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Rose petals


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#31 Suvir Saran

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Posted 01 August 2002 - 08:00 AM

There were a couple of questions about my Rose Opera Cake. 

I was so psyched up about the rose idea that I wanted to use it for something, and I wanted to use it in a completely different way than I was seeing it used.  I also had an idea that rose would be great with dark chocolate.  The project I had at the time was to create French-style pastries using Indian flavors and spices.

My Rose opera is a traditional style opera cake except that I make a pistachio jaconde, use rose buttercream, and infuse the dark chocolate ganache with cardamom.  I like the colors (green, pink, dark brown).  When sufficiently motivated I serve it with a tiny decorative rosebud (made of chocolate) on top.  I think it would be a tasty and beautiful plated dessert served with a plain creme anglaise, a rose syrup, a small dome of pistachio cream with an Adria-style thin caramel tuile with bits of candied rose petals suspended in it. 


Posted Image

Chefette,

Thanks for sharing the recipe and the pics. It seems lovely and I am sure tastes very good too.
What restaurant menu did you do this for?

#32 chefette

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Posted 01 August 2002 - 08:03 AM

This was one of the items I developed working with Steve on plans for Restaurant Ada. Due to circumstances, this dessert was never introduced there. I may demo it or serve it this year at the Salon Culinaire in NYC in November. (The International Hotel, Motel & Restaurant Show.)

#33 mhadam

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Posted 01 August 2002 - 08:10 AM

Posted Image

Cheffette....that is wondeful.. I am in awe. :wub: I'm planning on making a birthday cake for my mother and think I have found my inspiration.

It is utterly lovely.

maggie
There's a yummy in my tummy.

#34 Miss J

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Posted 01 August 2002 - 08:16 AM

Seriously impressive, chefette. Now if we could just work out a way for you to do international mail order... :wink:

#35 Suvir Saran

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Posted 01 August 2002 - 08:27 AM




Posted Image


It is utterly lovely.

maggie

It is lovely. ANd what a great picture too. How well composes. And the roses are so beautiful. The shadows between the rose petals just go so beautifully with the layers of the cake. A grand idea.

Ada would have been too lucky to have had it on their menu and not prepared enough to serve it with circumspect aura. I am sure when you find a home worthy of its inclusion, this cake will charm many.

Even through the screen it moves me. How kind of you to have taken the time to share a picture. Thanks!

#36 Suvir Saran

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Posted 01 August 2002 - 08:31 AM

Chefette,

I bake a lot. Maybe a few times every week. But I have never made an Opera cake. Actually for that matter, I have never made any layer cake. :shock:

Are such cakes very difficult to prepare? Tedious? Both?

Would it be possible for home chefs to make these without feeling overwhelmed?

#37 chefette

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Posted 01 August 2002 - 08:47 AM

The cake for this is a jaconde - a very thin cake. It isn't hard, but it isn't easy either since you foam the whites and yolks seperately and need to get it in the oven very quickly. At home it is hard to get the oven hot enough, and there is not enough space to bake off a batch all at once. You also need to be attentive so that you do not overbake the cake so it is too dry. There are certainly other approaches and adaptations that might make the cake portion easier at home. Otherwise the only tricky part is to get everything layered really evenly so you don't end up with thin spots and huge munga blobs of cream.

It is very rich so a small piece is satisfying.

I was hesitant at first to serve this cake to many people since I was concerned they would find it too strange. In its very first airing - an AIWF event, I had it out in all its full glory (WITH the mini roses that I spent HOURS making for the 200 pieces) and it seemed no one was eating any. Generated interest and all, but not many takers. THEN, at the end of the event almost everyone swept by with a plate or cup or some container to 'take a couple home for the kids'. I felt very flattered in the end. Generally, I think people are attracted to it because of its interesting colors and so far it has had nothing but rave reviews.

I just served it together with a traditional opera at a party over the weekend as a petit four and it left the poor time honored hazelnut and coffee version in the dust.

#38 FoodMan

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Posted 01 August 2002 - 09:37 AM

And Suvir--I'm reading a few Greek and Middle eastern cookbooks right now and a few of them mention that red rose petals are the most fragrant.  Have you only seen pink used in India?

