djyee100
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Posts posted by djyee100
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Some vegs take well to braising in stock, like spinach, escarole, and leeks. I like to briefly saute cabbage with some butter and onion, then braise it in chicken stock with a little ham. For another fave, a Shaker recipe, I braise carrots in chicken stock with some honey.
Any gratin or casserole requires a little liquid somewhere, and that's where stock comes in handy. Savory bread puddings usually require stock for some liquid too.
You can thin out canned spaghetti sauce with leftover stock you have around--it's better than water. A glug of wine doesn't hurt the sauce, either.
You can make a tasty polenta with stock, and rice pilaf.
Savory custards are made with stock, like the Japanese chawan mushi. Here:
http://www.twolazygourmets.com/2013/03/magical-chawan-mushi-japanese-savory-egg-custard/A couple soups come to mind that use up lots of stock and can be a meal in themselves: Asian wonton soup, embellished with chicken slices, shrimp, water chestnuts, bok choy, snow peas, green onion; and Tuscan ribollita, a bread-vegetable soup that layers potatoes, beans, bread, leafy greens and herbs with broth. Your question sent me to a recipe for ribollita that I saw recently, and now I'm thinking of making it myself. Here:
https://books.google.com/books?id=RWSOVYWK2WoC&pg=PA71&lpg=PA71&dq=johns+cucina+povera+ribollita+recipe&source=bl&ots=m__PVwHu_v&sig=h35BpeLTKYu1HLkZg7-5MhmUrCo&hl=en&sa=X&ei=Dy7wVPTQO5DWoASn34LoBg&ved=0CDYQ6AEwBDgK#v=onepage&q=johns%20cucina%20povera%20ribollita%20recipe&f=falseDo you bake? You can experiment with stock as a savory liquid in some baked goods, like biscuits.
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I'm fascinated by how this discussion has evolved since my last post. (Enjoyable reading, too.)
In some of my recent reading, an author said (to paraphrase), "Food is folk culture." I thought that was a wonderful way to explain the endless variations in cooking, whether we're talking about a single dish or the treatment of a single ingredient. Like a good folk story, there is a common theme, but infinite variations on that theme. The same with a popular dish like nasi goreng. Cooks vary the basic idea of nasi goreng depending on their preferences and the ingredients they have on hand.
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I tracked down the photo of nasi goreng that I cooked for the Cradle of Flavor thread, and miraculously I remembered how to upload the photo.
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Way back when, some EGulleters (myself included) cooked through James Oseland's Cradle of Flavor cookbook. We cooked the nasi goreng recipe from the book and liked it. The recipe is here:
http://voices.washingtonpost.com/mighty-appetite/2007/09/a_nod_to_indonesia.html-
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Have you looked at Pamela Sheldon Johns' Cucina Povera?
https://books.google.com/books?id=RWSOVYWK2WoC&printsec=frontcover&dq=pamela+sheldon+johns+cucina+povera&hl=en&sa=X&ei=O1neVOuQDYquogSe7oG4BA&ved=0CCgQ6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=pamela%20sheldon%20johns%20cucina%20povera&f=falseAlso, Papa Andrea's Sicilian Table: Recipes and Remembrances of My Grandfather by Vincent Schiavelli contains a section on cucina povera. The rest of the book is not so povera.
https://books.google.com/books?id=Zt24M3F5PH0C&printsec=frontcover&dq=Vincent+Schiavelli&hl=en&sa=X&ei=c1neVL2MNdaxogTP84HQAg&ved=0CCUQ6AEwAQ#v=onepage&q=Vincent%20Schiavelli&f=falseI own both books, though I have not yet cooked from the Johns book. I have cooked out of the Schiavelli book with good results.
It's true that cucina povera originated from times of scarcity (both manmade and natural), but now Italy enjoys abundant agriculture, and recipes from current magazines will reflect that. I don't know how much you want to delve into this subject. I did a search for "cucina povera" in the U.S. Library of Congress. As you will see, some of the results are books in Italian. I suggest you also check public library and academic sources that may be available to you. good luck.
http://www.loc.gov/search/?q=cucina+povera&all=true&st=list -
... It's turning out to be a strange, if warm, winter for them.
