Chartreuse VEP

[Alchemist]

Are the subtlies of the botanicals going to degrade if it's not kept all cellar temp?

[johnder]

The only place I know in NYC that has VEP for service is Gramercy Tavern. They keep it on the top shelf of the back bar. I would assume it would be fine to keep out, but if you want to play safe you could put a vacuum top on it and pump the air out if you don't use it that often.

[notahumanissue]

The only place I know in NYC that has VEP for service is Gramercy Tavern.  They keep it on the top shelf of the back bar.    I would assume it would be fine to keep out, but if you want to play safe you could put a vacuum top on it and pump the air out if you don't use it that often.

←

I'm pretty sure every Keith McNally place has VEP -- I've seen it at Balthazar, Morandi, and Pastis, but can't really say about Schillers. They just leave it on a shelf.

[KD1191]

Does anyone know the 'code' for determining the age of VEP? A trusted bartender was telling me it has something to do with taking the number printed on the back of the bottle and adding (and/or subtracting) numbers significant to the years of the founding of the Monastery or the gifting of the recipe or something to that effect, but I've since forgotten the specifics. My bottle of VEP Yellow (brought back from France, not imported, if that matters) has "J.1154" on the back, and says that it was bottled in 2007. Any idea how old the stuff inside actually is?

Edited September 13, 2009 by KD1191 (log)

[KatieLoeb]

I think most spirits at that proof level and sugar content are shelf stable. But I think Johnder is correct. It certainly can't hurt it to take the extra care with it and pump out the air and refrigerate it. What's the worst that could happen? It'd already be colder than room temp?

[Kent Wang]

I think this is one of those spirits some people will order straight. Wouldn't it be awkward to serve it at refrigerator temperature?

[KatieLoeb]

I suppose. At a restaurant you could take it out at the start of the shift and then refrigerate at the end of the night. At home I suppose you could take it out before your guests arrive if you are offering it up...

[slkinsey]

Refrigeration is not likely to make a meaningful difference anyway. The best thing to do, if oxidation is a major concern, would be to get one of those wine-saver deals and evacuate the headspace (or fill it with a neutral gas, depending on which kind you were using).

[thirtyoneknots]

Refrigeration is not likely to make a meaningful difference anyway. The best thing to do, if oxidation is a major concern, would be to get one of those wine-saver deals and evacuate the headspace (or fill it with a neutral gas, depending on which kind you were using).

It may or may not apply in the same way to spirits, but I have noted time and again that temperature control helps preserve opened wine far more than any other measure. We've even had completely open bottles, no stopper of any kind (accidentally) left in the WineKeeper overnight, even longer, and because they were being kept at 'cellar temperature' the contents were not noticeably affected. Stoppered bottles left out at actual room temperature however, are rarely worth drinking past the second day.

[slkinsey]

Yes, but wine is not 54% alcohol.

[thirtyoneknots]

Yes, but wine is not 54% alcohol.

Of course it isn't, but what I'm curious about is how different the oxidative processes are between wine and spirits. Clearly spirits do in fact deteriorate from exposure to the atmosphere; is this process related to the way in which wine deteriorates? It would seem logical that it is, with the higher % alcohol merely retarding the process to where loss of flavor is measured in months or years rather than hours or days. I mean the difference in longevity between a 13% abv table wine and a 20% abv fortified wine such as a Tawny Port is quite significant, and of course 40% abv brandy even more so. But in the end these will all lose something of their flavor when exposed to air...is it not reasonable to assume that temperature would also play a part going up the abv scale?

[bostonapothecary]

i don't think alcohol retards oxidation. but temperature probably slows the reactions to some degree.

i think the difference lies in a term called the "oxidation reduction potential". the ORP is the potential for a solution to be changed by oxygen. many distilled spirits and some dessert wines are fully oxidized and have nearly no more potential to oxidize and some aren't. sauternes probably need to be protected from lactobacteria in fridges and not oxygen. aromatized products are different and probably have some potential to oxidize. i haven't seen too much writing on the topic but i think oxydation produces terpenes in many common flavors like oranges, and mint. a lot of products we drink use the "terpeneless" oils of those flavors. i think the oils are oxidized then what "reduces" is separated. pretty sure fernet uses terpeneless mint oil.

if i understand the concept i think it could be said that lemon juice and lime juice have a very high oxidation reduction potential and that is why they taste and smell to drastically different after a day.

[Wild Bill Turkey]

Just had my first glass of the VEP (green) as a digestif after a great meal at Boulevard in San Francisco. I may have to sell my truck and buy a bottle of this...

Edited September 16, 2009 by Wild Bill Turkey (log)