chefboy24
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Posts posted by chefboy24
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seriously telling mario about a bad meal you had one time is like telling jamie dimon and vikram pandit that the economy is tough now....
all joking aside, there is the worst waiter in new york at esca, who needs to learn when to shut up. after telling him twice, on 2 separate occasions that i've been to esca many times, he insisted on doing a 1-2 minute schpiel of the menu, i actually lost my calm at the table with him.
when i ordered this obscure italian wine called coenobium, made by nuns (alledgedly), this guy would not shut up about it, even though i've probably sold 5 or 6 cases of it myself to diners around the city. the worst man, the worst.
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sorry i come off as aggressive, but i'm very passionate about this.
when you write a letter, maybe the chef and owner will pass it back and forth around their management, sommeliers, wine director, dining room managers. its like a snowball effect, it gets bigger and bigger and more people just get pissed off. someone may lose a job over it.
but in reality if in person you just raised your hand, asked for a manager, and said
"i hate to do this, but, i'm not enjoying my meal here. i've been here before several times and i love babbo but i find my waiter to be condescending and the sommelier wasn't helpful at all and i really don't enjoy this wine. i'm having a bad experience and i just wanted to let you know."
i can't imagine that your experience wouldn't be turned around in a nanosecond and you would have been extremely taken care of after that.
I'm sorry but we ate there last Wednesday--it was wonderful--deconstructed osso buco, mint pillows, a 98 Barbaresco--wonderful service--quiet on the second floor--where were you? I think you need harmone pills!!
umm, i was talking about the right thing to do when something goes wrong at any restaurant, not just babbo.
i love babbo and i've never had a bad time there?
reading comprehension?
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i stopped by to take a peek. the new bouley is freaking gorgeous, it looks like a 3 star michelin country side restaurant in france. he still has the apples at the door, gorgeous slate and tile and marble everywhere, flowers, huge tables, space between tables, 3 rooms.
i wonder if its going to get a rereview by the bruni.
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Do high-end restaurants have thin profit margins?
absolutely!! but i think you're sarcastic, no? some make no profit at all. (see fleur de sel, fiamma).
i'm a little bit torn on momofuku ko not doing to-go bags. they have 2 michelin stars. on the other hand, they didn't want or ask for 2 michelin stars.
i tend to agree with the fact that most of these dishes are so small and so few bites and so temperature sensitive that packing them to go is ridiculous. there is the issue of presentation as well. a lamb chop just cooked served on slate or bernardaud or raynaud is much more fabulous than your microwaved lamb chop at home....
anyway, going for lunch tomorrow. will do full report!
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i'm sorry but i can't stand letter writing people. if you are having a bad time with your waiter or your wine, speak up. people speak up all the time. letter writers create real problems in the management chain and stress people out...if you had just said something during your dinner - all of your problems would have been fixed and you might have even got some free stuff out of it. (which is aparently what you want anyway...by writing this letter...to mr. bitali.)
Sorry, but I disagree with you about letter writing. Sure, depending on the situation it can be more effective to speak to a manager then and there. However, different situations may call for a different approach.
A few years ago I was entertaining foreign clients at Le Bernardin. The food was fine but there were several service slip-ups. I did my best to discreetly point them out to the server or captain (one of the issues was lack of proximity of someone in charge). However, problems continued throughout the meal. If I had made more of a fuss, it would have been awkward and potentially embarrassing in front of my guests. I also didn't feel it was incumbent upon me to get up from a business conversation in order to find an appropriate manager. It's also too late to fix certain problems once they have occurred.
In that case I wrote a letter and received an appropriate call apologizing. I was sent a gift certificate (I don't remember the exact amount...around $200) as compensation. I was satisfied with the response.
okay, i understand. when you are on a client dinner, entertaining clients, i totally can see that making a fuss is very unattractive to the guests you are entertaining. but i've been in that situation, and i still excuse myself to go to the "restroom" but i actually try to explain to a manager what was going wrong without creating a big fuss.
in my experience, letter writing people just want free stuff. if i have a bad time at a restaurant, i generally won't go back (for a while), free gift certificate to return or not.
