Vadouvan
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A few shots behind the scenes during the dinner.
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"Hands down the best restaurant in Philadelphia" might be pushing it suffice to say the best food ever served there was when Christopher Lee was there and also Liebrandt's brief cheffry.
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I have no bias against Laban, but admit to knowing Plotkin well.
But the debate is not about where Plotkin buys his meat, but how well he knows his actual product and how he serves it, and a mistake made by a food critic.
Though the debate isnt specifically about where he buys his meat, it goes to the heart of his (plotkin's) conversation when one of his supporting arguments is that he buys his fabulous meat from 2nd tier distributors. Any chef will tell you there are lots of places to buy meat but the two places he names are not on the top ten, you as a good food writer should know that, so maybe not a bias against laban but certainly one towards plotkin.
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Hey Phil, I've wanted to tell you that I thought you 2nd subject line for Modo miso should have been "O mio babbino caro"
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Unfortunately Jack......
You were a victim of a not often discussed occurence in the restaurant business.
It's called "Tasting menus for high check averages".
The first rule of a tasting menu is *never* order tasting menus in a tapas restaurant.
There is ZERO point to it.
The food is small plates.
You can order whatever you want so why let them lock you into spendiing $200 for food you did not like or choose ?
Invariably what happens in these situations is you get a few actual dishes and some bullshit retail items. It's not that it is bad food but olives, cured meats and cheese with garnishes dont belong in a tasting menu, a tasting menu is about a chef's vision which requires conceptualizing and cooking something not simply passing some chorizo through a slicer or slapping some truffle honey on cheese.
Absent of that, what happens is waiters and the restaurants to some extent raise your check average with the perception of value.
I dont know if this is what happened to you nor am I accusing Tinto of deception but feel free to come to your own conclusions.
I say never order tasting menus in small plates restaurants unless it's cooked food.
I use to go to Morimoto and say "Omakase no sushi".
You will be amazed at what you get when you specify to erase the bullshit up front.
Sorry you had a bad experience though.
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I dont think this can be simply blamed on Laban being a "pompous ass", certainly he is no more of a pompous ass than any other food reviewer in this town, he simply stood his ground over an egomanaical restauranteur as he should. There is no willful malice and retractions are meaningless, what's he supposed to say ?
"I profusely apologise, the lame steak I ate which the owner of the restaurant admittedly agrees is lame and serves regularly, though lame was not a New York Strip."
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It's his word against the waiters, they wont be able to prove willfull intentional malice on Laban's part, the suit is a symptom of possible egomania, if anything at this point the plaintiffs just look douchier everyday this continues.
Opening the door for frivolous lawsuits will hurt restaurants in the long run, what if restaurants are eventually forced to post caloric/nutritional info on menu items, we all know they wont be accurate, will customers be allowed to sue too ?
The whole thing is just silly.
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"refined posturing"
How about reading e-gullet a bit more slowly.
Mr Volk doesn't even get his story right.
Gordon *hated* Amada as I recall, I merely agreed that foie/cabrales/filet mignon was just silly.
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Who told me he did in Nawlings....?
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The new issue of an area monthly magazine contains the picture of a local newspaper food critic who had been trying to keep what he looks like a secret.
Philadelphia magazine editor Larry Platt says he doubts that printing the photo will damage the effectiveness of Inquirer restaurant reviewer Craig LaBan, inasmuch as what he looks like has been an open secret among the area's leading restaurants anyway.
Platt says LaBan's likeness came to a head recently:
"He is now party in a news story -- a lawsuit -- and we generally show what protagonists in news stories look like."
LaBan is being sued for libel by Main Line eatery "Chops," and although opinion pieces like reviews are normally shielded by the First Amendment, in this case the restaurant alleges that LaBan got a fact wrong in his uncomplimentary mention of its food.
Platt says that makes LaBan subject to having his photo in the media, same as anybody else:
"We're not talking about Valeria Plame here. We're talking about someone who eats meals and writes about them. And if someone wants to say who that is, they can."
While most reporters are not anonymous, a restaurant reviewer may want to be, so the kitchen and staff don't upgrade their treatment for him when he slips in as a customer.
Interesting rationale by Larry Platt.
A bit absurd.....but he is right !
Even if the leading restaurants know who he is, how about new ones ?
He doesnt exactly re-review old ones.
Philadelphia magazine reviews restaurants with anonymous reviewers either with pseudonyms or great attempts at anonymity.
I wonder if this means the inquirer will be doing a story on Maria Gallagher.
Rather interesting to see food journalism implode on itself.
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You aren't calling anyone out, these conversations need to be had.
I spoke to Gordon about this and his quote "kick in the ass" isnt a proverbial call to violence, rather there is a serious problem of overused superlatives in the dining community. Things are being raved about that just arent that good. Raw is embarassingly bad, Modo mio is no "Osteria at a lower price point" which brings us to the problem. I am not saying everyone should go out and spend goobs of money but the majority of reviews and feedback are suffering from a $ price/actual quality dissonance that the only conclusion is that people are willing to accept mediocrity because it wasnt expensive.