As far as I know the pink ones with smallish petals are the most fragrant. My grandmother has several bushes of these roses surrounding her garden in my native Lebanon. I have never seen these roses in the US (probably because they do not look as pretty as the long stem/big petals ones that we see at the flower stores). She uses the roses every year to make home made "rose water". Oh boy I cannot describe how good the whole house smells when she makes it. hmmmm.... memory lane

she never made rose petal jam though



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#39 Steve Klc

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Posted 01 August 2002 - 10:01 AM

do you recall her technique FM?
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#40 nyfirepatrolchef

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Posted 01 August 2002 - 12:01 PM

Sahadi Importers has the preserve too.

Do you know what the preserve tastes like? Where is it from?
Thanks for sharing this. :biggrin:

Tis Romanian!
Its just I love Sahadis from the day I walked in there for the first time...and the owner is such a decent standup kinda guy I have a personal pleadge to plug his shop all I can.
Havent tasted it....its got sugar...nono for me
*sigh*

#41 nyfirepatrolchef

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Posted 01 August 2002 - 12:05 PM

Quote : Suvir "They simply take several tons of rose petals and dry them in unending yardage of white muslin that is draped over the grass in the palace in Jaipur."

Sigh.  It sounds soooo exotic and soooo beutiful. 

I have always been attracted to the rose thing - Like Water for Chocolate, Candied Rose Petals, Rose ice cream...  I recently purchased a bottle of Rose Petal Jam at a Market in Massachusets.  I am far away from my fridge right now so don't know brand but have a sense that it might have been imported from England.  At the price I paid it should have been imported straight from The 'Palace in Jaipu'  (flutey music and wafting white curtains when you read that phrase please).  Anyway, its really pretty, tastes yummy, and - best of all - has rose petals suspended in it.

Interesting point earlier about the different colored rose petals.  Thinking about my own experience the petals used have invariably been pink ones.  Never thought about it before.  Hmmmmm.  The possibilities...

I developed a Rose Opera Cake as a special dessert for an Indian Restaurant I was working with.  My original idea was to serve it as a petit four on a candied rose petal. 

I did serve the cake - sans petal at the NY Chocolate Show last fall during my demo on sculpting and it was very enthusiastically received. :smile:

figures...the one year I dont make the damned show....Id love to have seen it....as you can imagine my brain was just a little scrambled at that point in time....I just plain forgot about the show.

When I could drink it I used rose water in midestern coffee....and used rose syrup over a good vanilla ice cream.
Got one of my more adventurous coworkers to try it too.
she got past the funky scent and really enjoyed it...("hey mikey...pass the bottle down will ya?")

#42 nyfirepatrolchef

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Posted 01 August 2002 - 12:14 PM

Greeks and Eastern Mediterranean--I think mostly to make jams and rosewater--which would then be used in syrups, pastries with phyllo, served with rice puddings, ice cream, little fruit mixtures.  For beverages, I've come across recipes for cold almond milk drinks flavored with rose and even plain spring water perfumed with rose petals.  In desserts, rose seems most often combined with other flavors like mastic, orange blossom water, pistachios, lemon but really, you can find recipes and references to rosewater being combined with many, many things--all dried fruits, pomegranate seeds, etc. The one or two Turkish books I have have some interesting traditional dishes--a milk pudding with rosewater and a rice pudding with saffron and rosewater.

Suvir--have you ever seen preserves with the whole petal intact--as in the Canadian example I have?  I love the Diana Vreeland pink as the navy blue of India line.

Steve~
recipes for the almond/milk drink please???
if it wouldnt be too awful with soy milk substituted....Id love something new and fun.

#43 nyfirepatrolchef

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Posted 01 August 2002 - 12:16 PM




Posted Image


It is utterly lovely.

maggie

It is lovely. ANd what a great picture too. How well composes. And the roses are so beautiful. The shadows between the rose petals just go so beautifully with the layers of the cake. A grand idea.

Ada would have been too lucky to have had it on their menu and not prepared enough to serve it with circumspect aura. I am sure when you find a home worthy of its inclusion, this cake will charm many.

