95 replies to this topic

[cabrales]

However chefs react to a new edition that brings bad news, even if only relatively bad, there is always a the sense that this is the official ranking.

For members who may be focusing on the French board and not monitoring the UK board, see the discussion under "Those stars in full" in "United Kingdom and Ireland" too (a bit more theoretical, for those who are interested).

[Steve Plotnicki]

Robert-Although I will post on the dinner we had seperately, we were afraid to ask Monsieur Savoy the question last night althougn Cabrales tried pretty hard to ask it indirectly. So the "jewery" is still out. But my guess from looking at his visage, or punim depending on your slant, is that he's not. But the waiter did tell us that his mother runs a restaurant in the Savoie. So for the tea leaf readers, one can say that his last name is a "stage name." But maybe M. Alain Weill can furnish us with more detail. And it's "fresser," not fesser were I come from.

[Dorie Greenspan]

Cabrales, to answer your query about what we ate at Hiramatsu (is it too late? have you already been?) -- our three starters were the terrific foie gras and oyster combo; a dish that was billed as ravioli with saint pierre and, I think it said, confit of legumes, which turned out to be a thin blanket of pasta covering saint pierre and a nicely done ratatouille; and the seafood salad, the one real disappointment, although the olive oil that is used in the salad -- and in several other dishes -- was so good we asked for the name (and then forgot to collect it at the end of lunch -- aaarrgggh!).  For mains we had the venison en croute with crushed chestnuts and a little caramelized onion filled with a veloute (precious but yummy) -- the winning dish; the bar with lemon confit, the lemon confit being the stand-out in the dish and having nothing to do with salt-cured citron confit -- instead, it was a lemon puree mounted with butter and that same great olive oil; and I never got to taste the third dish and can't remember what the fish was, but it was in a mustard and gazpacho nage.  At the sommelier's suggestion, we drank a Condrieu from Yves Cuilleron -- not a hardship.

I'm in Paris now and have a reservation to return to Hiramatsu for lunch Wednesday.  I'm anxious to get a second taste, especially after Francois Simon's article in yesterday's Figaro, which said that Hiramatsu had, with the restaurant's luxe fittings and its "bubbly" cuisine, "trapped" the Michelin into giving him the star.  According to Simon, the French were only too willing to fall into the trap, too.  In his lead, Simon notes that Hiramatsu is a very successful businessman in Japan and that he has even had success with Italian restauranta, so Simon wonders if Hiramatsu didn't say to himself, "Why not try for a starred restaurant in Paris?"  I look forward to Cabrales' post on her meal and will check in after I've had mine.

Thanks for the welcome, Bux.

[robert brown]

Steve, I'm incredibly embarrassed. It is "fresser" and payback for "than" rather than "then". What makes it worse is that when I e-mailed Amanda Hesser about her story on Maine belons, I suggested she change her e-mail address from "ahesser@nytimes to "afesser@nytimes". At least she replied, but only about the oysters. But Oy-veh.That's what happens when you grow up a Jew in the bush leagues.

I always thought Guy Savoy looked like a tribesman, but this was c. 1976. Maybe he has grown out of it or converted for the extra bread. I'll ask Alain Weill (as in "Oy-veh"). How close did Cabrales get, and how did Guy or the staff guy respond?

[Fat Guy]

Plotnicki, why all the discomfort? What's wrong with just asking: "Are you Jewish?"

All you gentile foodies out there, would you be insulted if someone asked you this question? You'd probably be amused at worst, right?

And if you were Jewish, you'd probably not be insulted either, though I suppose some might be. I wouldn't.

[Bux]

I'd probably be amused, but honestly if I was a chef, I'd also wonder why of all things this is what a diner asked of me. To not focus on my food and their meal, but on my ethnicity would make me wonder why they came to the restauant--was it not the food. As I diner I want to make sure the chef believes I'm a devotee at least while he's still feeding me.

