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An Ideal Negroni


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213 replies to this topic

#31 ned

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Posted 14 November 2005 - 10:03 AM

I'm really loving the versatility of the negroni. Unlike most other drinks where proportion can make or break a drink, with the Negroni, you can alter the proportions to suit mood, palate or desired alchohol intake. A week ago I was in the mood for a ginny drink and went with the classic version of one to one to one proportions. Last night I made something more along the lines of an Americano garnished or with a splash of gin. Then a friend showed up, thirsty and we were plumb out of his favorite drink--Red Stripe--so I made equal parts Campari and vermouth, a slightly more generous splash of gin, a squeeze of lemon and then a healthy pour of perrier, rocks.

In my travels, increasingly I find that you can't miss with a Negroni, dial it up, dial it down, it's always great.
You shouldn't eat grouse and woodcock, venison, a quail and dove pate, abalone and oysters, caviar, calf sweetbreads, kidneys, liver, and ducks all during the same week with several cases of wine. That's a health tip.

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#32 marty mccabe

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Posted 14 November 2005 - 04:30 PM

I've just made my first one in a long while, after reading this thread.

1.5oz Plymouth
1oz Campari
1oz Carpano Antica

I really think that the Carpano Antica (the original formula, which is slightly stronger and a bit more expensive than the Punt e Mes) absolutely makes the drink. Excellent balance...
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#33 Sneakeater

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Posted 23 May 2006 - 06:32 PM

This is of more interest to me than to any of you, but having obtained a cocktail shaker (and an ice crusher), I just made my first shaken cocktail: a Negroni.

1.5 oz. Junipero (cuz that's what I have)
1 oz. Campari
1 oz. Carpano Antica
orange slice (next time I'll burn a twist)

All I can say is, I am fucking great.

(OTOH, I'm not planning on stopping hanging out at the Pegu Club.)

#34 Sneakeater

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Posted 23 May 2006 - 06:34 PM

I am looking forward to trying this with equal parts sweet and dry vermouth. (I.e., Carpano Antica and Vya Dry) (cuz that's what I have around).

Edited by Sneakeater, 24 May 2006 - 08:17 AM.


#35 hathor

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Posted 24 May 2006 - 07:22 AM

What is junipero?

#36 donbert

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Posted 24 May 2006 - 07:38 AM

What is junipero?

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A Gin made by Anchor Steam, also the makers of Old Potrero (rye whiskey).

#37 Sneakeater

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Posted 25 June 2006 - 07:38 PM

1 oz. Junipero gin
1 oz. Campari
.5 oz. Carpano Antiquo Formula
.5 oz. Vya Dry Vermouth
Orange slice

Delicious. Slightly better -- I dunno, lighter but more complex -- than with all Carpano Antiqua Formula for the "vermouth" part.

Edited by Sneakeater, 25 June 2006 - 07:40 PM.


#38 Sneakeater

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Posted 26 June 2006 - 08:55 AM

(I'm sorry for that rather banal post. I'm just so excited, now that I have the means to make cocktails at home, that I can't contain myself.)

#39 Brigit Binns

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Posted 26 June 2006 - 10:50 AM

Legend says that the Negroni is the cocktail that "ruined a generation" of post-war youth in Europe.
I just can't remember which war they were referring to. Probably, Hemingway had something to do with it. He's usually guilty when it comes to anything involving cocktails...

We've been drinking them for years. Glad they've caught on...

Am now i.s.o. Punt e Mes and/or the Carpano.
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#40 Nathan

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Posted 26 July 2006 - 02:29 PM

I prefer Carpano Antica for my Negroni (made by the same company as Punt es Mes -- which is actually their "cheap" vermouth)...much more nuanced and herbal than other vermouths and robust enough to work in the traditional 1:1:1 form.

However, it is so robust that I heartily recommend serving it on the rocks.

#41 Martin Doudoroff

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Posted 26 July 2006 - 03:41 PM

The nice thing about drinks such as the Negroni (or the Manhattan or the Martini or the Daiquiri) is that they are combinations of ingredients that have a natural affinity for each other. (Contrasting examples would be the 20th Century Cocktail, the Blood and Sand, the Jupiter, where balance is precarious and perfection is the only degree between sublimity and abject failure.) Unless you subvert yourself with downright lousy ingredients, it's pretty darn hard to go wrong! You can go to great lengths to convince yourself that one particular formulation is the zenith of Negroni-ism, only to be later shocked, SHOCKED, by the winsome characteristics of another. To paraphrase another, the ideal Negroni is the one in my glass at the moment!