It's been a warm winter in my part of Northern California also. My basil plants never got killed off by a frost, but in December I pulled them out anyway.
This past gardening season started off so hopefully (don't they all?) but my garden ran smack into the severe drought we're experiencing in California. In the summer, with the water shortages, I and many of my neighbors pulled out whatever plants we thought were expendable and cuddled the rest. My biggest memory of the 2013-2014 season will be how I hauled pails and pails of clean wastewater out to the yard to keep my shrubs alive.
Up in the Napa-Sonoma wine country, vineyards pulled up areas they thought were not worth the water, and let them go fallow.
Meanwhile, the animals were (and are) suffering. A young buck deer discovered my neighbor's bird bath and regularly showed up to drink it down. The birds and squirrels struggled to find enough food this past winter because plants produced low amts of fruits and seeds. My neighbors and I have put out some seeds and nuts to help tide them over, and I hope we're feeding the birds and squirrels, and not the (pesty) wood mice. Oh well.
TG we've had some rain this winter.
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Welcome, georgetollman! I suggest that you check out the "wine course" that Eric Asimov is doing for the NY Times. The articles are available online through the NY Times website. Since the course has been going on for awhile, you should be able to access older articles in the archives. You may have to pay a fee.
You don't say where you're from, but it sounds like somewhere in California. If you're in the Bay Area, I suggest wine courses at the SF Cooking School given by a well-respected sommelier, Eugenio Jardim. Also, this coming Monday, sommelier and author Evan Goldstein will do a talk and tasting about South American wines (Argentina, Brazil, Chile, Uruguay) at the JCCSF. Very unusual--I thought about attending but my schedule is crammed.
good luck with your wine studies!
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Your Greek student may very well mean vasilopita, which is also associated with the visit of the three kings on Epiphany. It's an important Greek Orthodox holiday.
I suggest that your student research not only "cake" but also "bread." Many of the Greek ritualistic cakes are really enriched and filled breads.
Diane Kochilas' The Glorious Foods of Greece contains substantial material on the ritualistic breads and pastries of Greece, including the regional variations on these foods. The book is written at a more advanced level than I would expect for a 10 year old. However, if your student can find an adult to help her read and go through the material, she may find it rewarding.
Sounds like you have an interesting class developing! pls keep us posted.
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Scratch the Percy Jackson books/movies in terms of Greek food ideas. The books are intelligent and kids will learn about Greek and Roman mythology without even trying. But food culture? No. The demi-god protagonists of these books go to a magical camp on Long Island, and can conjure up their favorite foods, which are (surprise, surprise) pizza, hamburgers, BBQ, milk shakes, chocolate chip cookies, and enchiladas. The foods these kids choose barely pass a nutritional bar, never mind an ethnic one.
Back to the drawing board, guys.
I'm also curious why the program has chosen to teach about Greek food. I love Greek food, but it's not an influential cuisine.
Diane Kochilas's book, The Glorious Foods of Greece, contains good material about the traditional Greek diet (pulses, vegs, seafood, limited meat, olives, olive oil). That's source material for teaching. Not a book for kids.
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Does anyone else have helpful suggestions concerning what I could possibly add to the recipe? ...
Try adding thyme, rosemary, and/or oregano for a Mediterranean influence (think paella or bouillabaisse, two classic dishes with saffron). A few pinches of Spanish pimenton/paprika would be nice; or a little cayenne or red pepper flakes for heat. On the Middle Eastern/Indian side of saffron, you could add a little cumin, cardamom, coriander, and/or ginger. Also a tiny pinch of cinnamon, if you like cinnamon. Easy on the cinnamon--a little goes a long way.
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A recipe for sauteed chicken over saffron rice--close to what you're looking for, I think. Use the ingredient amts, cooking methods, and cooking times of this recipe as guidelines. Or--my suggestion--cook this recipe as is, and once you've set a baseline for yourself, adjust and play with variations on this theme.
http://www.tasteslovely.com/crispy-chicken-and-saffron-rice-skillet/
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I wouldn't worry too much (heck, who am I kidding, I wouldn't worry at all) about the precision of the spices...
