azlee
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Posts posted by azlee
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i've been looking for a replacement block for my Wusthof knives but have limited counter space and i also need a way to store my set of 3 Global knives so that i can actually see them and remember to use them. would the global set fit in the 'Ex' is a magnetic rail a better solution? Global does a very nice looking rail but it's very long and very expensive. thanks
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Jason: I'd disagree with one thing in your blog, "sucrose" is the sugar extracted from both cane and beets. Your blog indicates it is from sugar beets only.
---Guy
My understanding is that Coca-Cola of Hawthorne, NY, who makes the OU KFP stuff for the Northeast, uses beet sugar, not Cane sugar. Cane sugar is a very expensive ingredient and it has other residual compounds in it to give it that "caney" flavor besides just the Sucrose that is processed.
Coca-Cola finally responded to my email inquiry, too late for this Passover but perhaps in time to buy a few left over bottles, this year. According to Coca-Cola's Industry and Consumer Affairs department they use sucrose made from cane sugar in their kosher brand Coca-Cola.
Thank you for passing along that information. The value of the few cans I still have left just skyrocketed
=R=
Congrats on your cola windfall! I hope that I can still get in on the cane cola action. If I am lucky the price may have dropped as the stores clear out the last leftover bottles.
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Jason: I'd disagree with one thing in your blog, "sucrose" is the sugar extracted from both cane and beets. Your blog indicates it is from sugar beets only.
---Guy
My understanding is that Coca-Cola of Hawthorne, NY, who makes the OU KFP stuff for the Northeast, uses beet sugar, not Cane sugar. Cane sugar is a very expensive ingredient and it has other residual compounds in it to give it that "caney" flavor besides just the Sucrose that is processed.
Coca-Cola finally responded to my email inquiry, too late for this Passover but perhaps in time to buy a few left over bottles, this year. According to Coca-Cola's Industry and Consumer Affairs department they use sucrose made from cane sugar in their kosher brand Coca-Cola.
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Jason: I'd disagree with one thing in your blog, "sucrose" is the sugar extracted from both cane and beets. Your blog indicates it is from sugar beets only.
---Guy
Does anyone know for sure, whether the KfP Coke is made with cane sugar or with beet sugar? Important to know for people allergic to beet sugar. Thanks.
Edited for afterthought. :-)
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Thanks guys. Now I have another problem: I can't have the pro-stye range I want because my hood does not vent outside. Back to the drawing board on the range front.
you might want to consider the bosch or siemens range <http://www.boschappliances.com/category.cfm?cat_id=5> they each have matching over the range microwave/hoods. the dacor ranges also allow for a recirculating hood. but for my space problems i'd be using the dacor pair, for sure. what features were you specifically looking for in a range?
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where do you guys find a liebherr in Manhattan? I would get that if I can find it. My designer is recommending a 24" Summit, which I find extremely ugly.
The Liebherr is available in several places in Manhattan, Krups on W. 18th street; Manhattan Center for Kitchen and Bath <http://www.mckb.com/> on E. 19th street; FlameTech on Bowery in Chinatown. Also Drimmer's in Brooklyn have them.
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Azlee, as we work on finding smallish stuff for one of the areas of our kitchen, I've found some great stuff that we put in the "when we get a NYC apartment" file.
Miele does a speed oven with a microwave function: critical for popcorn! (I have teenaged sons whose friends run in and out in packs ...) Liebherr does a really nice 24" refrigerator, bottom freezer. It's less expensive, gives better use of space, and is more energy efficient than almost anything else I've found. I agree with the induction cooktop; I've used them at work and school, and they will be in the empty-nester's nest when the time comes.
I don't know about a small gas cooktop, though; ventilation is always an issue in my mind.
I saw a "non-kitchen" designed for a city apartment in a magazine not long ago. It was basically set into a bank of wall cabinetry, and was for people who simply did not cook. It was pretty cool, too.
Thanks, yes. I'm trying to choose between the 24" and 30" Liebherr fridge. If I could just commit to the smaller fridge I could also make a decision on an over the range micro-convection oven. I'm leaning toward the sharp model 1874 now but it is 30" wide. I haven't come across anything similar that would work in 24" or 27". This is key since I may be living without an oven and cooktop until my custom cabinets are delivered (about 4 months) and would at least like to be able to heat small meals. I like the idea of keeping a file of kitchen ideas.
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That's a great attitude, you have to live there so you should make it suitable for living first and foremost. I always think people are crazy that try to keep everything pristine for some future buyer, or, conversly won't spend the money to make a place comfortable enough to be livable.