#42 ned

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Posted 08 August 2006 - 06:37 PM

I made a negroni tonight

1 part Plymouth gin
1 part Campari
1 part Noilly Pratt vermouth

. . . but the vermouth had been in the fridge for a tad too long. On another day I might foraged forth except that, well it's a longer story.

I was recently diagnosed with a form of arthritis called Anyklosing Spondylitis. Not such a big deal. There are some good medicines that can be taken for it. The one I'll be taking is called Enbrel. What does any of this have to do with the humble negroni? Before taking Enbril I must be clear of tuberculosis which I unfortunately have been exposed to. The downside of lots of 3rd world travel. Or taking the subway. In either case, to get rid of the dormant TB I must take a drug that requires going on the wagon for NINE MONTHS!

Each of these last precious cocktails have to be on. No stale vermouth for me tonight. I looked around the kitchen for a solution. . . there was an open bottle of Nicolas Feuillatte champagne from last night. I tasted, maybe yes. . .

1 Plymouth gin
1 Campari
1 day old Nicolas Feuillatte champagne

I thought it might need a couple of drops of lemon or lime but tonight anyway that wasn't necessary.

I hop on the wagon tomorrow. Ok the day after tomorrow.
You shouldn't eat grouse and woodcock, venison, a quail and dove pate, abalone and oysters, caviar, calf sweetbreads, kidneys, liver, and ducks all during the same week with several cases of wine. That's a health tip.

Jim Harrison from "Off to the Side"

#43 slkinsey

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Posted 09 August 2006 - 07:16 AM

. . . to get rid of the dormant TB I must take a drug that requires going on the wagon for NINE MONTHS!

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAUGH! AAUGH! AAUGH! AAUGH!




AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAUGH!




You poor, poor man!
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#44 ned

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Posted 09 August 2006 - 12:26 PM

Yeah that pretty accurately represents the way I feel about it.
You shouldn't eat grouse and woodcock, venison, a quail and dove pate, abalone and oysters, caviar, calf sweetbreads, kidneys, liver, and ducks all during the same week with several cases of wine. That's a health tip.

Jim Harrison from "Off to the Side"

#45 J_Ozzy

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Posted 09 August 2006 - 07:57 PM

ned,

Know that you're not alone in your Enbrel-related journey.
Both my father and one our close family friends are both alcohol-free for three quarters of a year.

When using Plymouth (which I adore), I like to push the Gin/Campari/Vermouth ratio to 3/2/2, since I became initially aquainted with Negroni made with more assertive gin.

Edit: spelling

Edited by J_Ozzy, 09 August 2006 - 08:00 PM.


#46 johnder

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Posted 09 August 2006 - 08:17 PM

  In either case, to get rid of the dormant TB I must take a drug that requires going on the wagon for NINE MONTHS! 



Dude -- if you are pregnant you can just tell us. We are all friends here.

Nine months. Holy crap.

Sorry to hear the news.

John
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#47 ned

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Posted 10 August 2006 - 05:02 PM

Dude --  if you are pregnant you can just tell us.   We are all friends here.

Nine months.   Holy crap.

Sorry to hear the news.

John

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As a matter of fact I am pregnant, well, my wife is anyway. Misery loves company. Misery and elation that is.

ned,

Know that you're not alone in your Enbrel-related journey.
Both my father and one our close family friends are both alcohol-free for three quarters of a year.

When using Plymouth (which I adore), I like to push the Gin/Campari/Vermouth ratio to 3/2/2, since I became initially aquainted with Negroni made with more assertive gin.

Edit: spelling

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Thanks for the sentiment.


I'm officially a dry county as of yesterday.

Back to the original programming.

Edited by ned, 10 August 2006 - 05:03 PM.

You shouldn't eat grouse and woodcock, venison, a quail and dove pate, abalone and oysters, caviar, calf sweetbreads, kidneys, liver, and ducks all during the same week with several cases of wine. That's a health tip.

Jim Harrison from "Off to the Side"

#48 jsmeeker

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Posted 25 June 2007 - 01:42 PM

so, what is the scoop on how this drink should be served? It seems the Campari website shows it on the rocks. The Wikipedia entry (citing the IBA, if that means anything) also says on the rocks. But many here are serve it up.