The amts of spices in any recipe are intended to get you in the ballpark for the desired flavor profile. You're not going to get a cake that tastes exactly like AB's unless you have access to his spice cabinet. (I assume you don't.) For something like this, my preferred system is to grind an approximate amount of each spice, measure it off, taste the entire spice mixture, then adjust it (if necessary) to my liking. As has been discussed above, dried herbs and spices are variable in flavor and intensity, so trust your taste buds.
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I wouldn't take any stated prep time for a recipe seriously. Sometimes I think the recipe writer must be fantasizing. Or his prep cook did all the work.
I use whole spices also. I don't know of any conversion chart, and I wonder if any chart would be useful given the variability of dried herbs and spices, depending on the batch and their sources. If you're going to use whole spices (I do) it will simply take time to grind, measure, and mix them all.
Try folding a thick batter with a silicon spatula. Cut the spatula into the middle of the bowl, then scoop and fold over to the edge of the bowl, while rotating the bowl. As for adding the nuts and apples before the flour--somebody else will have to answer that question.
I take cooling times seriously in a recipe. I assume the author wants the cake to set properly before it's turned out. I use nonstick pans for bundt cakes or tube cakes, and I generously grease them with butter anyway. The one time I didn't grease my nonstick pan, the cake stuck. When I grease my nonstick pans, I never have a problem.
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When I eyeball your Hillbilly Fudge recipe, I see a recipe for chocolate frosting that's solidified with Velveeta. Credit Sean Brock's grandmother for seeing the gelatin and milk fat in Velveeta. That was a bold move. Other fudge recipes use marshmallows (gelatin), evaporated milk (milk fat), and chocolate chips (cocoa butter, milk fat).
So to answer your questions, I think homemade Velveeta would not be a good substitute because it has too much real cheese in it. You're looking for gelatin (or another thickener) and bland milk fat. Highly processed cream cheese might not be so bad.
Pbear is right about the differences between cream cheese and Velveeta. The recipe might come out with cream cheese, but the texture could be different. Not sure there would be much of a flavor difference. Cocoa dominates all.
Pls let us know how it goes.
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I don't think that MSG was deliberately "whitewashed" from culinary history. It's become unpopular so it's not found in readily available cookbook editions. Most people aren't interested in culinary history when they buy cookbooks. They want something tasty to cook. Even if the book originally contained MSG in recipes, I bet the MSG was omitted in later editions. As for the recipes being authentic--or not--we've had many discussions on EGullet about "authenticity." It's like beauty in the eye of the beholder.
For finding your MSG recipes--
MSG appears in recipes in The Chinese Cookbook by Craig Claiborne and Virginia Lee (1972). Googlebooks preview here:
https://books.google.com/books?id=eiw-EnIm0g4C&printsec=frontcover&dq=chinese+cookbook+claiborne+lee&hl=en&sa=X&ei=J-S1VN-hHIqBygSAtoFg&ved=0CB8Q6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=chinese%20cookbook%20claiborne%20lee&f=falseMSG is also used in The Pleasures of Chinese Cooking by Grace Zia Chu (1969). (The foreword was written by Craig Claiborne--I see a pattern here.) I own this book, though I can't dig it out right now. It's in a box. The food reminds me of the Chinese restaurant food of my childhood (1960s, 1970s), although I don't use MSG and neither did my parents for their home cooking.
I surmise that MSG started disappearing from American cookbooks in the 1970s. If you're serious about this line of research, you can go to a used book site like abebooks.com or alibris.com and do a search for keyword "chinese cookbook" with advanced search option of publishing date before 1970 or thereabouts. Oldies and maybe goodies will show up in the search. (For advanced search, click "more search options" in abebooks.com search box. Click the red magnifying glass icon on the alibris.com search box.)
If you don't want to buy the books, then you may find them in the SF public library catalog, including the Link+ system. Interlibrary loan through Link+ is free via the SF public library.
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But Mark Bittman makes a good point--all meat production (birds or animals) is "cruel" in the sense that the birds or animals are leading, at a minimum, "unnatural" lives to feed us, usually under conditions we'd rather not know about. People have made the decision that we are more important, or certainly more powerful, than birds or animals, so that's the system. Even if everybody were to go vegetarian tomorrow, we would be taking up more animal habitat to grow vegetables, and making sure by pesticides and herbicides that there is little competition for our food supply.
