!

It's a shame you didn't enjoy your visit as much as you had hoped. I have been twice now and was also lucky enough to be at the opening and I think the place is fantastic!

The food is wonderful and the service is relaxed but professional and just what Cartmel needs. I think what is also nice for the village is you can go just for a drink

and I know it will be my local from now on.

I think Simon and Penny have got it just right and it knocks spots off places like The Punch Bowl and The Drunken Duck.

Good luck guys :raz:

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how was l'enclume bertie? i hear so many mixed reports.

Hmm. An interesting one. I didn't put up a review because, uhhr, I also have a very mixed reaction--I had full notes on the menu, but thats elsewhere in the country right now.

We did the full 25-courser (part of my continuing 'recovering vegetarianism'). Some of it (deconstructed cartmel pudding, surrealist tequila slammer, something involving eggs being poached in front of you) was superb. Some of it was dreadful (the 'main' which was venison with banana was, well, even thinking about it brings me out in spots. I thought I'd have trouble with the venison, but, no, just the combination), and some of it was so-so. All of which is fine. I don't expect to like everything on the menu at such an experience.

The real problem is to compare the L'Enclume experience to its peers (Fat DUck, etc). A 25-courser done with Rogan's expertise has to be about performance, the surrounding elements have to be right. And in the current venue, with the current staff, they're not. The staff are lovely, but the majority of them have such heavy accents its difficult to decipher what the dishes actually are (we only worked out the tequila slammer on viewing the menu the next day), which has to be part of the sheer delight at meeting such combinations. One of the dishes I totally misheard as 'liver' rather than 'vanilla', and my preconceptions of the mix implied led me to hate something that should have just been a bit bland (and Mrs W. loved).

The room is still more suited to a leisurely lunch than to a very special (and very expensive) evening meal. With the exception of the opening 'dehydration/rehydration' and the use of a syringe for poaching egg in a chinese soup, there was no performance associated with the presentation, something that adds to the taste, the anticipation, everything. Heck, there wasn't even someone to thank us and say 'goodnight' on our way out, which, when you've spent 300+ sovs on a meal for two, is a little insulting.

So, still mixed. We'll be back as its only ninety minutes or so from Manc, and its such a lovely village, but can it improve if Rogan is also working on the new place?

It no longer exists, but it was lovely.

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doesn't sound like it's changed much from my visit then.

i find these multicourse affairs are becoming a rod for restaurants back, they can't possibly make 25 stellar dishes and when you get say 3 in a row that aren't up to scratch it colours your view, when you could have 5 and think it's the best thing since sliced bread.

you don't win friends with salad

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how was l'enclume bertie? i hear so many mixed reports.

Hmm. An interesting one. I didn't put up a review because, uhhr, I also have a very mixed reaction--I had full notes on the menu, but thats elsewhere in the country right now.

We did the full 25-courser (part of my continuing 'recovering vegetarianism'). Some of it (deconstructed cartmel pudding, surrealist tequila slammer, something involving eggs being poached in front of you) was superb. Some of it was dreadful (the 'main' which was venison with banana was, well, even thinking about it brings me out in spots. I thought I'd have trouble with the venison, but, no, just the combination), and some of it was so-so. All of which is fine. I don't expect to like everything on the menu at such an experience.

The real problem is to compare the L'Enclume experience to its peers (Fat DUck, etc). A 25-courser done with Rogan's expertise has to be about performance, the surrounding elements have to be right. And in the current venue, with the current staff, they're not. The staff are lovely, but the majority of them have such heavy accents its difficult to decipher what the dishes actually are (we only worked out the tequila slammer on viewing the menu the next day), which has to be part of the sheer delight at meeting such combinations. One of the dishes I totally misheard as 'liver' rather than 'vanilla', and my preconceptions of the mix implied led me to hate something that should have just been a bit bland (and Mrs W. loved).

The room is still more suited to a leisurely lunch than to a very special (and very expensive) evening meal. With the exception of the opening 'dehydration/rehydration' and the use of a syringe for poaching egg in a chinese soup, there was no performance associated with the presentation, something that adds to the taste, the anticipation, everything. Heck, there wasn't even someone to thank us and say 'goodnight' on our way out, which, when you've spent 300+ sovs on a meal for two, is a little insulting.

So, still mixed. We'll be back as its only ninety minutes or so from Manc, and its such a lovely village, but can it improve if Rogan is also working on the new place?

Back to the original post........my understanding is that Simon has a new team in at Rogan & Co and therefore he is still at the helm at L'Enclume and 100% committed to it.