So, rocks, up? What's the deal? This sounds like a good drink. When I get back home for more than a day, I think I'll by a bottle of Campari and play around with it. In the mean time, if I order one when I am in Las Vegas next week (say, at Bouchon), what do you think I will get? Up? rocks? Some interesting combination of ingredients?

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#49 Nathan

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Posted 25 June 2007 - 02:08 PM

In Italy you'll find it both up and on the rocks. I've had it both ways from credible bartenders in the U.S. as well.

personally, I think Campari drinks beg for the rocks.

#50 eje

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Posted 25 June 2007 - 02:48 PM

It is a very good drink! One of my favorites!

Though, honestly, I never quite know what I'm going to get when I order it.

I've gotten all sorts of things, from bartenders who make it with only a splash of Campari and Vermouth to others who include soda and/or orange juice.

My preference is for equal portions of Plymouth Gin, Cinzano Italian Vermouth, and Campari, stirred and served up. Though, sometimes rocks are nice too, as the up version can be a bit rich. Ideally the bartender or server would ask you when you order.

Edited by eje, 25 June 2007 - 02:49 PM.

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#51 weinoo

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Posted 25 June 2007 - 03:59 PM

personally, I think Campari drinks beg for the rocks.

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Me too.

edited to say: Most of the time...the Cornwall Negroni, served properly ice cold and up is a thing of beauty!

Edited by weinoo, 25 June 2007 - 04:01 PM.

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#52 hathor

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Posted 26 June 2007 - 07:34 AM

Italians don't really believe in ice. They just don't get it.
But, it's been hot as hell, and all the negroni's we've recently consumed have been with rocks. :biggrin: :cool:
(My husband has been single handedly converting the entire piazza into negroni drinkers. Hey, it's a small piazza.)

#53 Kim D

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Posted 12 March 2008 - 11:35 AM

We just moved from Chicago to New York and I was a bit stressed. Decided that a Negroni would hit the spot. Walked around the Upper West Side, found a liquor store with the proprietor standing outside. I told him that I was going to make a Negroni and if he said yes to all three of my questions, I would come inside.

First question: Do you have Hendrick's gin?
Answer: No. Just sold the last bottle.

And then he wanted to know my other two questions. Now really, what's the point since he'd already said no to the most important question.

Against my better judgment, I went inside.

He tried to sell me Tanqueray.

I told him it wasn't about the price, it was about the quality.

So he tried to sell me Bombay Sapphire. That's when I walked out.

The next liquor store had Hendricks, Campari but no Noilly Pratt sweet vermouth. I bought Martini & Rossi instead because that's what they had. Forgot to pick up an orange.

Recipe for an ideal Negroni? The appetite for one helps but I'm still searching.

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If you want to make an apple pie from scratch, you must first create the universe. - Carl Sagan

#54 slkinsey

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Posted 12 March 2008 - 11:46 AM

Hendrick's for a Negroni? Hmm. That wouldn't even be on my radar. Tanqueray, on the other hand, I feel is an absolutely first-rate product and while some might prefer other brands I'd be hard put to say that any other brand of gin was definitively "better." This is a fairly common feeling among cocktailian circles.



Getting back to the Negroni, I had a nice variation the other day from Giuseppe Gonzalez at Flatiron Lounge. It was a Negroni Swizzle made with gin, Punt e Mes and Campari swizzled in a tall glass with crushed ice and garnished with a half-moon slice of blood orange.
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#55 Kim D

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Posted 12 March 2008 - 11:52 AM

I don't belong to any cocktailian circles and now I know why. They wouldn't have me. Back to lurking.
If you want to make an apple pie from scratch, you must first create the universe. - Carl Sagan

#56 hathor

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Posted 12 March 2008 - 12:22 PM

I don't belong to any cocktailian circles and now I know why. They wouldn't have me. Back to lurking.

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I don't know the difference between any of those gins, but I'm happy to listen to their babble...don't let those other guys scare you off! I can't even muddle properly.

As far as the search for the perfect negroni: sometimes the search is as much fun as the prize. Only sometimes.

