Pizza Napoletana
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Posts posted by Pizza Napoletana
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A question on Sfogliatelle. The ones I am used to eating from bakeries have this layered outside shell. It almost looks like a fanned deck of cards. Does anyone know how this is achieved?
-Mike
Hard Work!!!!
Seriously, it is quite hard. You nedd to roll the pastry very thin, every time brushing both sides with lard. then you need to roll the pastry over itself as to form a stick. Cut it in small cilinders. then it becomes real complicated... (it is easy from this point but I can think of words to explain it...)
Ciao
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We'll be spending 3 days in Naples later this month and plan to visit several classic pizza places as well as trattorias. Any updates? I read a review on Gambero Rosso's website about La Notizia which sounds very good. Has anyone been there? We're also venturing into Molise to Campobasso to eat at 2 Gambero Rosso "Red" restaurants there, and to Bojano where there's one. Ending up with a night at the Torre Gaia "Wine Resort" near Dugenta in Campania. These places are somewhat off the beaten track, but - what do you all know?
I am sorry to be so bold, but forget La Notizia. Even on the Gambero Rosso online forum people couldn't believe why it was reviewed in the first place. If you had to visit 1 pizzeria, only one, then Salvo must be the one. Click here
Then Da Michele, Gorizia, Sorbillo Gino (not sure has re-opened as few weeks ago was going through refurbishment), Costa, Il PIzzaiolo del Presidente, Capasso, Cafasso but definetelly not La Notizia....
Dugenta is great area. Good wine, some olive oil, great Wild boar and a relxing environment.
Molise also produce one of the best olive oil in the country, so buy some.
Ciao
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The other day we had a "bake off" competition in the office. Well every week Wednesday a member of each team in my department needs to bake a cake on a theme chosen by the winner the previous week. The theme this week was Gateau..
So, inspired by a tart made by a great pastry chef in the Sorrento Costiera, I have created the following:
Caramelised William Pears topped Gateau, on a Lemon and Gran Marnier scented sponge cake case, filled with vanilla scented ricotta, lemon zest and chocolate chips on an Hazelnut short crust pastry base. Obviously I won ;-)
I was not really happy about the look of the pear topping, but the taste and texture of the whole thing was great, and I had never made it before, without following a recipe, it came out great...
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Talking about calzoni fritti, here are some of mines (please note in the background of the picture a pizzetta frtta topped with tomato):
and here some pizzette da I made last year and were fried at a lower temperature:
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FistFullaRoux,
Did you manage to go? Any pictures?
Thanks
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I Second "IL Pizzaiolo".
One of the very best Neapolitan Pizza in US.
The pasta dishes are also top notch..
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Morrison/safeway carrys Cirio Pelati. These are made of the San Marzano's most robust variety . Cirio actually has a kind of "seeds" bank were the original varieties (before the SM 2) are kept.
Il Miracolo di San Gennaro is quite good, but as far as I know is not available in UK.
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paccheri De Cecco or Setaro
Setaro great pasta! I would have rather said Setaro, Faella or Pastai Gragnagnesi and if not available, De Cecco (which is a good, but still commercial pasta, while the others are artisan products)
Good anyway.
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any of you would care of taking more pictures of their pizza?
Thanks
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Isn't it also sometimes soaked in limoncello?
The traditional is with Rhum... In the last 10 years the limoncello version have appeared. firstly it was a ring mould, filled with neapolitan pastry cream and soaked in limoncello. now they even sell min-baba, in jars soaked in limoncello...
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Pontormo-
And there you go bashing this traditional French...er...I mean Italian dessert. Actually up until reading about them in Naples at Table, I had no idea that those Babas (and Savarins) I've made are actually common in Italy.
It is a neapolitan dessert (not common in italy) which has reached Naples via France from Poland. Howevr in Naples it has found a new life, changing methodology, shape etc, and now is a completely different dessert.
