slkinsey
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Posts posted by slkinsey
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Hobbes, I don't think you offended anyone. I think what some are saying is that you have brought up many interesting issues with your comments that are tangentially related to the topic of this thread and which might deserve their own thread wherein they might be more fully discussed.
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hobbes, this sounds like the good topic for a new thread.
Yea... This thread is for bashing the Cheesecake Factory and metadiscussion about whether some people are telling other people about what or whether they should post.
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Some of the posters here seem to mistake the stating of an opinion with a "sense of superiority". On eG, IMO, charges of the latter seem to come most often from those unable to offer a cogent defense of the former.
[sUPERIOR TONE OF VOICE]I'm sorry, but your entire line of reasoning is simply beneath me.[/sUPERIOR TONE OF VOICE]
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I have always made chili oil with dried chilis, so you may want to dry yours before you do it. Just plop a bunch of minced dried chilis into the oil of your choice (something fairly neutral is good, although I have done using unfiltered Sicilian evoo with great results) and heat slightly. After steeping for a little while (you can test the oil to see how well it has infused), pour off most of the oil into a bottle and keep in the refrigerator. The remaining chili sludge and oil makes a nice condiment all by itself, but doesn't seem to last as long.
One thing you can do with fresh chilis is make chili vinegar. Nothing beats it with greens.
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I have a fur jockstrap. In fact I bought three of them in Alaska. On our honeymoon. So there.
Ellen? Backup? Commentary? Anything????
Is the fur on the inside or the outside?
Are those crickets I hear?
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Right... That's what I figured -- that they cross check the name, address, and credit card info.
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Fellas, have any of you *worn* a thong?
I've got pretty much everyone beat on this one: I once had to do a show in which my costume consisted of a muslin loincloth and... well, that's it. Muslin. Loin. Cloth.
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I hesitate to ask this, but how do they know you are you? I mean, couldn't you create a bunch of Hotmail email addresses or Sneakemail forwarding addresses and take the $50 discount multiple times?
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Yeah, I know; they're like baloney in dog form. It's mostly the thought of a cold hot dog that's making me shudder...
Oh... then you probably wouldn't like pickled hot dogs. Too bad. They're tasty...
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Not in my opinion, it isn't... and I have some pretty good arguments on my side (what with being a musician and all). But this really isn't the time and certainly not a forum for such a discussion.
i, too, am a musician and all. and Pearl Jam RULES!!!!!!
BALDERDASH! I brand you a "musician" -- that's right, with quotes around the word -- you... you... overpackaged teen-angst Seattle "grunge" music liker!
OK... gotta go to a rehearsal.
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There is good to be said for chain restaurant food, if you don't compare them to something totally out of their league. They are good when they stand alone, and if you spend all your time comparing it to something else, just go eat the thing you're comparing it to, for heaven's sake, if it bothers you that much.
I think that is exactly what most people are saying -- that they would choose to go eat something else. But, you know, as much as I think you have every "right" to wax rhapsodic about the Olive Garden's food, I think Bux has just as much "right" to explain why he thinks it's crap. And neither one of you should get your feelings hurt over it.
That, to me, seems to be the big issue. You seem to be getting your feelings hurt that other people don't agree with your choices and evaluations. Or at the very least, you seem to be getting upset about it. Which is not to say that you are unique in this reaction or that such a reaction is entirely unavoidable.
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i wasn't suggesting that opera was "fine" and Pearl Jam was the music equivalent of junkfood.
OK, now see... I would totally suggest that. Heck, I'd outright say it. Pearl Jam is the musical equivalent of a really good guy at Burritoville as compared to Rossini who, in addition to being a cook of some repute himself, is more the musical equivalent of Thomas Keller.
clearly a subjective opinion. just as with food and restaurants.
Not in my opinion, it isn't... and I have some pretty good arguments on my side (what with being a musician and all). But this really isn't the time and certainly not a forum for such a discussion.
While I don't care for Pearl Jam (maybe I should have used an example of a group I actually like, like Tower of Power), I do love burritos. And both have their place in my world.
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i wasn't suggesting that opera was "fine" and Pearl Jam was the music equivalent of junkfood.
OK, now see... I would totally suggest that. Heck, I'd outright say it. Pearl Jam is the musical equivalent of a really good guy at Burritoville as compared to Rossini who, in addition to being a cook of some repute himself, is more the musical equivalent of Thomas Keller.
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I do care about what I eat. I eat what I'm in the mood for. If I didn't care, I would eat something I don't want, or don't like. Usually, your body tells you what your body wants or needs in the form of cravings, and I listen to that. If that means having tuna sandwiches for lunch, I'm not going to deny it and say no, I have to mix up something creative instead, and in the end I'm still craving the tuna sandwich.
