Chicken Stock

[scubadoo97]

I'm a pressure cooker devote. 1.5 hrs and bones crumble and stock gels like jello

[IrishJersey]

OP here; just wanted to say quick thank you to those who chimed in! Very helpful and I'll look over this thread more in detail as I have few questions to several of you already.

Will try to post more in detail and get started on my first chicken stock before turkey day

[harrysnapperorgans]

Most weeks I roast a whole chicken. The legs and thighs and wings we eat as a roast dinner. Breasts become sandwiches or a curry. I keep all the bones, break them up a bit and put in a pot with carrot, celery, unpeeled onion, few cloves of garlic, pinch of salt and cover. simmer for as long as like. I usually do about 3 hours.

[IrishJersey]

Hey IrishJersey,

How are you preparing the whole chicken?

Are you looking to make a white chicken stock or a dark chicken stock?

 

There are several ways I make chicken stock depending on what i have to work with and the desired outcome.

First couple of times, i just roasted the chicken with olive oil, salt and pepper rubbed over the bird. I like to have both, but not fussy at this time since my goal is to make a solid simple stock. 

[radtek]

Hello all-

 

Normally I buy Minors bases as it saves time but the price and shipping has become ridiculous. Been working on my stock skills with some small success.

 

Consider Mark Bittman's "How to Cook Everything" and the techniques described therein.

 

Particularly, Bittman has 3 types of chicken stock: quckest, full-flavored and a darker, richer chicken stock. The first two concern me the most.

 

For the "quickest" stock (40-60 min) whole cuts are prefered and the "full-flavored" (180+ min) are raw/cooked bones and/or chicken parts. My primary question is can I take the cooked bones from the first after stripping the meat away and add the bones with fresh chicken parts/bones for a second, separate "full flavored" stock?

 

 

 

[Martin Fisher]

Why not? I've done that for years.

[Shalmanese]

Using the spent bones of a primary stock alone is called Remouillage (second stock). Using spent bones in combination fresh bones would get you something in between a primary and secondary stock. Personally, I wouldn't do it purely because it increases the amount of water required to cover the bones. I like to make my stocks with as little water as possible so as to avoid reducing them down later.

Personally, the only time I would make a quick stock is if I need it immediately for a dish I'm cooking right now. Making a stock properly requires the exact same amount of active time as making a quick stock, just more inactive time simmering on the stove. If you really want it quicker, I'd rather invest in a pressure cooker than take shortcuts on the stove.

[scubadoo97]

I'm a big believer in using a pressure cooker for stock

[radtek]

Ah. Any suggestions on pressure cooker technique? I believe JC suggests a hybrid technique of 15 min in the PC with a quick release and then simmering for another hour.

 

I got #5 of leg-quarters for $0.97/lb and hope to make about 4 quarts of stock. Don't have a lot to do anyway.

[btbyrd]

I advise against a rapid release when making stock, as this can cause intense, spontaneous boiling that can cloud your stock. I'd cook for 1.5 hours in the PC with a slow release. I don't understand the rationale for the hybrid technique as you describe it. If you were going to do a hybrid technique, I'd cook with chicken only for 90 minutes, slow release, and then add aromatics and simmer for 30-45 minutes. That's how I do it.

[Dave W]

I'm a big believer in using a pressure cooker for stock

It's really just stupid how much easier it is in a PC. I can't believe I made open pot subboiling pots of stock for so many years.

[radtek]

I advise against a rapid release when making stock, as this can cause intense, spontaneous boiling that can cloud your stock. I'd cook for 1.5 hours in the PC with a slow release. I don't understand the rationale for the hybrid technique as you describe it. If you were going to do a hybrid technique, I'd cook with chicken only for 90 minutes, slow release, and then add aromatics and simmer for 30-45 minutes. That's how I do it.

 

JC states that there is a "pressure-cooker taste" which I equate to "canned" and not sure if  I've actually witnessed this effect. However, I rely heavily on my pressure cooker. 

 

Thirdly, with a quick stock one can harvest the meat. I'm assuming that with a proper 3-4 hour stock the meat will be spent and only fit for the trash can. I've never made a stock from cuts only from raw or cooked bones and hate any sort of waste in the kitchen. 

[patrickamory]

Interesting… never heard of the pressure cooker taste problem but maybe I should give it an A-B.

 

Yes with a 3-4 hour stock the meat is spent

[radtek]

Allright Thanks! One last quick question and we can put this one to rest unless anyone wants to add something...

 

Some say you can press the solids. Some say don't.

 

To press or not to press?

[btbyrd]

With a quick stock one can harvest the meat. I'm assuming that with a proper 3-4 hour stock the meat will be spent and only fit for the trash can. I've never made a stock from cuts only from raw or cooked bones and hate any sort of waste in the kitchen. 