My response of course would be, "why are you interested," but any question would give him the answer he wanted.

[cabrales]

Cabrales tried pretty hard to ask it indirectly.

Robert -- I should add that I received no support from Steve P or Marc (MarcCosnarddesCloset) in my efforts when Guy Savoy was at our table (on 3-4 separate occasions) , except when Steve P asked some questions of the maitre d'. Here were my indirect attempts: (1) "Where do you receive your inspiration, from your family?" (Answer: his mother is a professional chef, he gets inspiration from products and from all sorts of places), plus related follow-up questions, (2) "Has your family been in that region [of origin] long?" (Answer: 50+ years), and (3) "Where there any particularly meaningful aspects to earning three stars?" (Answer: Vague answer regarding meaningfulness). So there. Steve P, Marc and I each have a 2 hr-plus video offered to us by the restaurant, featuring G. Savoy and certain French products. One of us should review it for Robert and Steven's sake.

Bux -- I agree that the question was inappropriate. I'm glad no direct questions were posed to take away from a period of such happiness for G. Savoy. In hindsight, I feel dissatisfied with myself that I asked what I did, even indirectly. It should not matter what G. Savoy's origin is; people should speak about his cuisine.

[Fat Guy]

So, it's not important that Jackie Robinson was black? It's not important that Benjamin Disraeli was a Jew? Whenever a member of a minority -- particularly a minority that has at one time been oppressed, enslaved, or murdered en masse -- achieves victory or recognition never before afforded that group, it's a triumph for all humankind. Now that's not to say there is ritualized antisemitism in the Michelin star-rating system, or that being a chef is fundamentally a function of one's religion, race, nationality, or ethnicity. But there is a history of antisemitism in France (as well as lots of other places), and cultural background is an important element of some chefs' cooking. So it seems to me still a matter of legitimate speculation whether we do or do not have the first Jewish Michelin three-star chef on our hands. Furthermore, even were it not significant, it would still in my mind be an entirely legitimate subject of curiosity. When the chef sets foot in the dining room, he makes the restaurant about more than the food. Chefs of high-profile restaurants are public figures, celebrities, and to be curious about things other than what they cook is simply human. Guy Savoy doesn't have to tell us whether or not he's Jewish. This is a big advantage that religious minorities have over racial/ethnic minorities -- they look the same as other people (if anything has raised my eyebrows in this discussion, it has not been the Jew-not-a-Jew game, but rather the implication that Jews look a certain way). But I still think there's no harm in asking him. Marcus Samuelsson, the chef at Aquavit here in New York, is black, from Ethiopia, orphaned and raised in Scandinavia. He's now the chef at America's top Scandinavian restaurant. I find that interesting, not because it affects his cooking, but simply because it's interesting. Am I a bad person for finding that interesting?

[cabrales]

So, it's not important that Jackie Robinson was black? ... Whenever a member of a minority -- particularly a minority that has at one time been oppressed, enslaved, or murdered en masse -- achieves victory or recognition never before afforded that group, it's a triumph for all humankind.

Steven -- I agree that the breaking of barriers by members of minorities (including women as Michelin-starred chefs in France, by the way) is commendable, and noteworthy. It's not that Jackie Robinson's race is irrelevant, it's the bluntness of asking the question in a context in which it might be misinterpreted by the responding party, whose day it should be. I am not saying that whether G Savoy is Jewish is irrelevant; I am saying that, in many contexts, a diner's direct question might not have been the best thing when the chef's perceptions are taken into account.  I am saying that, for me, I am glad I asked no direct questions and, in hindsight, I regret having even made the attempt. I am not upset at myself; I would merely have done things differently.