The texture and flovour is unique
here are some pictures that do not really show this due to the flash reflecting on the shiny crumb
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There are two area of mozzarella production in Campania. One north of Naples is the "Caserta" region, with the major production towns of Aversa and Mondragone, while the other is in the Cilento region, south of Salerno (Battipaglia included)
Changing subject, here is a picture I have received from a pizzeria in Birmingham -Alabama for which I have worked as a Dough Consultant. It is a Marinara with fresh Oregano
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This is one of their Marinara with fresh oregano..
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Frying was/is a cheap way of cooking, which enanche many quality of simple raw ingredients.
Some vendors would set up on the street with a fire place that reassemble a big can ( 'o fucone) and a big deep frying pan on top, and would fry and sell hot to passers by. It is called "Frijenne 'magnanndo" and is a "way of life" in Naples...
Crocche, panzarotti, frittatine etc....
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...A16 in San Francisco. Would you say this is a great example of their pizza?
Thanks for the compliments.
However, for the reports and pictures I have seen, plus an inside info on their dough production and management, I have to say that A16's pizza should be a BAD example of an authentic Pizza Napoletana and thus of mine.
No offence , but you would have to go in Naples or at least at Il Pizzaiolo in Pittsburgh-PA to see a great example. Nowadays, It is very diffucult to find an outstanding Pizza even in the mother city, where out of 3000 odds pizzerie only few make an authentic traditional product.
Ciao
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Garofalo Pasta is a good commercial pasta compared to the like of Barilla, etc.. however is no where near the quality of the 2 best Gragnano producers.
Garofalo is an Industrial facility the other two are artisan producers.
Ciao
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Let's put the tradition aside and ask all the restaurators around the world if it is possible to cook pizza in series in a 30-45 seconds in any other medium rather then the Neapolitan Wood oven.... The answer is no!!!
It is not only a wood oven, it has to me Neapolitan. The material used (also in the isolating/ thermal mass), the techniques used and the diamension are all vital. There are oven that can cook pizza under the base and do not cook on top and viceversa. Other that cook a couple of pizza and then the "floor" loose heat and the bootom do not ccok anymore. Clay materials, isolator, thermal mass are vital. On the fuel side, there are gas burner that could be used in a brick oven but they do not compare to wood for at least the following reasons:
Do not produce charcoal that is so vital to keep a constant "floor" temperature
Do not genrate that minimum of humidity (dry wood still keeps a percentage of humidity)
\Do not generate any smooky floor that enanche the flavour profile.
You can still believe that there are alternatives, but in reality there aren't any.
PS I was just told that forno Napoletano has just been commissioned to re-place a poorly built oven, once again...
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The only thing I am not loving about the whole wood fire oven movement in pizza is that many places severly burn or scar the bottoms too much so the char overwhelms the rest of the pie. Perhaps they aren't cleaning their oven properly, I don't know.
Mostly is due to poorly built or mediocre ovens... They do not cook in an even way and therefore the bottom get burned while trying to cook the top.... To cook a proper Pizza Napoletana there is not any alternative to an authentic Forno Napoletano (www.forno-napoletano.it). Many people think that with any wood oven and with an italian flour and other ingredient they can serve a Pizza Napoletana... WRONG!!
On my consultancy service, I start with getting the client an authentic oven and a proper mixer (not a spiral or a planetary so often found in US/UK)...
At times however could be due to the guy cooking the pizza. In Naples usually is a job by itself. The "pizzaiolo" make the dough, form the disc and put the topping and the "fornaio" cook the pizza and manage the fire...
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What I would give to have one pizza of this calibre here in the UK. Our pizzas are uniformly awful, nothing to match even the middle-rated ones in New York. Here they're all tough, doughy, heavy crusted saucers over-topped and lacking that blisteringly scorched edge.
Pizza Napoletana, that is a mighty fine crust. Is the dough quite mature and/or soft when you bake it?
Dan
Hi Dan,
we have talked in the past regarding some italian starters.... I am based in UK
Anyway, After 6 years studying and researching this subject, I am confident to have re-created the Authentic Pizza Napoletana has it was made in 1700s Naples...
tiny bit of Crisceto (wild yeast), medium strenght flour, water, sea salt. Mixed in a special way, high hydration dough, long fermentation/maturation at room temperature and finaly but not least, baked in the very special Neapolitan Pizza Oven.