Most people cant even buy fresh fish let alone taste it, I stood at RTM for 3 hrs one day and absolutely zero, none of the people who bought fish smelled what they were buying so why should one presume that any sushi rave is justified. Lets be honest, no one wants to preach elitist appreciation of fish but with no quality index, how can superlatives be defined ?
Sushi bars:
Morimoto's sushi bar is a mess, not dirty, not bad, just cluttered, in fact the fish is of high quality, a restaurant of that size needs a sushi bar twice as long. The intrinsic relationship that makes a sushi experience trancedental is also missing, you cannot order sushi directly from a sushi chef at Morimoto. These may seem like quibbly nitpicky bullshit to sushi neophytes but if you eviscerate the heart of the sushi experience, all you have left is a retail experience. You might as well be eating your sushi in a booth at whole foods. This doesnt even factor in when you actually establish a relationship with any of the chefs. I went to Morimoto on tuesday nights 10 weeks in a row, sat at the bar and even though I could not order from the chefs, I sat in front of Omae san and that certainly improved the product. It's not that japanese chefs give preferential treatment, it more about the pride they take in cooking for you. It isnt a culture that historically pumps out faceless plates of food for big dining rooms.
Same thing at Yasuda and Yasuda san is a fuuuunny dude.
I said Zento is cheaper and better than morimoto.
Probably in line with Fuji.
Fuji has served excellent sushi in the past, the Omakase's diverge too far away from Japanese food to be exciting.
Quality wise what you are looking for is:
Good rice.
Some restaurants actually polish thier rice which is a plus. (Morimoto did at some point, probably still do )
Not too cold.
Not too dry.
Not too sweet (mirin)
Not too acidic (rice vinegar)
Of course fresh fish.
Sliced properly
not too much wasabi (cant taste the fish)
More later.....
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Again, I think it's more than a bit far-fetched to suggest that the only thing in common between the two places is the name and the source of funding. They have basically the same menus and the same sources of fish. And I toured the place during lunch, and my impression is that the clientele isn't nearly as different as you think.Yeah, but by definition they're two separate restaurants merely funded by the same source. In theory, one could easily be far superior to the other based on staffing, sourcing of products local to them, etc. To compare the two and assume they have to be the same is to do both of them a disservice. And to presume it's the best thing around here just because there's a "celebrity chef" at the helm is also a disservice to everyone.
I'm not defending Morimoto. I still think it's overpriced as hell for what it is. But to presume that the Philly branch and New York branch should be measured by the same metric is ridiculous. The markets are different. The clientele is different. There's little in common other than the name over the door and the source of funding (SRO). It's the comparison that's specious - not the restaurants or the concept. And certainly not the local competition - which for my money wins hands down. By the time I pay for transportation to Manhattan and all the incidentals (transit tickets or gas, tolls and parking) I'll happily "settle" for Fuji and get home in time for a decent night's sleep. And I won't sweat which guy was slicing my fish if I enjoyed it.
Been to both.
Both restaurants have almost everything in common, one just charges more and adds more flourishes. There are rarey any "local" ingredients of consequence in the specialty Japanese restaurant business. They all fly in stuff from all over the place.
Both Morimotos just exhibit the difference in sushi perception and quality between Phila and NYC.
On one hand, the top end tops out at Morimoto in Philly, while nobody serious about sushi in NY would say that Morimoto is the best sushi place in NY.
Lets remember Fuji isnt a local sushi place, it's in New jersey, close but not local. It brings into question the blind silliness and overuse of the word "local" like local automatically means good.
Chef's dont want local ingredients, they want good ingredients, a substantial portion of good ingredients just tend to be local. I am not directing this at you Katie, I have much respect for you but the whole "local" thing has gotten out of hand. If people arent going to focus on the inherent quality in additional to the proper storage, it's all meaningless. Moving produce in and out of refrigeration at fair food daily and selling frozen meat is not a compelling case for gastronomy yet people swallow this bullshit idea of fresh=local=better daily.
Zento serves better sushi.
Cheaper too.
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Correct.
referring to anyone as being "foodier than thou" because they disagree with your asessment is patently hypocritical.
You ae also correct about the automatic provincial defensiveness, I have heard a few absurd claims on the boards like "lebecfin is the best french restaurant in the world" or "Amada is the best tapas bar on the east coast". It isnt to say these places are bad restaurants, they are not bad, they just aren't that good if you manage to get out of philly now and then.
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Did you put your hygrometer on the rice? The rice I had held together and complimented the rest of the piece, without the vinegar or sweetness overpowering things. I say that one should eat their sushi and think about what the chef is trying to do.
Probably not wise to use supporting technical arguments one isnt familiar with.
Hygrometers measure ambient humidity within a specific or contained environment not the moisture level of rice, different tool for that. Speaking of sweetness, fuji also uses American mirin which is sweeter than the Japanese stuff. I have seen the bottles there. Saying one should just eat the sushi and think about what the chef is trying to do is absurd, we know what the chef is trying to do, the substance of this conversation deals with that issue specifically and it seems that the problem is just the continous stifling of dissent on e-gullet. The board will be better served if members can respect differing opinions without labelling posters with higher or different expectations elitists or "foodier than thou". It would be just as bad labelling posters who rave about mediocrity as "philistines" and frankly such tangents substantively adds nothing to the conversation.