Thanks. I'm definitely willing to spend on this project but I'd like to spend wisely for great tools and space that I will enjoy using. The hardest choice seems to be cold storage and cooking appliances.
Also hoping that the price of stainless starts to go down or at least stabilize because I'd really love to use a stainless countertop with an integrated sink. Does anyone know of great stainless countertop fabricators in the five boroughs?
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Azlee I don't want to throw another wrench in the works, but if you're renovating with an eye towards resale at all, you have to also consider this. Someone who loves to cook, and who would appreciate all your very high end appliances will also want a much larger kitchen. It's like putting all the very expensive high end Lexus extras into a VW. Your kitchen will be exquisite with all these very high end fittings but will the loss of ease of cooking in such a small space justify their cost? Just something to consider!I also have a small kitchen, 5.5' X 10.5 feet. I'm going with the 10 cf. euro style LG fridge. Looked at the Liebherr but it's so tall, I don't want to use a step stool to get to the top shelf. It's also beautiful, and less than 1/3 of the price. I think $2,500 for a 24" fridge is insanely expensive too! The LG is large enough for me. I'm in Manhattan, and have markets all over. I'm just one person and don't need a larger fridge really, and I love the freezer drawers. I reconfigured my kitchen so I would have more counter space to cook instead of a larger fridge. If I don't have the room to cook, there's not going to be much in the fridge anyway...LOL! I'm using an 18" D/W mostly because I want to be able to run it more frequently, and the 24" takes too long to fill up. I'm also using a 30" range, OTR micro and whatever sink will fit in a 24" cabinet.
Blondelle,
That sounds very much like my planned set-up, except that I can't decide on the fridge. I know that $2,500 is alot for a fridge, but I live in a neighborhood where many would solve a similar space problem with a subzero and that is an expense ( over $5k w/ ss panel) that I personally cannot justify or afford. I guess alot of sticker shock comes with a small kitchen renovation.
i'm less concerned with resale than with having what i want in the kitchen. i personally don't care much for open kitchens and so i want to find as much usable space as possible in my small space and make it nice because i intend to enjoy it while i'm here. as far as resale, it should show well when the time comes, but if someone wanted to rearrange things or take a wall down they could certainly make good use of what i leave behind. the interesting thing is that i have an otherwise rather roomy 2 bedroom apartment. the designing architect of the building didn't think much about cooking, so he put all the space into the other rooms.
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I also have a small kitchen, 5.5' X 10.5 feet. I'm going with the 10 cf. euro style LG fridge. Looked at the Liebherr but it's so tall, I don't want to use a step stool to get to the top shelf. It's also beautiful, and less than 1/3 of the price. I think $2,500 for a 24" fridge is insanely expensive too! The LG is large enough for me. I'm in Manhattan, and have markets all over. I'm just one person and don't need a larger fridge really, and I love the freezer drawers. I reconfigured my kitchen so I would have more counter space to cook instead of a larger fridge. If I don't have the room to cook, there's not going to be much in the fridge anyway...LOL! I'm using an 18" D/W mostly because I want to be able to run it more frequently, and the 24" takes too long to fill up. I'm also using a 30" range, OTR micro and whatever sink will fit in a 24" cabinet.
Blondelle,
That sounds very much like my planned set-up, except that I can't decide on the fridge. I know that $2,500 is alot for a fridge, but I live in a neighborhood where many would solve a similar space problem with a subzero and that is an expense ( over $5k w/ ss panel) that I personally cannot justify or afford. I guess alot of sticker shock comes with a small kitchen renovation.
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Does anyone have a Liebherr fridge? A sub-zero would be a perfect fit w/ a full size range but the price, to me, is insanely high and I always hear that they (sub-zero)have a lot of service problems. If only I had another inch of wall space...
Well, any good kitchen designer or architect will have a wall-stretcher.
I don't have a Liebherr, but have installed many of them over the past 2-3 years. They are highly recommended by those that own them. I think their biggest downfall in North America is that few people know about them. LG also makes a couple 24" fridges, but they are "cheaper" in qaulity than the Liebherr IMO.
What size sink are you planning, or is this not negotiable. Kitchens this small benefit from a single bowl sink, which frees up more room on the countertop. This is the only downside to using a larger range ... less counterspace. Can you live with the Kuppersbusch combination (induction ROCKS btw!)? That would maximize the work space.
A.
Daddy-A,
Just curious are there any 24" or 27" induction cooktops that you would recommend? Which cooktop do you have? Can you use a griddle on an induction top (like maybe a Le Crueset Griddle)? Thanks
Azlee
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I am fighting the same battle right now. My kitchen is 8 x 8 and somehow, I am going to fit a DCS or GE Monogram stove in there come hell or high water and I want a Miele dishwasher as well. The decorator is talking me out of a bigger fridge but has found a 24" fridge with a bottom draw freezer. Will post pictures when I see them.
i did leave myself the option of a dishwasher for the future. the connection is plumbed and capped. it would likely be an 18" miele.