Imagine you are G Savoy; you have cooked an elaborate dinner for eight people, showing great accommodation as the party sought an all-truffle menu, but not the all-truffle tasting menu you have listed. You have given the meal your best shot by offering many added dishes, greeting the group upon arrival and several times thereafter, having your maitre d' offer good amounts of truffle shavings with respect to relevant dishes, gifting the group a large veal shank and all sorts of things. Suddenly, a diner asks what your religious affiliation/origin is. If you were G Savoy, would that affect your perception of how meaningful your meal had been to the diners?!  Note my prior post focused on what it is appropriate to discuss with the chef. If your curiosity spurs you to collect information about G Savoy's religious affiliation in other ways, that at least would not have the potentially negative effects described.

[Fat Guy]

It wouldn't bother me to be asked whether I'm Jewish, gay, rich, or anything else personal. But that's just me -- I prefer the direct approach. Were I a Jewish Michelin three-star chef, I'd actually advertise it -- I'd end a conversation like the one you all had with, "And, I'm Jewish. The first Jewish Michelin three-star chef. Yep, that's me. Name used to be Schatzberger." Some might not want it that way, I grant that. Still, I think for a celebrity chef to be sensitive to such things would be at least naive. I assure you it would come as no surprise to the chef that people are interested in things other than his food. I'm sure -- assuming his attitudes fall within the range of expected human attitudes -- he's interested in such things too, when he visits other chefs' restaurants.

[thefoodhunter]

France is an incredibly anti-semitic country. I live with a wonderful Jewish woman who was at our dinner at Guy Savoy sporting her star. I admit that I did chicken out and not support Cabrales indirect line of questioning but the chef was so nice to us and I know what that question means to the French. If you are Jewish it hearkens back to a terrifying past. If you are not Jewish it is always taken as an accusation. You could only understand it if you live here. France is not a melting pot. Proudly displaying your Jewish heritage is often seen as an invitation to abuse. That is not how it should be but that is how it is. France's various religious groups (overwhelming non practicing Catholics, 5 million Muslims although few practice and a smattering of Jews, Protestants and others) get along by not focusing on religion. It is a taboo subject, like talking about income or politics. It is also one of the most voltatile subjects when it does get mentioned, witness the mass demonstrations whenever the government hints at cutting state subsidies for Catholic schools. Comparing attitudes about religion in one country to another is like comparing apples to ranges, they are different and Vive la difference!

[cabrales]

but the chef was so nice to us

Marc -- I'm glad that you didn't help out on my indirect inquiries.    And G Savoy was incredibly nice to us, as Steve P's upcoming post on the dinner will illustrate! I should add that G Savoy appeared to be basking in happiness. It might have been particularly nice for the chef (if he had had time to think about it) that our dinner was so soon (less than two weeks) after the Michelin announcement, and Steve P (and likely most of the diners who were there Saturday night) had made their reservations significantly in advance of the announcement.

[Fat Guy]

Marc, if that's all true, it makes me even more interested in Guy Savoy's Jewishness or lack thereof, and it also makes me want to get on a plane right now, stand on a streetcorner in Paris, and ask every passer-by if he or she is Jewish.

[cabrales]

it makes me even more interested in Guy Savoy's Jewishness

Steven -- If you are comfortable discussing it, why precisely are you so curious about this aspect of G Savoy as a person? Were you interested in the fact that Scottha Khunn, sic, is from Cambodia, and did you discern any Asian aspects to his cooking at Le Cirque?

[Fat Guy]

I find the question of a chef's Jewishness more interesting than the question of a chef's Cambodianness for the simple reason that I'm Jewish and proud of it. And I like to feel proud on behalf of Jews who have succeeded in areas where it might not be expected (baseball, Michelin three-star restaurants, etc.). Now, a Cambodian Jew, that would interest me a great deal . . .

Still, I'm interested in Samuelsson and Kuhnn's ethnic backgrounds, because as a Jew I identify with any member of any presently or formerly oppressed minority who has succeeded in an unusual area (for that minority). As I mentioned before, I see it as a victory for all humankind. Not that I've ever overcome any adversity or done anything noteworthy -- gee, a Jewish food writer and lawyer in New York, gosh, that's amazing -- but I'm still vicariously proud through those who have.