We can make certain things better, but for now most aspects of food production are a given--or so it seems. We all want to eat. Plenty. Of everything.
I did wonder about the foie gras legislation when it was passed. I thought the animal welfare advocates were picking the low-growing fruit on this one--chose to support this law because the majority of Californians don't know about, don't care about, or can't afford foie gras. My two foie gras-loving friends grumbled about the law, and everybody else said, What? It turns out the opposition had the feds on their side--this time. I do think the new egg-raising/less-confinement requirements are worthwhile, and do more good overall than the foie gras law ever did.
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But Scotch Eggs aren't Scottish...
You're right.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/foodanddrink/10328855/Potted-histories-Scotch-eggs.html
But I say put Scotch Eggs on the table anyway, and call them a ringer.
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I vote for Scotch eggs, too. Also Scotch Shortbread, which is distinctively creamed with the hands. The linked recipe comes from Richard Sax's Classic Home Desserts. My aunt taught me how to make a similar Scotch Shortbread when I was 11 years old. It's hard to wreck this recipe.
http://www.globalgourmet.com/food/special/2000/home_desserts/shortbread.html#axzz3OH9Yvlbd --Keep scrolling. Taste the dough before baking to make sure it's adequately salted.Don't forget about Scottish salmon.
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I believe it is just the import ban that was struck down, not the ban on raising geese and ducks for their livers.
Correct. The law banning the sale of foie gras in California has been struck down. However, another law prohibiting the production of foie gras in California still stands. According to one article, there was only a single producer of foie gras in California prior to the ban, so obviously the second law had limited impact.
The judge said that a federal law on poultry products preempted the California law, i.e., the federal law in this instance overrides the state law. The state law basically interfered with the federal regulatory scheme for poultry products in commerce, so the state law had to fall. Since this is only a decision by a district court, it is appealable and may not be the final word.
Californians no longer have to resort to bathtub foie gras, served in smoky speakeasies...
There are people who are happy to have foie gras back, but they'll still miss the indoor smoking.
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I remember that Alice Medrich liked to play with the black-white theme in desserts. You could check some of her cookbooks.
A few recipes that I remembered and tracked down online:
B&W cheesecake:
http://www.pbs.org/mpt/jewishcooking/recipes/season1/106r.htmlB&W poundcake:
http://bakingbites.com/2006/04/cooking-school-chocolate-marble-cake/B&W cookies aka Brownie-stuffed Vanilla Cookies aka Chocolate hamantaschen. They can be folded in different styles, of course, as long as the filling peeks out.
Recipe:
http://alicemedrich.blogspot.com/2012/03/chocolate-hamantaschen.html
Pic:
http://cooking-books.blogspot.com/2008/12/chocolate-hamantaschen.htmlAgree with comment upthread, how black is black, how white is white. The recipe may be on a black/white theme, but not starkly colored black & white in reality. Have you seen this pic of a B&W dessert table? Pretty amazing.
http://www.mondeliceblog.com/black-and-white-dessert-table/-
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One thing to note is I don't like to finely shred the meat or add any sauce. Shredding the meat finely and adding lots of sauce will make the meat more "juicy", but I'm trying to figure out how to make it soft and juicy by simply cooking it properly...
Have you ever looked at the CI recipe for pulled pork? It parallels the Momofuko recipe, e.g., brining the meat (they use a wet brine), and moderate oven temp of 325F. But CI parcooks the meat wrapped in parchment and foil for about half the cooking time, then cooks it unwrapped until done. The wrapping preserves moisture in the meat. CI claims it mimics the moist heat of a covered grill. Here:
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Djyee you're suffering from a foundational misunderstanding here. Lean pork as described in your post is not the same as tough pork you would find in a shoulder...
No, I was talking about pork shoulder. But as DDF says upthread, tender is subjective. I admit I'm OK with chewier meat compared to some others. What I didn't get was that the OP wanted pulled pork rather than pork roast. I've only cooked pulled pork in an oven maybe once, at a lower temp than the Momofuko recipe, with some liquid in the pan (i.e., it was braising). Don't ask me what the final internal temp was. It was very tender and falling apart at the end of cooking time, so I considered it done.