A few things before I sign off:
- I don't think anyone is suggesing that your contributions are inappropriate or unappreciated.
- Presumably you have an interest in eating a good tuna sandwich. Furthermore, presumably you wouldn't feel like talking about the tuna sandwich served at Tuna Hut where you go every so often when you want a tuna sandwich if it was mediocre. If it was good or had other properties worth talking about, then why not talk about it? I don't think anyone would knowingly make you feel like you shouldn't.
I have to say that I'm with Soba on this one. I think it is largely a case of people inferring slights where they are not implied.
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What I have a problem with, are condecending posts that basically tell people that if your tastes or knowledge are not up to a certain level than you have no business commenting on this board.
Please be so kind as to point one out.
Before you go digging, I would say that it does not seem entirely appropriate for someone without a strong interest in quality food and cooking to comment on a board which is dedicated to those same subjects.
It seems like it's suggested here, unless I'm misinterpreting it.
Perhaps I should clarify. I do not think that a well-made hamburger or tuna sandwich is incongruous with "quality food and cooking." I guess what I am saying is that it seems a little silly for someone who really doesn't care that much about the food they eat to post to a discussion board that caters to people who care greatly about the food they eat.
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The point is, who are you or anyone else to judge the level or quality of another's interest in food and appropriateness of commenting on this board?
i'm still looking for examples of where someone suggested anything like this.
I don't think you'll find any. What you will find are many examples of people bristling because they think they are being "talked down to" or that their choices are being denigrated by people who express opinions or preferences contrary to their own.
I don't think there is anything wrong with talking about chain restaurants. And I can imagine circumstances in which I might eat at one -- perhaps even regularly. But, to me, the crux of the matter is this: I don't generally hear anyone arguing that the food served in these places is atually good. There are plenty of other reasons people may go to them (convenience, children, live in suburban Ohio and there are no other choices, whatever) -- but none of these reasons has to do with the high quality of the food. And, for me personally, I don't think there is a lot of value in of talking about food that isn't very good. This is not necessarily an issue of "high food" versus "middle food" versus "low food" because most everyone here admires a well-made hamburger as much as the next person, if not more. It is simply an issue of the food at Chili's et al. not being exceptional in any way.
OK... maybe you can go to Bennigan's and get a perfectly reasonable chicken sandwich. Cool! I'm sure you can, and who doesn't like a chicken sandwich every so often? But I don't think anyone would describe Bennigan's chicken sandwich as an example of a really first-rate chicken sandwich, or that it would be worth the trip out to Bennigan's to sample their exceptional chicken sandwich. So, while I don't think there is anything wrong about popping out to Bennigan's for a chicken sandwich every so often, I don't think there's a great deal of value in talking about their acceptable but otherwise mediocre example. That said, I don't think people who eat and appreciate the chicken sandwich for what it is should feel that "chicken sandwich afficionados" who don't think the Bennigan's chicken sandwich is any great shakes are condescending to them. And, really, I have yet to hear one person say that a chain restaurant makes a really great... well... anything. At least McDonald's makes really great frites (or used to, anyway).
Not that any of the above should be construed as a call to censor or limit discussion here about any kind of food or eating establishment. I think people should talk about whatever they want to talk about, so long as it is around the topic of food (not that anyone is asking my opinion or should care either way). I just don't see the point of talking about food that everyone seems to agree is so-so at best. I'd rather talk about good food. I think this feeling is shared by the majority of posters here, and so it is perhaps possible that a lack of enthusiasm for talking about these things makes people think they are being told that their "level or quality of interest in food is not appropriate for commenting on this board." I don't think people are saying "this is not appropriate for this board." What I think people are saying is that "if you post ABC on a board that is designed to foster discussion among people with an interest in XYZ, don't be surprized if you don't get the reaction you were looking for." If someone can make the case for chain food and not for the convenience or whatever else of chain restaurants I, for one, think it could be very interesting.
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What I have a problem with, are condecending posts that basically tell people that if your tastes or knowledge are not up to a certain level than you have no business commenting on this board.
Please be so kind as to point one out.
Before you go digging, I would say that it does not seem entirely appropriate for someone without a strong interest in quality food and cooking to comment on a board which is dedicated to those same subjects.
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You got it wrong. Of course there is a difference between the food at [French Laundry and Cheesecake Factory]. But I believe some "connoisseurs" with curious minds might be more receptive to Cheesecake Factory if it had a fancy schmancy name with smaller everything and were not a chain.
Well... there are two things at play here.