My reasons aren't all idealistic, though. I also just enjoy playing the game of Jew/not-a-Jew, and I assume members of most minorities have similar discussions. "He's Cambodian, didn't you know?" must be something that Cambodians dining at Le Cirque said with pride, interest, or a combination thereof, when they learned of Khunn's extraction.

I should also add, in light of Marc's comments, that I have found chefs to be among the most generous and unprejudiced people in the world. Several important French chefs have made a point of cooking in Israel, the kosher dietary laws are part of the curriculum at the French culinary academies, and at a dinner with Jean-Michel Lorain a couple of years ago he seemed entirely at ease and enthusiastic about discussing issues of religion, race, and culture. I also think that if you have a three-star restaurant in France, you can't exist without the business you get from Jews and Asians, which tends to give you a dose of pragmatism when it comes to evaluating your feelings towards minorities.

[cabrales]

Several important French chefs have made a point of cooking in Israel, the kosher dietary laws are part of the curriculum at the French culinary academies, and at a dinner with Jean-Michel Lorain a couple of years ago he seemed entirely at ease and enthusiastic about discussing issues of religion, race, and culture.

For members interested in the materials mentioned by Steven, see "The long road to eGullet" under "Member Bios" (p. 1).  

One question I have wondered about is whether one can tell a chef is a woman from her cuisine. For example, have members been to Pic in Valence since Anne-Sophie Pic took over? And are male and female diners' experiences modified by Annisa, with a female maitre d' as well?

[Fat Guy]

I'd encourage a new thread for that one. We've got enough going on here!

[Bux]

I'd be interested in knowing if a chef was left handed. I can identify with left handed people and the hardships they've had to overcome dealing with so many tools that are designed for right handed folks. If someone were to ask a chef if he was left handed while he was feeding them, I suspect he'd think that person was an idiot or someone who was trying hard to avoid talking about his talents and an appreciation of the meal. On second thought, the only question would be a determination of the sort of idiot the questioner was.

Somewhere else on this board, I mentioned a one armed sommelier. This is something that definitely affected how he approached his job. I did not need to ask him if he was one armed, as I might not have to ask Samuelsson if he is of African heritage. At the time, I can't recall any curiosity about whether one armed people might have been proud by his success or whether they flocked to the restaurant in support.

If Cabrales starts a thread on women chefs, I will make a recommendation to her of someone I like not far from Michel Bras.

[Fat Guy]

I find issues of left- and right-handedness interesting, especially when they affect on-the-job performance. I find it fascinating that a much larger percentage of baseball players, for example, are southpaws than in the general population. Also, redheads interest me a great deal.

I get your point, though, Bux. You think being Jewish, or left-handed, or whatever, is irrelevant to one's merit as a chef. I agree. But that doesn't change anything I've said above.

[Bux]

that doesn't change anything I've said above

Except that I'd avise any diner not to ask the chef if he's Jewish, female, left handed or raise any issue other than how did you get to be such a genius, while he's still feeding you. I'd hold all those questions for after you've paid the bill, unless you intend on coming back.

[cabrales]

Below are observations on Guy Savoy – Steve P, Marc Cosnard des Closets and I had dinner there Saturday night. What follows is a relatively technical report, which tends to result when I have a good to very good, but uninspired, meal. The meal did not persuade me that it would have been an injustice for G Savoy to have continued along without a third star.  

Our dining party had a wonderful time discussing all sorts of things. Steve had included two cuisiniers previously affiliated with Lucas-Carton, of whom I posed questions about Canard Apicius (no Asian fish sauce, for example, is actually used at the restaurant).  The two of them, and the rest of the party, appeared happy enough with the meal, and I do not see Guy Savoy’s cuisine as being below that of the average three-star restaurant (with average being the operative term).