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Azlee - if you are used to gas, and unused to electric ceramic, the answer *IS* induction when gas is impossible. (Ordinary ceramic is desperately unresponsive, and simmering on halogen...
)For a confined space, you need the cooktop/hob as available prep space. Ceramic makes that possible. Touch controls rather than knobs makes it a much bigger, more useful space. And the low residual heat of induction makes the space available more of the time. It worked for me (and I wasn't quite so cramped!)
If you are using *glass* (rather than glass ceramic) things on gas, you'll be familiar with the flametamer concept. The point is that you can get something similar to allow you to use 'non-induction' cookware on induction. Not ideal, but possible.
Yes, European kitchens are almost all designed around a 600mm (near 24") module.
I'd suggest a tall unit in one corner with an oven above a fridge. Alongside that, I'd have the induction hob, ideally with freezer beneath.
On the opposite side, I'd have a 1 and 1/2 bowl sink in a full run of worktop, with shallow cupboards above. If you insist on a dishwasher, you could have one under there (I wouldn't)
Look to use every scrap of 3D space usefully. How about hanging the pans above the central aisle? Take the trouble to allow the lowest part of all the pans (not the hooks) to line up...
And have you considered that Ikea ought to have European-sized 600mm kitchen cabinets, at a saving that might easily allow you an induction hob and new Le Creuset pans?
i like the idea of separate fridge and freezer but worry that it will send my budget sailing off the charts if i keep adding separate appliance components. still i will definitely consider induction. perhaps one induction component and one conventional ceramic glass cooktop component. or perhaps i should gather all my cookware and see what will work with induction. perhaps more of it is usuable than i think. at the moment i'll be using 60" of open shelving over the sink side of cabinets and an italian stainless grid with movable storage on an otherwise unusable brick wall to store spices, condiments and smaller containers of sugar, flour and rice for easy access. http://www.containerstore.com/browse/Produ...333&CATID=74107
I am excited about the flexibility of the grid system.
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I have an itty bitty kitchen like yours and we chose a smaller dishwasher (for 8 place settings instead of full size), full size cooktop and oven, and did not choose the big fridge - we went smaller which is standard in Europe. The oven would still be considered a bit small but it does just fine. Having all the burners for me was essential to being able to cook properly, as well as a good sized real oven where I can bake and roast normally. We went with a contemporary vitroceramic top for both workspace and lack of gas connection, and I love it as much as I did gas (plus being able to mince and chop on one side while cooking on another is good in a small space). The fridge could actually be smaller than it is, and we'd be happy. I live in the city and don't really stock up though.
i do like the idea of being able to use the ceramic cooktop as extra counter space.
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Does anyone have a Liebherr fridge? A sub-zero would be a perfect fit w/ a full size range but the price, to me, is insanely high and I always hear that they (sub-zero)have a lot of service problems. If only I had another inch of wall space...
Well, any good kitchen designer or architect will have a wall-stretcher.
I don't have a Liebherr, but have installed many of them over the past 2-3 years. They are highly recommended by those that own them. I think their biggest downfall in North America is that few people know about them. LG also makes a couple 24" fridges, but they are "cheaper" in qaulity than the Liebherr IMO.
What size sink are you planning, or is this not negotiable. Kitchens this small benefit from a single bowl sink, which frees up more room on the countertop. This is the only downside to using a larger range ... less counterspace. Can you live with the Kuppersbusch combination (induction ROCKS btw!)? That would maximize the work space.
A.
Daddy-A, I'd love an induction cooktop but have never taken the time to see which of my masses of cookware would work with it. I have some glass cookware that I know will not work and I'd hate to give that up.
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For extra space, also consider a movable butcher block type cart on wheels. You could store other things under it and move it out of the way when it's not needed.
Marlene, there will be two movable carts in the pantry closet. On will have the food processor and the other my kitchenaid mixer. there's no room to have anything else on the floor in the kitchen and only room for one person to work at a time in there. :-)
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^
the floor is already grouted (paid for), so i doubt there is an option of carving out more space. it's a tough call, i personally would like to go with more dry storage than either stove or fridge if i was in, say, Brooklyn, but then again not many folks there have as much kitchen stuff and dry goods as I do, i imagine. i like counter space as well, and at 5 by 7, i'm guessing that is what 7'-4'+2'=5' maximum if you have a single bowl sink. i would definately maximize counterspace and go with fewer, smaller appliances.