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sorry i come off as aggressive, but i'm very passionate about this.
when you write a letter, maybe the chef and owner will pass it back and forth around their management, sommeliers, wine director, dining room managers. its like a snowball effect, it gets bigger and bigger and more people just get pissed off. someone may lose a job over it.
but in reality if in person you just raised your hand, asked for a manager, and said
"i hate to do this, but, i'm not enjoying my meal here. i've been here before several times and i love babbo but i find my waiter to be condescending and the sommelier wasn't helpful at all and i really don't enjoy this wine. i'm having a bad experience and i just wanted to let you know."
i can't imagine that your experience wouldn't be turned around in a nanosecond and you would have been extremely taken care of after that.
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They don't let you take leftovers to go? Why not??!
I've never been, but other restaurants have given me the following reasons for not allowing take-away:
The food suffers when not eaten right away (Frontera Grill).
They don't have take-away containers (most places in Japan).
They're worried about food safety (places in Japan during the O-157 scare, and a place in Dubai that made us sign a release before they'd let us take our food).
With Momofuku Ko, I would guess the primary reason is the first one.
it's called "take-out" on this side of the pond.
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Braised lamb belly, daikon and potato soup (like a vichyssoise), fried brussel sprouts, lily bulb - lamb belly is the new pork belly
lilly bulb is the new ciopolini
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i for one am very excited for the move. they need a new snazzy room to energize.
they were doing this industry night mondays back in december/november.... 5 courses for $45, no corkage. it was good but not great... actually for the price it was great. the service was eager but slightly awkward (there's one captain who's been there for 15 years and he kind of freaked me out a little bit, very strange.)
christopher lee is brilliant and i'm sure the bank of america space will be gleaming and sexy as hell... i heard may for an opening?
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awesome thread! i'm jealous of some of you guys:
this random sweetbread ravioli with lemon froth at emp for lunch - insane.
suckling pig at emp
foie gras terrine with raspberries? at emp. really the ever changing foie gras terrine at emp.
turbot/chateau chalon at JG
halibut/hon shimijis & lemongrass at JG
scallops/caper raisin cauliflower at JG (so often immitated by every other chef in the country and even myself)
peekytoecrab dumplings at JG
ginger rice bowl at Perry Street
knot foie at WD50
anything with uni at Soto
pasta with black truffles at robuchon
pasta with black truffles at per se
max's good appenzeller @ picholine "It will make you see Jesus" direct quote from the man himself. And I did.
peppadews with speck and mozzarella at casellula.
razor clams with cardamom at szechuan gourmet? (the one in the east 30's?)
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I decided on Le Bernardin only because I've been to French Laundry so we'll see how it goes!
I'm going to Paris in May for 2 weeks and haven't decided on my splurge meal. The problem is that I've read a lot about consistency issues at the restaurants. I'm actually considering going for lunch this time around...maybe Le Cinq. I went to Lyon a few years ago and visited Paul Bocuse. It was like Disneyland (ick). His truffle soup almost made the dinner worthwhile but the rest of the experience was blah.
please. i'm begging you. i've never been to the french laundry either. please just go to per se. you'll thank me.
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hey ue -
i have a res for lunch this weekend at per se, wanna join me?
hit me up on gmail. -
oh and tabla bread bar was perfect.....
had a nice beer flight tasting, the food was stellar, and i got a $24 coupon to come back this spring!
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i love centro vinoteca but i had a really random resto week menu there....if i had ordered a la carte the portions would have been much bigger (in my memory of the same dishes)...and the price would have been about the same.
had a surprisingly good resto week menu at benoit! very classic bistro french.