Our amuse-bouches included a delicious small section of squid or calamari clad in a little piece of mushroom and supported by the bitterness of endive.  Others were a small piece of sea bass, and carrot soup with anise (which I thought was nothing special).  

One of my personal highlights of the dinner was the oyster in gelee (Huitre en nage glacee]) included in Guy Savoy’s parade of appetizers. While this version left a lot to be desired relative to similar offerings from Meneau, Lorain and Dotournier, I was gratified to further my comparison of this dish at different restaurants.  See “What are vegetarians missing” under “General”, p. 4.  The aspic gelee Saturday night was crushed and “mushy”, and did not convey a sense of the darling seawater and juices trapped within oysters. Still, the oyster was nice. The other appetizers served together with the oyster (a beetroot/truffle item and the liver in beef consumme dish Mao and vivin also sampled) were not memorable.  See "Mao and Vivin's Paris Trip 6 -- Guy Savoy" in this form. Our next dish of Royale de truffes et navets au jus de truffes was nice, pairing thin, softened turnips with truffles. The turnip provided a relatively “clean” backdrop against which to play with the darkness and intensity of the truffles.

The truffled artichoke soup (Soupe d’Artichaut a la Truffe Noire, Brioche Feuilettee aux Champignons et Beurre de Truffe) was hearty, balanced and rich without being weighed down with cream. It offered strong truffle sensations, like a number of the other dishes sampled (including a truffled lentil dish). For me, the addition of parmesan to the “inside” of the soup was unnecessary (I have a similar gripe with Gordon Ramsay's pumpkin soup amuse), but Steve appeared to like the slight elasticity engendered by the small molten cheese bits. The truffles, if not as pristine as those encountered by him at Richerenches market in Southern France (one of which became a hefty souvenir), were of good quality and were deftly and generously utilized in many dishes.

The vanilla-sauced sea bass has been discussed in the Mao/Vivin thread. Then a dish of lobster, flanked by vegetables, that was good, but not outstanding. I liked the Mersault Perrieres, Domaine Roulot 1996, Steve had picked with these dishes quite a bit.

My veal entree (Cote de Veau Juste Rotie, Puree de Pommes de Terre a la Truffe, Jus de Veau) was a slight disappointment, but that is, sadly, not an uncommon reaction for me at even three star restaurants.  While tender, the veal but not brought to life by a run-of-the-mill brown sauce. The accompanying truffled potato puree had a quasi-aligot consistency.  Other diners at our table had decent Bresse chicken. Afterwards, the kitchen gifted our table an enormous veal knuckle (Jarret de Veau). Having been served to an adjacent table, this dish spurred our envy because the veal piece appeared perfectly caramelized and included a substantial bone section protruding upward.  Speculation had abounded at our table that the bone was chock full of marrow (apparently not the case). The meat turned out to be good, but not more than that, and no marrow was to be had.

It was an interesting, and in hindsight appropriate, choice for the kitchen to have served the lentils with black truffles after the entree (Ragout de Lentilles et Truffe Noire). The dish was a bit heavy, but a good showcase for the truffles.

Following a so-so cheese course, I thoroughly enjoyed my blood orange dessert. Bitterness and tartness from small orange sections near the top of a cute, round glass serving bowl gave added meaning to the confit (or similar preparation) below. Other diners at our table had a trio of small desserts centering on pear and lemon. The ensuing chocolate truffle dessert was very smooth, rather dense and not particularly to my liking.

Guy Savoy and the dining room team members serving the food were helpful and generous. It is heartening to see a team remain eager to please after attaining Michelin’s holy grail (no religious connotations intended!)

[Sandra Levine]

One of my personal highlights of the dinner was the oyster in gelee (Huitre en nage glacee])

I was so sorry to read your description of this dish, which, when I had it ten years ago at Guy Savoy, was everything you hoped it would be.  I remember barely cooked oysters floating in briny aspic of crystalline clarity.  I've remembered it all this time.