Even through the screen it moves me. How kind of you to have taken the time to share a picture. Thanks!

oooooh YEAH just ROSY baby!~
*cues Austin Powers theme*

#44 FoodMan

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Posted 01 August 2002 - 12:40 PM

do you recall her technique FM?

I do recall the basic technique. I wish I paid more attention, but at the time I just took it for granted I guess. Basically the first step is to dry the roses in the sun. Then to extract the rose water she uses a small distilling setup made with two special cast iron "pots" (open ends facing each other and sealed with some sort of clay) on top of each other. the top one has a cooled pipe through which the rose water runs to a small pot at its end.
huh... I guess I remember more than I thought.
Hope this helps
Are you going to try it Steve? If you do don't forget to send me a bottle, right now I have to use store bought rose water.

FM

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#45 Steve Klc

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Posted 01 August 2002 - 02:16 PM

FM--I'll try anything once but I'd need more to go on then that;

NYFP--you can buy almond milk just like soy milk in supermarkets now but I prefer home made--just simmer ground almonds or almond flour in water, infuse for awhile, say overnight, and then strain. There are some more complicated versions but that's basically it. Depending on which you use--ground nuts or flour--you get a slightly different end result: since nut "flour" has had most of the nut oil extracted or pressed out of it. Not better or worse, just different. I like the flour since the flour is ground finer than you can grind your self. Don't add rose water until cool. Add sugar and lemon juice to taste. Sprinkle ground pistachios--especially bright green Sicilian pistachios on top if you really want to get daring.

I'm not clear from your soy milk comment but if you can't drink almond milk (which doesn't actually contain any milk--it's all nut) then it's probably not worth making the drink as is. With soy substituted you might want to explore a few different flavor profiles rather than rose--but I haven't worked with soy, so go for it. I find almond milk delicious and first worked with it in Medieval recipes--where many dishes had to be adjusted for religious dietary restrictions. Good almond milk rocks--and I'm planning on doing an almond milk panna cotta for an upcoming restaurant project because it just seems to go with so many other flavors of this region.

The main idea is to avoid the trap Suvir mentioned earlier of drinks which overdo the sweetness and rose flavor and/or use an inferior quality rose water or essence.

Start by thinking of rose as an elusive perfume which you have to be half way through eating or drinking a dish before you realize yes, this is rose! When you are more comfortable with it, push more.
Steve Klc

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#46 Suvir Saran

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Posted 01 August 2002 - 02:49 PM

As far as I know the pink ones with smallish petals are the most fragrant. My grandmother has several bushes of these roses surrounding her garden in my native Lebanon. I have never seen these roses in the US (probably because they do not look as pretty as the long stem/big petals ones that we see at the flower stores).

It is the same kind of rose we use in India. Highly fragrant, not the most attractive, but most haunting in its smell.
And yes it was never the prized rose of the British rose gardens around India.

#47 Suvir Saran

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Posted 01 August 2002 - 02:50 PM

Sahadi Importers has the preserve too.

Do you know what the preserve tastes like? Where is it from?
Thanks for sharing this. :biggrin:

Tis Romanian!
Its just I love Sahadis from the day I walked in there for the first time...and the owner is such a decent standup kinda guy I have a personal pleadge to plug his shop all I can.
Havent tasted it....its got sugar...nono for me
*sigh*

I love Sahadis as well. Wish I was not as lazy about going to Atlantic avenue. There are two great stores opposite one another. Sahadis and Oriental Baker.

Oriental Bakery has the best Basboussa and other Middle Eastern sweet. It is my own little bit of paradise in NYC.

#48 Suvir Saran

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Posted 01 August 2002 - 02:54 PM

The main idea is to avoid the trap Suvir mentioned earlier of drinks which overdo the sweetness and rose flavor and/or use an inferior quality rose water or essence.

Steven, we need more like you to get people familiarized with these different ingredients. Too many people think nothing of overwhelming others too the very bold flavors of these perfumes.

But when worked in the way you explain, it would be almos a fool hardy way of making people convert. In fact one could easily see people wanting to know more about such exotic ingredients.

#49 Suvir Saran

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Posted 01 August 2002 - 03:01 PM

I just served it together with a traditional opera at a party over the weekend as a petit four and it left the poor time honored hazelnut and coffee version in the dust.