 

It depends on your definition of "waste." If you pressure cook or simmer for long enough, all of the flavor in the meat will have been transferred to the broth. If you don't do that, you may be able to save some meat, but it won't be full-flavored and neither will your broth. That's sort of a compromise. Some flavor in the chicken was "wasted" in the broth; some flavor of the broth was "wasted" because it remains in the chicken. The sad truth is that most of the flavor in stock comes from meat, not bones. Bones contribute collagen but not a lot of flavor. If you're only using bones (and they've been thoroughly picked) then your stock isn't going to have nearly as much flavor as it would if you used wings or meaty carcasses. If you're going to use bones only, I'd try adding a couple pounds of ground chicken (browned up in the base of your pan) to the bones to up the meaty flavor.

[KennethT]

Allright Thanks! One last quick question and we can put this one to rest unless anyone wants to add something...

 

Some say you can press the solids. Some say don't.

 

To press or not to press?

That is the question - and the answer depends on what result you want. Pressing will give more yield, but will most likely make your stock cloudy. A PC stock with slow release is typically crystal clear.

[radtek]

Great replies! 

 

I chopped up the leg quarters and have it on the stove now. Initially I was a little dismayed at how murky the liquid looked but once scumming progressed it is amazing how quickly it clears up. I've never bothered to skim any stock. Veg is in too and just monitoring for the next 3-4 hours I guess. 

 

Maybe I could press the solids separately and reduce that portion. Probably not enough to make it worthwhile but this time I want something a bit more polished for this batch.

[cyalexa]

I've not seen anyone mention a slow oven overnight. After roasting or braising chicken I put whatever is going into the stock/broth in a heavy pot (sometimes the one used to cook the chicken - saves on dishes!). Add water to barely cover, bring to just under a simmer on the cook top and put in a 225F oven overnight. It generally does not result in a large volume of liquid but I roast chicken frequently so there are many small containers in my freezer. 

Edited March 26, 2015 by cyalexa (log)

[NEPolarbear]

Agree with the others concerning using a pressure cooker.

Making more an efficient quality concentrated stock than ever.

 

Roughly 1 hr on high pressure and slow / natural release.

[nickrey]

To my mind gentle is best. I wouldn't press the stock nor would I pour it, preferring instead to use a ladle to get the clear stock from amongst the bones. If you use the slow release method, you'll wind up with a clear stock.

[dcarch]

I am not interested in clear broth. The cloudier, the better, more taste, more nutrition. 

 

As a matter of fact, I modified my PC to go higher pressure ( I will not give details, because it can be dangerous if you don't know about this kind of work).

 

At higher pressure, even part of the bones get very soft to chew on (very tasty). It is my superstition that bones are good for health.

 

dcarch

[radtek]

My yield was 7 qt of clear stock. I'm reducing 3 qt now.

 

Wondered about the pour. So before chilling in the sink a salad plate was slipped in to hold the solids down. After an overnight in the fridge the fat was removed and the stock was poured slowly and gently through a cheesecloth lined sieve. All the while I kept the plate lightly in place with a ladle to keep the solids from shifting. Seemed to work well and hardly anything but a few small chunks ended up in the sieve.

 

I will have to try the ladle out method at some point as much stock will be made.

[radtek]

LOL Minors (soupbase.com) sent me an urgent email saying I qualified for $4.99 shipping on my order. Too late!! Ya'll done F'd up with your high dollar shipping and handling as evidenced by the original $17... am sure I'd have paid that full amount if the order had been completed.

 

 

Anyway, I made a second batch from chicken necks and feet (paws) that has turned out awesomely. And the first batch ended up with 7qt of stock being boiled down to 1qt which was then placed into icecube trays and frozen. Works very well.

 

Thanks guys for the advice. I'll be doing smaller batches in the PC most likely from now on. Soupbase.com just lost a customer.

[harrysnapperorgans]

Interesting thread. I didn't realise that you can make a second batch of stock from the same bones! I'll be trying that I tend to use the bones of a roast chicken, carrot/celery/onion/peppercorns/bay leaf. Sometimes a little sprig of rosemary or thyme towards the end.

I used to chuck in all kinds of varied vegetables, but I've decided I like the mirepoix plain and simple.  

I use very little salt, in case I reduce the stock in a future sauce, learned that the hard way . . .  :-)

[kayb]

Didn't realize there were so many variations in making stock. I put my roasted chicken carcass, generally with wings, which no one seems to want to eat, in the pot, add a quartered onion and a couple of carrots, some salt and pepper, bring to a boil and let it simmer until I need that spot on the stove or I have to leave, anywhere from 1.5 hours to 4 hours. I prefer to cool it all together, chill it in the pot, then de-fat. I do it in my pot with the basket, so the solids go in the basket and can just be lifted out, and then I can ladle the cold stock into freezer containers. I use the square ones -- they stack better in the freezer. If I get close to running out of stock....it's time to roast another chicken.

 

While we're on the stock question -- can I make beef stock from short rib bones after I've cooked the short ribs? seems to me that it should work, but there's little meat left in that case. Should I add maybe some round steak or something?