There was a classic article in Cook's Illustrated about pot roast long ago. The upshot was that for beef chuck you should cook it to death, then cook it some more so that the collagen dissolves. Beef has plenty of collagen, so that heavy duty cooking makes sense. It's my understanding that pork has less collagen compared to beef (how much less I don't know), so I would be more cautious about cooking it to death, even for cuts like pork shoulder. Just some thoughts since we're talking about overcooked, dry pork here.
Torolover, are you going to do anything different besides a smaller piece of meat and a shorter cooking time? Because some people here have suggested a lower cooking temp and some moisture in the method.
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The issue isn't food safety but tenderizing a tough cut. If you want "falling apart" meat it takes time and some temp to gelatinize collagen.
But pork is pretty tender to begin with. I'm not necessarily contradicting you about these high internal temps, because I don't bother with thermometers. After a long slow cooking time, I know the pork is cooked sufficiently, and the only issue is tenderness. I stick a fork in it. If it feels soft as butter, it's done.
About collagen. As an aside, Aidells-Kelly (my link upthread) note that pork is different from beef in how it cooks and tenderizes.
from the Aidells-Kelly book--
page 245:
The connective tissue in pork becomes harder and less elastic as its temperature increases to 160F and above, with the result that it tends to push moisture out of the meat.
page 251:
Pork suitable for braising must contain sufficient intramuscular fat. Unlike tough cuts of beef, which become soft and silky after long cooking, lean pork gets drier and harder as it cooks, eventually falling apart into dry strings. That's because it doesn't contain much collagen, as does beef, but it does have another connective tissue, called elastin, which doesn't dissolve an soften during moist cooking. Instead, it shrinks and gets hard.
Apparently elastin doesn't tenderize no matter how long you cook it, according to this blog.
http://www.thekitchn.com/what-is-gristle-66813
Aidells-Kelly say roast pork butt should read 150-155 degrees, with final temp 5-10 degrees higher after resting. Braised pork butt should register 160-165 degrees on an instant-read thermometer, with final temp of 170-175 degrees after resting. These are the guidelines I would use (if I bothered with thermometers
).While it might be "better" braised in a Dutch oven, I've had pretty good luck roasting at 275 until done.
I've had good results with roasting pork shoulder at that oven temp also.
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Wow, where are you guys getting these high internal temps for cooked pork? Trichinosis dies at 137F. The conservative FDA used to say internal temp of 160F for cooked pork roast, but changed its recs a couple years ago to 145F.
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/05/25/dining/porks-safe-cooking-temperature-is-lowered.htmlAlso see Bruce Aidells and Denis Kelly, The Complete Meat Cookbook, page 246, on Googlebooks:
https://books.google.com/books?id=ExCYBwIzym0C&printsec=frontcover&dq=complete+meat+cookbook&hl=en&sa=X&ei=ZbWdVPb-MZHfoATlxYKoAw&ved=0CCgQ6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=pork%20final%20temperature&f=falseI've cooked this six-hour pork roast with excellent results:
http://www.epicurious.com/recipes/food/views/Six-Hour-Pork-Roast-102530I've oven-braised pork with this method: Season 3 lbs pork butt and put it with 1 cup apple juice in Dutch oven. Preheat oven to 400F. Put pork in the oven, immediately reduce heat to 200F, and cook for 6 hrs.
Questions about bean varieties
in Cooking
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I thought I cooked them in Paula Wolfert's Piedmontese Soup, and posted about it on the dinner thread. Nope, I cooked Yellow Eye beans. But Yellow Eye and Yellow Indian Woman are similar, so I'll include the idea here.
http://forums.egullet.org/topic/143505-dinner-2010/page-11 -- see post #311
Sausage and bean combos speak to me when I think about these beans.
You could do a nice bean soup with aromatics (garlic, onion, carrots, olive oil), and some herbs (thyme, savory, sage, and/or rosemary). Towards the end of cooking time, add in some blanched chopped kale and duck sausage; or some chopped tomato and merguez sausage; then let the soup finish cooking. Dust some grated pecorino over the tomato/merguez soup before service.
Or you could do a kale and bean soup, then serve in bowls topped with a slice of toasted bread, prosciutto, and a poached egg. Shave some parmesan on top.