emelinecannelle

Considering the French etymology, for sure they existed well before the 20th century. I was referring to the first attested usage in English precisely! Thanks for your clarification about whipped cream

Yeah, I agree with you on the image the Académie Française has given of itself... I may have exagerrated about the importance of such debates but they still exist! At least in academic circles... and in semi -journalistic magazines. Maybe it's not so common in everyday life (thank god!) but the fact that such debates are still current in French society, even at its margins, reveals something about how the French people see other languages and their influences. Afetr having done some research, I got few words which are used in English but which were attested for the first time during the twentietch century, or which are not recorder (yet) in an English dictionary designed for native speakers: crème anglaise, ganache, gelée, sabayon, chocolat chaud, mousse au chocolat, pain au chocolat, pâte à choux, pot de crème, and vacherin These are words that I actually found on the Internet used by English net surfers You're totally right! What really motivated the choice of "chantilly" in that case? Although a perfect answer can be given because of the prestige attached to such a word and thus the dessert would worth an extra pound or two on the menu, I found it interesting to wonder why people in everyday life are still sometimes using French words when an English equivalent could be used.... And thanks everyone for telling me the difference between a macaron and a macaroon (the same for sorbet/sherbet)

Thank you so much for your answers! I didn't think that this topic would interest so many people Few details, just to explain a little bit more the subject of my dissertation paper: - I had to restrict the scope of my study in order to be able to write my paper in one year time. That's why I've chosen the lexical field of pastry and dessert. of course, other lexical fields could have been chosen. This was just a personal choice. - One part of my paper is entirely dedicated to the history of French loan-words in the English lexicon so no need to explain to me that some loan-words are used because of this kind of history (although it is always interesting to know what native English speakers think about it) What struck me when reading your comments is that you don't really see the point (or at least you don't feel it's important) in studying such French words and to wonder why they were adopted in English as such or if they were adapted to the English language. In France, there are recurrently great debates about "how to keep the French language pure?" and "how to preserve French language from English invasion?" .... Ok, I might oversimplify but you get the point. I do think it has something to do with the relative positions held by languages in the world. English is everywhere, considered as an international language, and taught worldwide intensively. It could be argued that the English language is not as "threatened" as more minority languages (such as French) and thus does not feel the lexical innovations coming from other languages as "threats".... anyway @cakewalk: I meant "chosen" by the author of the quoted dessert name And it was an astonishment for me when watching Pulp Fiction to discover that there is no such thing as "Big Mac" in the US (so naiiiiive) @mkayahara: you're right in making a difference between "xénisme" and "emprunt" But i didn't want to get this topic too technical @dyjee100: thanks for the answers! Concerning the possible non-adoptees, I thought of French fries (which you mentioned) which are considered to be Belgian in France! There are also "French dressing", "French Dip Sandwich" and "French Custard Ice Cream" (I might be wrong there since I'm not an English native speaker) @Lesliec: The effect of the Norman Conquest was indeed quite tremendous on the English lexicon! And in many lexical fields! @Plantes Vertes: I focus my work on pastry terminology because I need to reduce the scope of my study... otherwise it would have taken me much more of a year! And what a better lexical field to study than pastry And thanks for the answers! @jmacnaughtan: Your point of view about preparation vs finished desserts is quite interesting, I didn't think of it!

I agree, no problem with that. However, what is interesting (or at least to me ) is the fact that the French word was chosen and not the Italian original one...

thank you both for your answers! I'm starting a new topic dedicated to this feedback (here: http://forums.egullet.org/topic/148540-french-words-in-english-dessert-names/) since I'm misusing the "Introduction" forum

HI! I've decided to start this topic in order to help me for a dissertation I'm writing for my Master of Arts. (By the way, I'm French so don't blame me for the possible mistakes) My dissertation is based on the long history which has intertwined English and French lexicons for centuries now, and on the contemporary use of French loan-words in the English language. To cut short, I've noticed that a great number of French words are used in the pastry and dessert lexical fields and I was wondering why they were still used today, especially in dessert names. Just to be sure... what I call loan-words are French words which are used as French and which have not be transformed in order to "loook like" English native words. Examples would be: Beetroot macarons (where the English nativized word is "macarOOn") Caramel apple crème brulee chocolate soufflé cranberry beignets Chocolate Trio: Chocolate Sorbet , Chocolate Tarte with Lemon-Thyme Sabayon, Choco late Fondant Cake (this is quite a loooong name for a dessert ) I would like to have a reflexive feedback on the use of French loan-words so that I could compare what YOU think of those French words and what I think. Do you feel that the words in the example are French. And, if so, why do you think they are used? Do you use the same terminology when talking to your friends or family? Do you understand the above-mentioned words? Do you sometimes use French words on purpose? and, of course, if so: why? Thank you so much for the time that you'll spent to answer me!

Oh sorry, I should have explained it I'm so busy in writing my dissertation for months now that I think everyone knows what I'm actually talking about! More than giving you a definition of a loan-word, I'd rather give some examples if you don't mind! The following quotations are dessert names taken from this website. I put the French loan-words in bold types. Apple aux bretons Caramel apple crème brulee Pistachio madeleines Pumpkin chiffon mousse Coffee Walnut Daquoise Those are French words but used in an English dessert name. This what I call loan-words. Is it better or do you need more explanation?

Hi everyone! I'm Emeline, I'm French and I'm living in France! I'm currently preparing a research study for the French equivalent of a Master of Arts. My work is based on the use of French loan-words in the lexical field of pastry and dessert. This is why I decided to join this community, in order to have access to samples of dessert names. However, before finalizing my dissertation paper, I would like to know what YOU think about the use of French loan-words in pastry and dessert field. Do you sometimes prefer French loan-words instead of native English words, and if so, why? Do you use the same terminology when talking to your friends or family (IRL)? Do you understand the meaning of French loan-words that you use? Such a reflexive feedback would be great in order to compare it to the conclusions drawn from my corpus study