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It reminds me of a couple of albums I own, if they just got rid of track 3, 5 and 11, it would have been perfect. I saw that they have taken the old chairs from L'Enclume and put them into Rogans, and stripped the restaurant down so no table cloths, modern wooden seats (that don't look too comfy if I was going to be there for 6 hours). I walked past whilst I was there and noticed some people dining. I thought they were stopping lunch there? Unless they were honoring bookings?

When I went, about a year ago, they were still doing ALC, so ended up with 5 courses with amuses, that was spot on (and cheaper :wink: ) But asked for a G&T and got a pint of lager :wacko:

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It's a shame you didn't enjoy your visit as much as you had hoped. I have been twice now and was also lucky enough to be at the opening and I think the place is fantastic!

The food is wonderful and the service is relaxed but professional and just what Cartmel needs. I think what is also nice for the village is you can go just for a drink

and I know it will be my local from now on.

I think Simon and Penny have got it just right and it knocks spots off places like The Punch Bowl and The Drunken Duck.

Good luck guys  :raz:

Interesting you should compare it to the Drunken Duck/Punch Bowl. I find both way to £££££ for what you get, espcially the Drunken Duck. I am always a bit confused by them. Are they gastro pubs, restaurants, pub, bar, hotel, restaurant with rooms?? I prefer the Punchbowl of the two. Rogans is more a restaurant, its more focused. I look forward to returning there.

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It's a shame you didn't enjoy your visit as much as you had hoped. I have been twice now and was also lucky enough to be at the opening and I think the place is fantastic!

The food is wonderful and the service is relaxed but professional and just what Cartmel needs. I think what is also nice for the village is you can go just for a drink

and I know it will be my local from now on.

I think Simon and Penny have got it just right and it knocks spots off places like The Punch Bowl and The Drunken Duck.

Good luck guys   :raz:

Interesting you should compare it to the Drunken Duck/Punch Bowl. I find both way to £££££ for what you get, espcially the Drunken Duck. I am always a bit confused by them. Are they gastro pubs, restaurants, pub, bar, hotel, restaurant with rooms?? I prefer the Punchbowl of the two. Rogans is more a restaurant, its more focused. I look forward to returning there.

I suppose my comparison only relates to what else is in the local area, as really you can't put them in the same league, but I know which of the 3 I won't be visiting again. I was at Rogan's on Sunday night and it was suprising to see how many non diners where downstairs which gave the place a great atmosphere equal to any city centre wine bar.

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It's a shame you didn't enjoy your visit as much as you had hoped. I have been twice now and was also lucky enough to be at the opening and I think the place is fantastic!

The food is wonderful and the service is relaxed but professional and just what Cartmel needs. I think what is also nice for the village is you can go just for a drink

and I know it will be my local from now on.

I think Simon and Penny have got it just right and it knocks spots off places like The Punch Bowl and The Drunken Duck.

Good luck guys   :raz:

Interesting you should compare it to the Drunken Duck/Punch Bowl. I find both way to £££££ for what you get, espcially the Drunken Duck. I am always a bit confused by them. Are they gastro pubs, restaurants, pub, bar, hotel, restaurant with rooms?? I prefer the Punchbowl of the two. Rogans is more a restaurant, its more focused. I look forward to returning there.

I would agree with your thgoughts on the Duck. We ate there recently and had quite miniscule portions. First a black pudding salad with a poached egg - tasted great but only two minute cubes of black pudding. It is hardly an expensive ingredient - especially in the lakes. Next lamb rump and confit, the advertised vegtables were artistic smears on the plate.

Two courses into a meal and I am still hungry. I filled up on a shared cheese plate and shared desert. At £86 for two (including the non-drinking driver) I felt it was pretty steep - the cooking was good but the portion sizes are a rip off. The next night at he Punchbowl was far better value.

Looks like Rogan & Company will be on the list for the next visit.

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I'm down in the Lakes in a couple of weeks and will probably squeeze in all three of Rogan & Company, Drunken Duck and Punchbowl. I haven't had a meal in the dining room at the DD for maybe three years, when it was pretty good, so PhilD's report doesn't make it sound too promising - I do like their beers, so there might well be a case for just taking the bar menu and sinking pints instead... Very much looking forward to Rogan & Co though.

PS

Edinburgh

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What about the cafe at Lakeland?

Never really hear it mentioned on here and I know it really is purely a cafe (and in the middle of a shopping centre!) but simple food can still be great and the chef, Steven Doherty, is ex-Le Gavroche and sits as a judge on everything from the Gordon Ramsay Scolarship to the Roux Scholarship (and of course the Northern Hospitality Awards...).

The Lakeland Cafe

Any reports at all as to whether it's worth a drop-in if one is in the vicinity?