It would get my attention anywhere. It could be my opera. I would be happy humming tunes as I ate it, several servings over the period of time that the Opera would have needed my attention. I love sweets that much.. and that photograph you share, and every detail you provide makes it seem just so enticing.

I can easily imagine this cake of yours being my favorite in any assortment. It seems to me like it would taste amazing, your own reputations are those that would make me easy believers and also it photographs so beautifully. Thanks for sharing. :smile:

#50 nyfirepatrolchef

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Posted 01 August 2002 - 07:02 PM

FM--I'll try anything once but I'd need more to go on then that;

NYFP--you can buy almond milk just like soy milk in supermarkets now but I prefer home made--just simmer ground almonds or almond flour in water, infuse for awhile, say overnight, and then strain.  There are some more complicated versions but that's basically it.  Depending on which you use--ground nuts or flour--you get a slightly different end result:  since nut "flour" has had most of the nut oil extracted or pressed out of it.  Not better or worse, just different.  I like the flour since the flour is ground finer than you can grind your self.  Don't add rose water until cool.  Add sugar and lemon juice to taste.  Sprinkle ground pistachios--especially bright green Sicilian pistachios on top if you really want to get daring.

I'm not clear from your soy milk comment but if you can't drink almond milk (which doesn't actually contain any milk--it's all nut) then it's probably not worth making the drink as is.  With soy substituted you might want to explore a few different flavor profiles rather than rose--but I haven't worked with soy, so go for it.  I find almond milk delicious and first worked with it in Medieval recipes--where many dishes had to be adjusted for religious dietary restrictions.  Good almond milk rocks--and I'm planning on doing an almond milk panna cotta for an upcoming restaurant project because it just seems to go with so many other flavors of this region.

The main idea is to avoid the trap Suvir mentioned earlier of drinks which overdo the sweetness and rose flavor and/or use an inferior quality rose water or essence.

Start by thinking of rose as an elusive perfume which you have to be half way through eating or drinking a dish before you realize yes, this is rose! When you are more comfortable with it, push more.

Steve~
Thought the ALmond Milk concepet pertained to regular milk infused or flavored in some way using Almonds in one form or another. But now you point out is just an almond version of soy milk concept..WOOHOO!!!! I can do that concoction with sweetner (honey or brown rice syrup) and so on.
Amounts for the do it yourself version of almond milk please?

#51 Sandra Levine

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Posted 01 August 2002 - 07:07 PM

This thread is positively poetic Thank you, all, even if I never make almond milk or candied rose petals.

#52 nyfirepatrolchef

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Posted 01 August 2002 - 07:07 PM

Sahadi Importers has the preserve too.

Do you know what the preserve tastes like? Where is it from?
Thanks for sharing this. :biggrin:

Tis Romanian!
Its just I love Sahadis from the day I walked in there for the first time...and the owner is such a decent standup kinda guy I have a personal pleadge to plug his shop all I can.
Havent tasted it....its got sugar...nono for me
*sigh*

I love Sahadis as well. Wish I was not as lazy about going to Atlantic avenue. There are two great stores opposite one another. Sahadis and Oriental Baker.

Oriental Bakery has the best Basboussa and other Middle Eastern sweet. It is my own little bit of paradise in NYC.

and if you treat the guys and gals with a little kindness (I love to go in and make snide remarks about the snide yuppies that frequent the place...right in front of them...not all yuppies are snooty and snotty little whine cellars...but having done the same kinda job as the folks at Sahadis....and experiencing the same kinda nonsense.....in light of how well they treat ME....Im rather protective of them) theyll go to the mat for you.
I seriously doubt Charlie would have it any other way.
And for GOD sake dont forget Damascus Bakery.

#53 Suvir Saran

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Posted 02 August 2002 - 03:18 PM

And for GOD sake dont forget Damascus Bakery.

Yes... They have some of the nicest packaged Pita I have ever found.

#54 Suvir Saran

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Posted 02 August 2002 - 03:27 PM

At the Johari Bazaar (Jewelers Bazaar, that has many Diamond and Gem traders from the Diamond district in NYC always there in abundance) and also at the Hawa Mahal (Wind Palace) in Jaipur, you can find on the street corners some of the best Gulaab Kaa Thanda.