First is the experience of people who have been to many such restaurants in the past. Having been to many chain restaurants myself over the years, my experience has helped me to form an impression of what to expect. And that impression informs my preference, which is to not eat at chain restaurants unless necessary, because my experience in eating at these places is that I don't think the cooking is very good and it does not conform to the preferences I have formed through eating food at other (to me, better) establishments. So, in that sense you are correct that a prejudice against chain restaurants -- albeit one based on experience -- might reasonably keep people from trying Cheesecake Factory whereas they might try the same restaurant if it were an independently owned single restaurant.
Ths second thing would be someone who might try the food at Cheesecake Factory and declare it not to his liking -- whereas he would actually like it perfectly well if the exact same dish at the exact same price were served at an independently owned single restaurant. This is snobbery. Personally, my impression of most people on eGullet is that there is nothing that would delight an eGulleter more than reporting back something to the effect of: "The XYZ at Cheesecake Factory actually really kicks ass! Believe it or not, it is every bit as good as the XYZ at [independently owned single restaurant known for its excellent XYZ]!"
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There's nothing wrong with being elitist. In certain areas, I'm certainly elitist. I relish my elitism. And mustard it too.
Yes, exactly! People who proclaim a preference for higher levels of quality and a disdain for lower levels of quality are constantly being labeled "elitist" -- as if that were a bad thing in this context!
So... some people feel that the food at Cheesecake Factory or Bennigan's or Olive Garden is below the level of quality which they prefer. So what? This means that they have a strong preference for higher quality, more inventive, more interesting, better executed cooking. How can this be bad?
Where I think the problem comes in is when people who enjoy Cheesecake Factory or Bennigan's or Olive Garden feel as though they are judged by the people who do not and somehow deemed "lower." That gets the defenses up and the next thing you know the foodie is being accused of "elitism" or "only liking that stuff because they think it impresses people" or "looking down at the people who like Bennigan's." And, really, it's not about that.
While on the subject, I would like to add that I don't think people here have an automatic dislike of chain restaurants or "middle brow" and "low brow" cooking. I think it is more a matter of execution. Fundamentaly, if Olive Garden made a really well-executed dish of pasta -- perfectly al dente; not oversauced; fresh, vibrant and distinct ingredients -- I think most people would not turn away from it. But, the fact of the matter is that places like Cheesecake Factory and Bennigan's and Olive Garden and TGI Friday's and Chili's and Applebee's and Romano's Macaroni Grill and Outback Steakhouse, et al. make their money selling to people who do not have very refined or adventurous palates and aren't really interested in a pasta dish such as I have described. Hence, their pasta tends to be mushy and oversauced with cheap ingredients and muddled flavors. This approach is further reinforced by the economics of chain restaurants. Now, I have never been to a Cheesecake Factory, and they may very well be a cut above Applebee's and their ilk. But I have a hard time believing that they can deliver the same quality of food at the same price as a good one-off family-owned little restaurant. At the same time, I understand that plenty of people in this country don't have easy access to a good one-off family-owned little restaurant, and that the TGI Bennigan's Outback Olive Grill may be the best game in town. So, why shouldn't they like it? But, if someone like me who lives in NYC and never needs to set foot in a chain restaurant decides he doesn't care for that food, does that make him a culinary snob? I don't see why. And the fact of the matter is that some people are going to dislike things that other people like. It's the way of the world.
Now, as for you McDowell, I hope you are not so gauche as to take your elitism with store-bought yellow mustard. Homemade only, please.
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Did they call it Sauce Estragon?
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Anyone with special expertise on roasting a perfect chicken and a willingness to share their methods with the rest of us, please drop me a PM as we'd love to have you contribute to the eGullet Culinary Institute.
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Toliver, I don't think anyone is saying that a lasagna noodle, meat, red sauce and ricotta baked dish would not be "lasagna al forno." Any time lasagna noodles are baked with something else in the oven, it is technically "lasagne al forno."
That said, the American version is just that: the American version and not one of the classic Italian versions. People differ as to their preferences for either one. One thing is quite clear, however: if it doesn't have lasagna noodles in it, it's not lasagne al forno.
Italian-American cuisine is not a "bastardization" of Italian cuisine but has become a genre unto itself (it also gave us pizza..where do I start building the shrine?).I won't argue that Italian-American cooking has become a distinct genre of cooking, because I tend to agree. It is also interesting to read up on the history of restaurant culture in Italy and see how strongly it was influenced by the return of Italians who had spend time in the US. Actually, Italian culture in general was hugely changed when peasants saw that they didn't have to slave away in the fields for the rest of their lives and could seek a new way of life in the New World. That said, I take extreme exception with your suggestion that Italian-American cooking "gave us pizza." Indeed, I would question whether much of the pizza one finds in America is even very good.
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I'll be right over. :drool:
Orlando Update
in Florida: Dining
Posted
Of course not. But you have to know something about it to know something about it. What in Lagasse's experience would lend itself to high-quality Chinese cookery?