#57 slkinsey

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Posted 12 March 2008 - 12:23 PM

The beauty of the Negroni (and most, if not all, cocktails) is that you can make successful, albeit different iterations with a wide variety of brands. The only brand-specific ingredient is Campari, and even there I wonder what it might be like with Luxardo Bitter.

So, if you prefer your Negroni with Hendrick's gin and Noilly Prat sweet vermouth, there's nothing wrong with that -- not to say that I wouldn't like the opportunity to talk you into a better sweet vermouth such as Carpano Antica Formula (Noilly Prat's dry is tops, the sweet not so much).

Mostly it struck me as unusual that you held what seems an unusual choice of gin for a Negroni as the sine qua non, while at the same time reacting to the store owner's offer of a brand largely held among the handful that define quality in gin as though he had offered you an inferior product.
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#58 thirtyoneknots

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Posted 12 March 2008 - 12:47 PM

The nice thing about gin is that extraordinary quality levels can be had at such reasonable price points, since it requires no aging or anything like that. I'f you're paying more than $15 or so/bottle for gin, chances are it's pretty good stuff. The ones that are over $25 or so for a bottle are typically (with notable exceptions, see Junipero) of a softer more modern style that doesn't always work well in old-school cocktails, sicne they were more often than not designed to be drank by themselves. I think Hendricks is tasty as all getout, but Tanqueray would be the one I'd reach for in a Negroni. Of course, as in all things, make it how you like.

Me? I've been on a Beefeater's kick lately.
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#59 jsmeeker

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Posted 12 March 2008 - 12:53 PM

The nice thing about gin is that extraordinary quality levels can be had at such reasonable price points, since it requires no aging or anything like that. I'f you're paying more than $15 or so/bottle for gin, chances are it's pretty good stuff. The ones that are over $25 or so for a bottle are typically (with notable exceptions, see Junipero) of a softer more modern style that doesn't always work well in old-school cocktails, sicne they were more often than not designed to be drank by themselves. I think Hendricks is tasty as all getout, but Tanqueray would be the one I'd reach for in a Negroni. Of course, as in all things, make it how you like.

Me? I've been on a Beefeater's kick lately.

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I noticed this recently as I picked up a bottle of Plymouth for a good price, then looked to see what a good 100% agave tequila was going for.

OUCH!

I love a good margartia, but I can make a lot more gin based drinks for the same amount of scratch.

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#60 slkinsey

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Posted 12 March 2008 - 01:11 PM

. . . The [gins] that are over $25 or so for a bottle are typically (with notable exceptions, see Junipero) of a softer more modern style. . .

Most, but not all of them, created with vodka-drinkers in mind, IMO.

I noticed [the low prices of great gin] recently as I picked up a bottle of Plymouth for a good price, then looked to see what a good 100% agave tequila was going for.

OUCH!

There are a lot of reasons for this price difference, as we discussed over in the thread on mezcal. Here's what I had to say, and the same things are true for tequila.

. .  there are some things that contribute to the high price of quality tequila and mezcal (it is, of course, entirely possible to buy cheap, crappy bottles of either product).  Some of it is certainly a matter of supply and demand.  This is undoubtedly especially true in the case of high-end mezcal.  It's also extremely expensive to make a high-end mezcal.  The agave plant has to grow for something like eight to ten years before the piñas can be harvested.  That's a large initial investment of time, money and risk before the raw ingredient is even ready to be used, and there is really no comparison to other raw ingredients used for distillation such as grains, fruits and potatoes, all of which are ready to be used within one season.  Finally, in order to make a mezcal worth drinking, the distiller has to lightly bake the piñas with wood in small ovens for several days, ferment a mash of 100% agave for a month or more and then do multiple small-batch runs through a pot still.  Each one of these steps adds cost.

Compare this process and time investment to what it takes to make Plymouth gin:

Here's what Plymouth does to make their gin:

  • Begins with neutral spirits and rectifies to >96% alcohol.
  • Dilutes that alcohol down to approximately 69% alcohol.
  • Puts the botanicals into that 69% alcohol wash and fires the still.
  • Distills the flavored wash to produce gin at 85% alcohol.
  • Dilutes the gin to 41.2% alcohol for their main bottling.

That is a much smaller investment of time and money -- especially considering that Plymouth most likely buys all its ingredients (including the unrefined neutral spirits if they don't actually to the initial fermentation and distillation themselves) on the open market, whereas tequila and mezcal producers may own the agave plants and the land used to grow them.
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