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Gordon.
I agree that sushi quality varies greatly as regards who is at the sushi bar, only sushi neophytes would disagree with that, even though Yasuda is clearly excellent, there is a remarkable difference in the the experience if one is being served by Yasuda san as opposed to table waiters.
On Fuji, I have always felt it was good but somewhat overrated, can the same people who run around raving about new mediocre Italian BYOB's be trusted to communicate the subtleties of raw fish while drinking all kinds of wine, you know how the Japanese always drink wine with thier sushi.....
You should simply ignore the "foodier than thou thing", so often threads go of track because of childish personal insults. When did e-gullet turn into chowhound ?
Unfortunate.
I wonder how peole who have eaten sushi for 17 years cant figure out the fact that the fish is just too cold and the rice is dry ?
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We're planning on going this weekend... any recommendations?
Yes, go to Zento instead.
Way better sushi both price and quality wise.
Easily the best in center city.
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Mr Scoats.
The definition of "enticement" is based on the fact one in fact has not experienced the subject at hand in this case the food.
Poeple are "enticed" by pictures therefore to say that the food isn't "enticing" based on the pictures is NOT unjustified.
To say it's not good without tasting it IS unjustified.
I think most people would agree the term "vegetable medley" IS the kiss of death for any menu.
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The folks at Mosaic clearly understand "the art of dining"
From those pictures .......?
Seriously ......
Delicate flavors of hummus and goat cheese ?
Not to be nitpicky but that is bagged pregrated "mozzarella".
and why are there two substantial chicken dishes in a 4 course menu ?
I appreciate what she is doing for the hood but other than the fact that it is super inexpensive, it doesnt sound very enticing food wise....
Edited to add:
Correction that would be 3 chicken dishes.
second course chicken and the third course a choice of chicken and you guessed it.....chicken...
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There already is a Bar ferdinand thread, no need to start another one, too many double subjects on the board.
It's here.
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This is completely absurd.
Why should where you live have anything to do with if you should get the correct chage back ?
The perception that people who live around rittenhouse square are rich and thus should be considered cheap for asking for exact change which by the way is due to them is patently ridiculous.
As long as the US treasury continues to consider coins legal tender, restaurants have no basis not to return change other than that they are lazy amateurish operations like Loie.
Money is money, no one knows the motivation of why a customer wants the coins back, the simplistic answer is to simply label them cheap and those kinds of disingenous conclusions come from reasoning that has no legs to stand on, what about principle ?
As holly said it's pure chutpah to just assume you can do it as a restaurant because it's your policy.
I would simply drastically lower the servers tips.
It's not akin to stealing, it is stealing.
Over the course of a fiscal year, the sum total of those coins falls well within what is considered grand theft by current statutes. Stealing a little from a lot of people doesnt make you any less a criminal.
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What is an "American sushi bar" ?
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The Amish, an exception, are protesting because they see this as an ethical issue and they are principled folks.
Holly is indeed passionate.
The Amish sell a good amount of vegetables at RTM that are mainstream commercial veggies not from the "farm" with the perception that they are. They are certainly no more principled than the rest of us.
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I recently made up some vanilla salt, incredibly fragrant but doesn't seem to have much vanilla flavor.
I sprinkled some on fresh mozzarella, figuring that was a very neutral base. Got some vanilla scent but only salt taste.
Now, it has only been a week since I out the chopped up beans in the salt. Do you think I might just be expecting too much, too soon?
'Nother question:
That is because sugar carries the flavor or vanilla not salt.Most taste associations of vanilla come with sweetness.
Talula's Table Now Open in Kennett Square
in Pennsylvania: Dining
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Any food operation publicly saying they are booked a year ahead risks ridicule because ultimately if you can get a reservation rather frequently, it sublimates into a silly marketing plan and simply buzz that attempts to create unreasonable expectations.
I say "attempt" because intelligent people understand that there is zero correlation between how good the food at a restaurant is and how long you wait to get a reservation.
It is the most easily manipulated detail about restaurants.
El Bulli is booked a year ahead and it would require rather specific connections to get a seat after they are booked. I am sure that with frequency Talula's is "available".
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I seriously dont believe that anyone in Pensylvania books anything a year ahead.
Sounds good in print but it's BS.
Let me guess, they have "cancellations" ?
Oldest trick in the book to create "desirability".
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At the end of the day, it's just a way of creating "desirability"
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It takes longer to get a table at Taulas than at :
ElBulli
Arzak
Espai Sucre
Mugaritz
Ducasse
Robuchon
Per Se
Jean georges
Tetsuya
Alinea
Fat Duck
Arpege
to name a few places that serve infinitely better food.
Means nothing.
Good PR pretty much
havent had the food and phil say's it's good
that's good eough for me but the 1 year thing isnt about food, it's about size.
see size does matter.