Cheers

Thom

Edited by thom (log)

It's all true... I admit to being the MD of Holden Media, organisers of the Northern Restaurant and Bar exhibition, the Northern Hospitality Awards and other Northern based events too numerous to mention.

I don't post here as frequently as I once did, but to hear me regularly rambling on about bollocks - much of it food and restaurant-related - in a bite-size fashion then add me on twitter as "thomhetheringto".

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doesn't sound like it's changed much from my visit then.

i find these multicourse affairs are becoming a rod for restaurants back, they can't possibly make 25 stellar dishes and when you get say 3 in a row that aren't up to scratch it colours your view, when you could have 5 and think it's the best thing since sliced bread.

my own visit there produced the same reaction the hits diluted with poorer dishes lingering in the mind longer even the poor bread! and following a recent trip to el poblet where i had a similar menu in length it made me reconsider my own menus to which ive cut down the number of courses to make the experience more fluid and help consistency.in a sense it reminds me of the petit four,while dining at a 1star awhile ago i was given 15 petit fours with 3/4 actually any good the rest stale or bland or ill thought of but yes they looked impressive!

though el poblet had 20 chefs they dont all have dacostas taste buds or skill, or i should imagine rogans skill level,when i eat out i love the theatre of it and the suprise element though after 20 courses im sure we become too weary and over exposed to more tastes textures and techniques in one sitting,or am i alone in this thought? and the service plays a huge part in this scene of multi course dining for your visit, a lot more than serving dishes from the roof or the bathroom yes ive seen it :biggrin: it makes all the difference to be looked after and not talked down to or lectured how to eat all your courses, and not to be bid good night is a poor show after spending £300

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doesn't sound like it's changed much from my visit then.

i find these multicourse affairs are becoming a rod for restaurants back, they can't possibly make 25 stellar dishes and when you get say 3 in a row that aren't up to scratch it colours your view, when you could have 5 and think it's the best thing since sliced bread.

my own visit there produced the same reaction the hits diluted with poorer dishes lingering in the mind longer even the poor bread! and following a recent trip to el poblet where i had a similar menu in length it made me reconsider my own menus to which ive cut down the number of courses to make the experience more fluid and help consistency.in a sense it reminds me of the petit four,while dining at a 1star awhile ago i was given 15 petit fours with 3/4 actually any good the rest stale or bland or ill thought of but yes they looked impressive!

though el poblet had 20 chefs they dont all have dacostas taste buds or skill, or i should imagine rogans skill level,when i eat out i love the theatre of it and the suprise element though after 20 courses im sure we become too weary and over exposed to more tastes textures and techniques in one sitting,or am i alone in this thought? and the service plays a huge part in this scene of multi course dining for your visit, a lot more than serving dishes from the roof or the bathroom yes ive seen it :biggrin: it makes all the difference to be looked after and not talked down to or lectured how to eat all your courses, and not to be bid good night is a poor show after spending £300

Marc - we had a 30ish course menu at the El Bulli Hotel which worked well. It started with a mass of small tasting dishes that came quite quickly, followed by 7 or 8 fuller sized dishes, then 4 or 5 deserts in decreasing size. It all worked really well, the rush of surprises at the start balanced by good pacing in the middle with time to savour the more complex dishes. I also think a lot of the initial dishes can be prepared in advance and therefore the chefs can concentrate on the more complex dishes during service.

However, it would have been a little better if we understood the pacing of the meal as we were fearful the early pace would keep up and the whole meal would be over in 45 mins - it actually took closer to 4 hours.

A couple of days before we had eaten anorther multi course meal at Tragabuches in Ronda, this one hadn't workes as well because the pacing was wrong.

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What about the cafe at Lakeland?

Never really hear it mentioned on here and I know it really is purely a cafe (and in the middle of a shopping centre!) but simple food can still be great and the chef, Steven Doherty, is ex-Le Gavroche and sits as a judge on everything from the Gordon Ramsay Scolarship to the Roux Scholarship (and of course the Northern Hospitality Awards...).

The Lakeland Cafe

Any reports at all as to whether it's worth a drop-in if one is in the vicinity?

Cheers

Thom

I have been once, prob about a year and a half ago. We were taking some friends kids out for the day around the lakes. I can't remember much about the menu or anything, think we just had a sarnie each. Its on the top floor of the Lakeland shop, very nice it is too. We were given a buzzer that would tell us when our table would be ready, which was a good idea (So we could carry on buying stuff from downstairs they hoped). There are TV screens above the urinals. Funny what you remember. It didnt strike me as a 'destination'. But Windermere and Bo'Ness are ill served, so it is a good place for lunch. There's Jerichos in Windermere as well, which is alright.