[cabrales]

I was so sorry to read your description of this dish

Sandra -- Maybe Steve or Marc can add to this, but the oyster itself came through nicely in the dish. I would have to say that the gelee was not as reminiscent of the sea as any of the other dishes of this nature I have had. But those other dishes were of extraordinary quality. For example, Meneau's oyster in gelee dish is my favorite dish from all dishes I have sampled at L'Esperance. Lorain himself appears to like his oyster terrine dish considerably, placing it in the "Les Musts" ("The Musts") section of his menu.

Note also that my descriptive style for meals could seem to lack enthusiasm with respect to many meals that I find tasty, if they do not rise to a further level.  

[cabrales]

In May, Patricia Wells provided a review of Guy Savoy. Included in the same review was discussion of Gagnaire.

http://www.patriciaw...t/2002/1005.htm

[tony h]

Guy Savoy

Guy Savoy, 18 Rue Troyon, is located slightly to the north of Arc de Triomphe. The street itself is not very inviting - at one end a McDonalds and after dark although it didn’t feel unsafe I’d hate to hang around. GS was recognised by the 2 attendants waiting to open the understated but imposing wooden doors beyond which some of France’s greatest treasures hid.

There to meet us himself was Guy Savoy – not opening the doors of course, he has henchman for that. He had the humbled look of someone who had invited you into your home crossed with a look, a warm smug glow, that said I got my 3rd star.

Oh what wonders lay beyond. The restaurant is divided into 3 section with a 6-10 tables in each section. The décor was modern international, pleasant, angular and comfortable.

We arrived at 8.30.

First up – pre-pre-starters: succulent discs of foie gras beautifully salty and perfumed. There were seconds of these.

Second – pre-starters: three little dishes: one of carrot & pernod soup (although “soup” seems too basic a word); mushrooms sautéed & skewered with a rosemary twig & a courgette/zucchini cannelloni stuffed with mushrooms & balsamic. The balsamic looked 50 years old.

Fabulous.

The menu arrived & it took quite some time to assimilate. There were 2 tasting menus for 230 and 188 euros. I could easily have eaten both but we settled on, we thought anyway, the simple a la carte. Of waiter told that if we didn’t want the tasting menu we could make one up from what was available – split the starters – we’ll give you half-portions. (Half-portions my arse – but more later.)

The menu was chosen. First half starters (approx 50 euros each full price):

Petits medaillons de foie gras de canard au sel gris et gelee de canard (preparation crue)
(loads of little foie gras on a duck aspic with celeriac puree)

Supreme de volaille de bresse, fioe gras et celery en vinaigrette aux truffes
(Chicken & foie gras terrine with truffle vinarette and celery cream sauce.)

Both outstanding. First nice touch: they offered more sauce to go with the terrine when my partner had finished it.

Second half starter: we both chose this as it seemed a signature dish (75 euros full price)

Soupe d’artichaut a la truffe noir, brioche feulletee aux champignons et truffes
(artichoke & truffle soup with mushroom & truffle brioche)

75 euros for a plate of soup (37.5 in this case) sounds like a lot – but it was stunning. A bemused, satisfied look came over each of our faces at the first mouthful. The depth of flavour was not over powering but lingered beautifully & tantalisingly on the palate longer afterwards. The brioche was the most succulent I have ever had.

Second nice touch: they asked if we wanted more. I said yes & got another half size bowl. Guy Savoy came over & commented – so you weren’t sure about the soup the first time?

The starters were not half sized - of that we were sure.

Course 5: main course:

Angeau de lait dans tous ses etats
(lamb done several ways)

We both chose this – not something I usually like doing – but I’m glad we did so in this case or there would have been a severe case of jealously on one side.

A lamb hock– cooked in a clear broth with turned vegetables - was presented to use & prepared by our table. The meat was separated skilfully from the bone & arranged in a bowl with the sumptuous stock and vegetables. My initial disappointment at the size of the portion was soon gone: this was a side dish. In front us appeared a separate plate of lamb (saddle & neck fillets) with perfect quenelle of cous-cous, vegetables (I don’t remember which) and deep deep reduction (stunning). Additionally there was a side dish of peas with morsels of roast lamb neck or cheek.