It is a dough that very difficult to control and handle, and that is the reasons that even in Naples the tradition is disappearing.. Out of almost 3000 pizzeria in the city, only an handful still make it properly....
By the way, try Donna Margherita in London for a Neapolitan pizza (they do not use the Crisceto and have a more modern tradition, but they do a fine job).
Ciao
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about the Naples at table recipe:
That is the traditional recipe, fried, candied fruit etc...
my preparation is quite differenet and you end up with a choccolate ball, like a profitterole....
Great!
About the pizza: I grow my own "piennolo" variety tomatoes, and when I have these I could put them on pizza. But rather then normal tomatoes (the round supermarket variety) or salads tomatoes, I better use good canned San Marzano.
Ciao
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PIZZA MARGARITA!
I do not follow any recipe for tomato sauce, I just use good quality canned tomatoes BOTH onions and garlic, dried oregano and some fresh basil.
Hi
the sauce should not contain anything but salt if you really need to. It should be just made of crushed peeled San Marzano tomatoes. It should not be cooked.
In addition, the Margherita should not include garlic, onion and oregano.
Below is few example of my margherita, marinara and the crust consistency and structure:
Darn it, I knew this was going to happen!
I am not even going to think about arguing with a person named Pizza Napoletana about...pizza Napoletana. You are certainly more in the know about this than I am. I can only point you to my original disclaimer and apology and please apply that to Pizza Margarita too.BTW, and I apologize for any Neapolitans here for this, but I am planning to break one rule Mr. Schwartz talks about quiet often. I am talking about the "ONLY use garlic OR onions, but not both in a dish"!!! I say that is nuts and in my book the two usually go hand in hand. so be forwarned, rampant rule breaking will ensue here and I will make sure to document itOn the bright side I did use very good quality San Marzano tomatoes and I used the onion/garlic/herbs very sparingly. I also have tried the no cook-pure canned tomato version before (granted not in Naples, but in my kitchen) and I prefer the one I make
.What's up with the eggplant in chocolate sauce? I am so intrigued with this I might try it this weekend for a dolci course. Anyone tried it? thoughts?
Onion and Garlic go very well in the Ragu sauce.....
About the cooked sauce preference.... I was in Pittsburgh-PA on a consulting trip and voice got around that a Neapolitan pizzamaker was in town.. I was invited at home of a lady with a wood oven because she was not able to use it properly. She prepared all the ingredient for us, and there it was: Cooked sauce with herbs.... Very politely I told her to cook some pasta and dress it with that sauce ;-) and then asked her for a can of San Marzano.... I crushed these by hand, did my pizza, and she went: "I did not realise could use uncooked sauce and get a pizza that taste better....."
Anyway, to conclude, about the Eggplant/choccolate dessert, I normally do a modern version, inspired by Don Alfonso restaurant, but quite changed by myself. It is sublime.. I only have bad picture of it, before I had a digital camera...
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My goodness, P.N., that Pizza looks fantastic! I long to be back in Napoli for la vera pizza napoletana.
I was under the impression that mozzarella di bufala had a higher moisture content than fior di latte, although the moisture content of both is proportional to their freshness. It is the moisture content of the bufala that requires an oven with a very high temp so that the crust doesn't get soggy.
In southern Campania, around Paestum in Salerno province all of the bufala is used. The meat, as one might imagine, is quite beeflike.
The Mozzarella di Bufala was drained for 12 hours
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PIZZA MARGARITA!
I do not follow any recipe for tomato sauce, I just use good quality canned tomatoes BOTH onions and garlic, dried oregano and some fresh basil.
Hi
the sauce should not contain anything but salt if you really need to. It should be just made of crushed peeled San Marzano tomatoes. It should not be cooked.
In addition, the Margherita should not include garlic, onion and oregano.
Below is few example of my margherita, marinara and the crust consistency and structure:
Naples Restaurants: Reviews & Recommendations
in Italy: Dining
Posted
You may want to check this post:
http://forums.egullet.org/index.php?showto...dpost&p=1012377