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I am looking for feedback and opinions...We have eaten many times at all Mr Bitali's places except for Del Posto..Babbo is my son's favorite and we go at least for his birthday once a year...Food is ALWAYS very good...sometimes we have had wonderful service...sometimes the waiters are very condescending. We had a so so waiter..and a really poor wine expert...he was unpleasant and did not seem to be familiar with the wines (to our astonishment)...the wine he brought was not to our liking but since it was opened we kept it and said nothing...what is one supposed to do?? I wrote a letter to Mr Bitali last week...I wonder if he will get it and if he will answer it...any opinions?? Thanks....
what were you supposed to do ??!?! its babbo! say "i don't like this wine, this is not how you described it at all. can we do something else please?" of course they would let you.
sounds like you were intimidated, and, in my experience babbo tries to do everything possible to not intimidate guests, starting with the rock and roll on the ipod.
i'm sorry but i can't stand letter writing people. if you are having a bad time with your waiter or your wine, speak up. people speak up all the time. letter writers create real problems in the management chain and stress people out...if you had just said something during your dinner - all of your problems would have been fixed and you might have even got some free stuff out of it. (which is aparently what you want anyway...by writing this letter...to mr. bitali.)
Edit
I'm sorry I have to dig further. Please I am not attacking you. But you said "the wine he brought us"
what I think happened is that you maybe ordered a wine and DECLINED HELP from a sommelier.
Why would you go to Babbo and not talk to a sommelier? They have 3 on the floor at most times.
Did you ask for a sommelier? Did you ask your waiter to recommend a wine? Did he say anything when you asked, like, "do you want red or white? Full bodied or light?" or did he just come back with a bottle?
And why should you be astonished? Babbo has, last time I was there, about 800-900 Italian wines. It's not the waiters job to be familiar with all of them (which is why they have 3 sommeliers).
Sounds like you were very unclear.
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i go back because i feel like i'm crazy that i don't love le bernardin. i want to love le bernardin. and i get bored of jean georges and emp (believe it or not!)
the more interesting topic is how different should a restaurant treat regulars than first time guests? shouldn't a first time guest be the most important?? i think so.
a buddy of mine was a captain at le bernardin and he told me that section 1 (the section closest to the front door) is where they put new service staff...they try to slam you with tables so you can prove yourself. i think that's disgusting. they put "rifraff" guests in the back near the back wall closest to the bathrooms and this rifraff gets the weaker waiters.
i for one think its horrible to treat guests so differently and to slam a new waiter so he can prove himself. kind of ridiculous. you can see if a waiter is good or not in about a week, slamming him just messes up service.
regulars should get the tables they like, but having a section for new guys, having a section for regulars, and having a section for the playbill holding ohio crowd is messed up if you ask me.
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funny i have never seen ripert in the dining room. i have never seen aldo sohm smile. actually, come to think of it, i can't remember anyone smiling at le bernardin. i feel like we are going to different restaurants?
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your dad was a smart man. viewing a difficult customer as a challenge makes it a lot more rewarding professionally, he's absolutely right.
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i mean just to give you an example
when i go to per se, everyone behind the door instantly knows me by name, welcomes me by name, welcomes me back with big smiles.
when i go to le bernardin, nobody smiles, nobody makes eye contact, and some clueless hostess is bumbling around looking for my reservation.
when i leave per se, they already have my jackets ready (no coat check ticket required)... they have something packed up for me to go (maybe i really liked the caramels at the end of the meal and they packed up 10 or so of them for the road)...
when you leave le bernardin you have to wait for someone to find your coat and there is no warm goodbye (at least not as warm as per se's)
these are just a few tiny examples. per se is in another league. and of course the managers at per se are going to be humble.... that's their schtick! can you imagine if they were arrogant about themselves, what a turnoff that would be!