Gulaab Kaa Thanda is the nicest Rose Milk Shake I have ever drunk or will in my lifetime, I am afraid. Maybe the family making them is from the Chefette and Steve Klc school of subtlety and finesse.

The milk is whole milk that has only been enriched with very little heavy cream. It is flavored with home made- PURE rose water, crushed rose petals and just a very very almost insignificant amount of sugar. The mix if churned and frothed and then served in very Tall glasses called Ek Ser Ke Gilass (Glasses that measure One Ser, I think one Ser equals a litre of milk, not sure. I will have to check on that.) and the mix is chilled when you drink it. It is long after you have left the Johari bazaar that your mouth begins to experience the sensations left by the essence of the rose. It is too late to go back for another glass of heaven. So all you can do is wait for the next time you will be near that busy and bustling market. And if you are like me, it will be later that same day.

Funniest was that recently I was introduced to a financial analyst whose job was to court the royal family of Jaipur to invest their money in his NYC Private Bank. He missed this milk the most from his visits to Jaipur. He said he wakes up often at night, for he is lost dreaming about food even as he is happily sharing his space with his beloved wife. But those dreams make him smile and want to share with her what he is able to experience while working in foreign lands.

#55 chefette

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Posted 14 August 2002 - 11:15 AM

I just found an interesting site with several rose petal recipes that might be of interest

http://www.amityheri...com/Edible.html
Amity Heritage Roses

#56 Eden

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Posted 26 June 2006 - 04:00 PM

rather than start a new thread, I'll just bring this one to the top

A friend & I just candied a bunch of rose petals. normally I use them fairly quickly, but in this case we'd like to save them until october. any tips for storing candied rose petals for several months? We used only sugar & rosewater (no egg) for our candying process if that matters.
Do you suffer from Acute Culinary Syndrome? Maybe it's time to get help...

#57 Fibilou

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Posted 09 April 2007 - 07:48 AM

I am having our caterers make an adaptation of Pierre Herme's ispahan for the dessert at my upcoming wedding, I am doing the rose petal garnish myself.

Please could someone give me a tip on getting the "dewdrop" on the tip of the petal perfect - I was thinking gelatine leaf, but have experimented and cannot get it quite right. Also it would be helpful for the florist to know which roses to order.

Thanks
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#58 chefpeon

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Posted 09 April 2007 - 10:11 AM

Regarding the type of roses, I would just say to the florist "red roses", as the garnish is simply a red rose petal. I would specify that the roses need to be just on the verge of blooming or beginning to bloom so that you are assured a hearty fresh petal. There actually is an Ispahan Rose, but it is pink and obviously not the type of rose petal Herme is using as a garnish.
Posted Image

The "dewdrop" on the rose is sugar syrup. Most likely, knowing Herme, a rose syrup. The "drop" would be placed on the rose petal shortly before service, and needs to go on the petal AFTER the petal has been placed on the dessert. Trying to place "dewdrops" on rose petals in advance, and then trusting the caterers to get the petals on the desserts without the drop falling off is just askin' for trouble. Give the caterers a box of petals (or just the roses themselves) and a squeeze bottle with a fairly viscous sugar syrup solution inside. The tip of the squeeze bottle should have an opening that is really really small. Instruct the caterers to place the petal on top (it's probably held in place with the same buttercream that's inside of the macaron) and then to squeeze a "drop" on the rose petal. Give them a picture of what you want, or show them step-by-step how to do it, and then hope they can pull it off. :raz:
Posted Image

Edited by chefpeon, 09 April 2007 - 10:12 AM.


#59 SarahW

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Posted 09 April 2007 - 10:26 AM

The Herme recipe published in Art Culinaire in summer of 2005, included the dew-drop.

It's just a drop of glucose.

That you can pick up in specialty shops, online, or, at Wal-mart, craft stores like Michael's or other vendors that stock Wilton cake decorating supplies.

#60 arriba!

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Posted 09 April 2007 - 10:32 AM

Your guests are lucky indeed! Watch out for wedding crashers!!