I plan to convert a nearby closet into a pantry for dry goods and equipment storage (but sadly, the space is not suitable for the fridge.) I have plenty of kitchen stuff collected over almost 40 years of cooking. I'm mostly looking for counter space and cooking space in the kitchen. The sink will be small but deep and covered with a cutting board some of the time in order to gain extra counter space. And given that the floor is finished you're right, that it would be a nightmare to start moving walls now, if it could be done. If I bite the bullet and pay for extra cabinets and go with the 24" fridge and 24" cooking setup, I could squeeze maybe another 9" of counter and storage space out of the kitchen but the extra cost may not be worth it in the end. So many choices...
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I am also in Brooklyn and aside from wanting to store Fresh Direct pizzas and the occasional turkey in my freezer, ... The fridge part of the Liebherr is probably adequate, it's the freezer part that concerns me. It would probably be healthier to do more daily shopping for fresh foods and Brooklyn is one of the best places to do that kind of shopping.
Cheers
Azlee
FROZEN PIZZA in Brooklyn? Shame on you! Frozen turkey? Really, if you limit those two items you will probably have more than enough room in the freezer.
I should talk, my freezer is full of duck fat, pork skin, chicken carcasses and other things which I can't identify anymore.
Let us know how it works out.
Jason
Well, the pizza is actually for my teenaged nephew who visits and likes to midnight snack on pizza and the turkey I get free about twice a year from the local supermarket at the holidays. Mostly, my freezer is filled with lots of unsalted butter bought on sale and homemade puff pastry leaves for emergency hors d'oeuvres and of course ICE CREAM. I have to place my appliance orders soon and will keep y'all posted. Does anyone have a Liebherr fridge? A sub-zero would be a perfect fit w/ a full size range but the price, to me, is insanely high and I always hear that they (sub-zero)have a lot of service problems. If only I had another inch of wall space...
of course, now i'll have to buy fancy european cabinets to accomodate the cooktop and oven. i wonder why none of the appliances manufacturers make a stainless rack that would hold both 24" components. kuppersbusch actually makes a rack to hold a 36" oven and cooktop but not for their smaller components.
Two items to comment on "If only I had another inch of wall space..." ...and "now I'll have to buy fancy european cabinets..." What type of building do you live in? Do you have a Contractor yet? Carving out that other inch is not unheard of and solutions can get pretty creative. If you have a Contractor, have them do the necessary due diligence to see if a little demolition and reframing may get you your inch. The other item to consider is the cabinets. For the price of Poggenpohl cabinets you can have your cabinets custom made by someone local. Custom cabinets may allow you to pick up that extra inch or accommodate whatever may be in the way that doesn't allow you to pick up that inch.
Thanks for the suggestions, unfortunately, we cannot carve out an extra inch on that particular wall. We were able to carve out a needed half inch on the opposite kitchen wall for the base cabinets. The wall with the appliances would only have a single cabinet for the cooktop and oven, using a european cabinet manufacturer for the european appliances is probably more time and cost efficient in this case, since they already make cabinets specifically for that application. If I can avoid the need for any base cabinet on the appliance wall (for example, if I go with the 24" fridge and 30" range) I can use any brand of cabinets.
I just meant that use of the euro sized cooking appliances would likely require a euro cabinet. I'll try to post some sample layouts, if I can. That might make it easier to understand the limitations.
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We have a 24" Liebherr, which we bought in August 2005. So, I can't say anything about the longer term, but so far we love it. It is well designed, quiet, and super efficient. I describe it as a super model ( tall, sleek, styllish) crossed with a librarian (quiet, efficient).
We had a similiar dilemma with a smallish kitchen - actually more of an awkward kitchen, and opted for standard cooktop/oven and sleek, stylish, skinny refrigerator. There is a thread lurking around in the depths of egullet that lays out our particular situation - but that is largely irrelevant to you.
My recommendation - based on experience with the Liebherr and the standard size oven/range - is to do just that. We occasionally have to resort to a cooler to keep beer/sodas/ice cold if we are having a party, but that has been the only inconvenience. And we usually have 10 lbs of chicken in our freezer at any given time (long tangent - it is for the dog - spoilt damn dog).
I have lived in apartments with small stoves/cooktops and infinitely prefer the convenience of having a cooktop on which you can have at least two largish pots/pans, and an oven in which you put two 9 inch cakes pans next to each other.
So, in summary:
Love the Liebherr
Buy the biggest range/oven you can!
Good luck with the new kitchen!