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chefboy24, can you say more about your experiences with the two places? How often have you eaten there lately? Have you worked there or do you have inside knowledge about their management?
i have worked at neither. i had a totally disappointing $175 lunch at le bernardin maybe 2 weeks ago, just to really make sure i hated it. i was inspired to go by bruni's best meal of 2008...i respect bruni more than any other ny food critic. i have interviewed at per se a couple times and i have a few friends who work at per se but i have never worked for them.
at le bernardin....they have issues communicating... like whether you ordered a drink at the bar or not, putting that drink on the check.... whether you ordered wine yet. i always order whites and they always bring this weird ice bucket next to my table, and i always ask for my white to be on the table but they try 2-3 times to put it on ice.
also i've been there like 4, mayabe 5 or 6 times. i never get a welcome back. i tend to make same day lunch reservations and the hostesses look at opentable reports that are printed at maybe 10 am, and i always make my reservation around noon and for some reason they don't look at an up to date opentable screen, they look at a print out, so they never believe i have a reservation...what's worse is that the dining room is half full at lunch.
as for the menu at bernardin now... i have had the:
progression of oysters - boring
fluke with white soy - tasted oddly of $1 ramen noodle packet spices
crab with cauliflower and mousseline? - actually really awesome, i love good crab but the portion was so insanely small.
monkfish - totally boring and the rose water cous cous made me barf
black bass - brilliant peppercorn sauce but the only vege on my plate was 3 sad pieces of celery
halibut & brussels, uni sauce - couldn't taste the uni, and i've made better poached halibut in my house that i bought from bouley market or citarella
the amuse bouche at lunch is a salmon spread or salmon cream cheese? it totally tastes like it came from a good jewish deli.
and the waitstaff doesn't speak english!
i just. don't. get it.
and for $28 - you could eat much better at jean georges or emp for lunch.
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while i would never request asparagus in january...somebody might, and a great restaurant would get it for them. but lupa wouldn't. and i still love lupa, know what i'm saying?
I just think this is a crock of shit...if you're in Per Se, and you decide to order asparagus that's not on the menu and not in the house, you're not getting any friggin' asparagus...and then they'll say sorry sir or madam.
i know for a fact this is wrong. they run down to whole foods time warner all the time to pick up stuff for guests..... usually for whimsy (for example, like a hot dogs), but definitely also for requests.
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le bernardin is a joke. the fish are bland, there is no crunch, the cheese is horrible, the captains don't speak clear english.... oh, also, everyone is working a double and is tired and has been there for years and doesn't give a shit any more.
per se is 1000% better from the reservation to the greeting at the door to the menus, ambiance, decor, service, warmth, food quality, cheese, desserts, kitchen tour, petit fours, flowers, view, wine list.
i'd rather go to just about any 3 star than le bernardin.
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i guess you got the wrong impression. i love eating out in new york. but i've trained a lot of people. what it boils down to is the soul of a service staff...do they care? if yes.... then i'm at a restaurant where management hired staff who have that spark, that soul, that passion...it shines through in service and i am happy. and i am lucky to live in new york.
also - i don't believe in scripts. but please don't try to sell me bottled water like a used car salesman. and please offer me my table if my party hasn't arrived yet (if i'm in a fancy place).
while i would never request asparagus in january...somebody might, and a great restaurant would get it for them. but lupa wouldn't. and i still love lupa, know what i'm saying?
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also - on the topic of seating incomplete parties.
It really depends where you are. Actually I think it depends on the cost of the restaurant. If I'm going somewhere like Gilt or Adour or Cru...and the Maitre D / hostess told me that I couldn't be seated until my party was complete... I think I would turn around and walk out that door.
The only acceptable things that should be said are "Hello. You are the first to arrive. Would you like to wait at the bar or be taken to your table?"
I think its shitty that Babbo and Nobu won't seat an incomplete party, considering the cost of the meal.....the only reason they can get away with it is because they're so insanely popular to due B&T crowds, but really, its a horrible practice.
Bouley
in New York: Dining
Posted
i would prefer fewer choices in almost any case.
really i'd prefer great food in any case, but usually fewer choices equals better food.