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doesn't sound like it's changed much from my visit then.

i find these multicourse affairs are becoming a rod for restaurants back, they can't possibly make 25 stellar dishes and when you get say 3 in a row that aren't up to scratch it colours your view, when you could have 5 and think it's the best thing since sliced bread.

my own visit there produced the same reaction the hits diluted with poorer dishes lingering in the mind longer even the poor bread! and following a recent trip to el poblet where i had a similar menu in length it made me reconsider my own menus to which ive cut down the number of courses to make the experience more fluid and help consistency.in a sense it reminds me of the petit four,while dining at a 1star awhile ago i was given 15 petit fours with 3/4 actually any good the rest stale or bland or ill thought of but yes they looked impressive!

though el poblet had 20 chefs they dont all have dacostas taste buds or skill, or i should imagine rogans skill level,when i eat out i love the theatre of it and the suprise element though after 20 courses im sure we become too weary and over exposed to more tastes textures and techniques in one sitting,or am i alone in this thought? and the service plays a huge part in this scene of multi course dining for your visit, a lot more than serving dishes from the roof or the bathroom yes ive seen it :biggrin: it makes all the difference to be looked after and not talked down to or lectured how to eat all your courses, and not to be bid good night is a poor show after spending £300

Marc - we had a 30ish course menu at the El Bulli Hotel which worked well. It started with a mass of small tasting dishes that came quite quickly, followed by 7 or 8 fuller sized dishes, then 4 or 5 deserts in decreasing size. It all worked really well, the rush of surprises at the start balanced by good pacing in the middle with time to savour the more complex dishes. I also think a lot of the initial dishes can be prepared in advance and therefore the chefs can concentrate on the more complex dishes during service.

However, it would have been a little better if we understood the pacing of the meal as we were fearful the early pace would keep up and the whole meal would be over in 45 mins - it actually took closer to 4 hours.

A couple of days before we had eaten anorther multi course meal at Tragabuches in Ronda, this one hadn't workes as well because the pacing was wrong.

yes i know the feeling at bulli last year the pace started very fast with little interaction with the service yet i struggled with a couple of courses to eat them never mind enjoy but yes i appreciate your point,but is this because it is el bulli and our mental approach is very different in such as this has taken me 5 years to aquire a table and ive travelled by donkey and plane,train and automobile to arrive at this point so id better enjoy the experience of every detail?

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Funny thing, multi course menus. They can leave you very excited and talking about them for years to come, or else a big disapointment, when you feel that you didn't get it, or they didn't get you.

We thought our meal at Tragabuche was outsanding 2 years ago, but we went for the tasting menu at Duomo in Sicily and we left exceptionally underwelmed. Interestingly enough both these restaurants took bloody long drives to get to, so both got the same build up of anticipation, but had two very diferent reactions.

Still hasn't stopped me from being a sucker for a tasting menu.......

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Funny thing, multi course menus. They can leave you very excited and talking about them for years to come, or else a big disapointment, when you feel that you didn't get it, or they didn't get you.

We thought our meal at Tragabuche was outsanding 2 years ago, but we went for the tasting menu at Duomo in Sicily and we left exceptionally underwelmed. Interestingly enough both these restaurants took bloody long drives to get to, so both got the same build up of anticipation, but had two very diferent reactions.

Still hasn't stopped me from being a sucker for a tasting menu.......

i love and usually always take the tasting menu in a good restaurant for me it allows more exposure to the food in a single visit, after reading previous comments i was curious to ask the question how many courses is too many? or again is this too subjective to decide

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I'll be at Rogan & Co in about an hour, so I'll be able to see what it is like for myself :smile:

With regards to L'Enclume, is anyone in a position to say whether it is worth paying almost double for the Underground over the Tour? I think the former is around 25 courses and the latter 15. Can someone recommend which would be best?

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I'll be at Rogan & Co in about an hour, so I'll be able to see what it is like for myself  :smile:

With regards to L'Enclume, is anyone in a position to say whether it is worth paying almost double for the Underground over the Tour? I think the former is around 25 courses and the latter 15. Can someone recommend which would be best?

If you've never been ,start with the introduction @ 11 courses,if you enjoy it give the place another go and have tour .I personally think people with no understanding of modern food go straight for the"BIGGEST" tasting menu leaving themselves open for off the wall dishes/letting the chef experiment on you etc.As for thick accents from waiters thats probably our fault in the UK for not accepting that being a waiter is a career ,so these jobs are filled by foreigners who will work long hours for little money.Slagging off a fellow north west chef is pretty low too..........sigh rant over! :smile:

Never trust a skinny Chef

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