Crouching Tyler, I found your thread and your kitchen is really charming. Tough layout with so many openings. I love the idea of closing in your porch to make more space. Thanks for your input on the Liebherr. I think I just need to take along some containers from foods I usually keep and see if they fit.
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Does anyone have a Liebherr fridge? A sub-zero would be a perfect fit w/ a full size range but the price, to me, is insanely high and I always hear that they (sub-zero)have a lot of service problems. If only I had another inch of wall space...
Well, any good kitchen designer or architect will have a wall-stretcher.
I don't have a Liebherr, but have installed many of them over the past 2-3 years. They are highly recommended by those that own them. I think their biggest downfall in North America is that few people know about them. LG also makes a couple 24" fridges, but they are "cheaper" in qaulity than the Liebherr IMO.
What size sink are you planning, or is this not negotiable. Kitchens this small benefit from a single bowl sink, which frees up more room on the countertop. This is the only downside to using a larger range ... less counterspace. Can you live with the Kuppersbusch combination (induction ROCKS btw!)? That would maximize the work space.
A.
Hi there! good to hear that Liebherr are loved by those who own them. The sink will probably be a 20" sink in a 24" cabinet and two 18" cabinets next to that, one with drawers, the other rollouts, I think.
Recycling and trash under the sink cabinet. I am thinking Poggenpohl for cabinets. I wish it could be Bulthaup. As it is, I may have to wait a bit before ordering the cabinets.
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I am also in Brooklyn and aside from wanting to store Fresh Direct pizzas and the occasional turkey in my freezer, ... The fridge part of the Liebherr is probably adequate, it's the freezer part that concerns me. It would probably be healthier to do more daily shopping for fresh foods and Brooklyn is one of the best places to do that kind of shopping.
Cheers
Azlee
FROZEN PIZZA in Brooklyn? Shame on you! Frozen turkey? Really, if you limit those two items you will probably have more than enough room in the freezer.
I should talk, my freezer is full of duck fat, pork skin, chicken carcasses and other things which I can't identify anymore.
Let us know how it works out.
Jason
Well, the pizza is actually for my teenaged nephew who visits and likes to midnight snack on pizza and the turkey I get free about twice a year from the local supermarket at the holidays. Mostly, my freezer is filled with lots of unsalted butter bought on sale and homemade puff pastry leaves for emergency hors d'oeuvres and of course ICE CREAM. I have to place my appliance orders soon and will keep y'all posted. Does anyone have a Liebherr fridge? A sub-zero would be a perfect fit w/ a full size range but the price, to me, is insanely high and I always hear that they (sub-zero)have a lot of service problems. If only I had another inch of wall space...
of course, now i'll have to buy fancy european cabinets to accomodate the cooktop and oven. i wonder why none of the appliances manufacturers make a stainless rack that would hold both 24" components. kuppersbusch actually makes a rack to hold a 36" oven and cooktop but not for their smaller components.
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I am also in Brooklyn and aside from wanting to store Fresh Direct pizzas and the occasional turkey in my freezer, ... The fridge part of the Liebherr is probably adequate, it's the freezer part that concerns me. It would probably be healthier to do more daily shopping for fresh foods and Brooklyn is one of the best places to do that kind of shopping.
Cheers
Azlee
FROZEN PIZZA in Brooklyn? Shame on you! Frozen turkey? Really, if you limit those two items you will probably have more than enough room in the freezer.
I should talk, my freezer is full of duck fat, pork skin, chicken carcasses and other things which I can't identify anymore.
Let us know how it works out.
Jason
Well, the pizza is actually for my teenaged nephew who visits and likes to midnight snack on pizza and the turkey I get free about twice a year from the local supermarket at the holidays. Mostly, my freezer is filled with lots of unsalted butter bought on sale and homemade puff pastry leaves for emergency hors d'oeuvres and of course ICE CREAM. I have to place my appliance orders soon and will keep y'all posted. Does anyone have a Liebherr fridge? A sub-zero would be a perfect fit w/ a full size range but the price, to me, is insanely high and I always hear that they (sub-zero)have a lot of service problems. If only I had another inch of wall space...
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I'm starting to think this is going to be a really hard decision. Harder than choosing tile or fixtures or deciding whether or not to tear down walls. I tend to order shelf staples and longer lasting fresh veggies and meat for the freezer from Fresh Direct every other week or every third week depending upon my at home schedule and buying fresh foods in the neighborhood, as needed. I do keep leftovers but often do not get back to them before they spoil. i wonder if having a smaller fridge might force me to waste less?
"The Ex" knife block
in Kitchen Consumer
Posted
Thanks, the wavy drawer knife block at Chef Depot looks great! That combined with a couple of magnetic strips may be just the ticket.
Thanks again