This was truly wonderful.

Course 6: dessert

I had the terrine of grapefruit with earl grey tea sauce – very sharp but refreshing. My partner had chestnut & hazelnut creation – sponge-like base with flavoured cream with spun sugar contraptions.

Possibly the least successful course – the chestnut thing wasn’t to my taste at all but the terrine was a revelation after an already heavy meal.

Courses 7 & onwards: post-dessert

We refused cheese (it would have sunk us) but this didn’t stop the food flowing. The post dessert part of the meal was two plates of wonderful petit fours, another course of homely ice creams (I chose the almond – breathtaking) and stewed fruit (I skipped this).

This was followed but another mini-dessert of grapefruit sorbet & pepper sauce. Again – stunning.

A strange, never to be repeated thing happened next: we asked them to stop bringing us food. It was like the Monty Python sketch – one more thing & we’d explode.

Wine: two bottles of Chablis grand cru (96 euros each). Its not that we skimped on the wine its just that there wasn’t much we could afford.

All in all, this was a fantastic evening – the service was faultless & the food outstanding. They made you feel great & the atmosphere intoxicating. One of the best (if not thee best) food experiences I’ve had. I can’t recommend it enough.

Final cost: 529 euros (ouch!) plus tip – but worth every penny (until, of course, my credit card bill comes in).

We left after midnight & Guy was at the door to shake our hand & say goodnight. What a star.

Had lunch at Beniot next day - fantastic in a completely different way. If I get a chance I'll post some notes.

[cabrales]

BLH -- What did you think of the decor at Guy Savoy -- did you like the modern art aspects? Which room were you seated in?

[jaybee]

Thanks BLH for that report. Our experience with GS was not as expansive as yours (that is expansive) but very enjoyable. We watched them prepare a duck for a very very old woman seated at a nearby table. It was the bloodiest rare duck I'd ever seen and she tucked into it like a trencherman. The place is intimate and comfortable. I thoroughly enjoyed reading your post.

[Andy Lynes]

BLH - I really enjoyed reading that. The cost does not seem too excessive compared to my recent bill at Petrus for a fair bit less in terms of quantities at least of food and drink. How did experience here compare to the best of London?

[vivin]

BLH,
thanx for the report. Glad to hear that they still care. My first experience was like yours. The second lacked in every respect except the final tab - suffice it say that it was considerably more than yours. I felt ripped off. Maybe it was an off night.
vivin.

[tony h]

Cabrales - we were seated in the middle room. We were put right next to the busiest corridor of the restaurant which my partner thought explained the "special" treatment we had (no one else seemed to get extra portions of their most expensive starter). The decor was wonderful but, perhaps, the only downside to the evening: we could have been in any great city. There was nothing to say that you were actually in Paris - a very minor point.

Cabby – what did you think when you were there? My first choice would have been Grand Vefour but they aren’t open at weekends. Is it worth going to?

Andy – Petrus doesn’t come close in food, décor or service. I like Petrus but its just a (slightly) cheaper carbon copy of RHR. RHR is now virtually impossible to get into – whoch is a shame & given the nonsense of faxing back acceptances & so forth – its easier to jump into a train. The sauces of RHR were probably better than GS – but the rest – nowhere near.

(btw - what did you pay in Petrus?)

Vivin – I’ll probably never go back to GS for that very same worry: it couldn’t possibly meet the same expectations of the first visit. If I was rich enough to call it a local – fine – but this was a treat and to be cherished. Same with RHR – up to last weekend it was the finest meal I’ve had – but that was also due to the circumstances of my visit (I took a very close friend for her 40th birthday & it was our first 3 star – it captured the moment perfectly but if I went back I know I’d less satisfied).