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Exotic Orange Cake

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#31 FWED

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Posted 28 August 2004 - 07:49 PM

Keith: I am glad you liked the cake and didn't find it to difficult. The changes you made sound wonderful. I like the way you think on your feet.

YES you are right, when making the cremeux you do need to take the caramel mix and egg yolks back to the heat to thicken and then add the gelatin. That point isn't exactly clear in the recipe. I apologize for that.

I have also made the cremeux for other cakes and have found that it works best if you really chill it in an ice bath to the consistency of heavy mayonnaise. That way you can either spread it or pipe it.

As to the amount of cake. That can be reduced as you need. I usually make it in a small sheet pan and then cut the circles out. I freeze the left overs and use them for other desserts say with fresh berries and icecream and bits of cake. Or with chocolate and icecream.

I'm still not sure why there seems to be a shortage of Bavarian cream. The majority of the cream should be around the outside not in the middle of the cake. With 4 layers (two cake, one cremeux, one gelee) each about 1/2 inch thick that shouldn't leave much room in the center for the bavarian cream. Oh well back to the drawing board.

Edited by FWED, 28 August 2004 - 08:01 PM.


Fred Rowe

#32 bkeith

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Posted 29 August 2004 - 04:41 AM

YES you are right,  when making the cremeux you do need to take the caramel mix and egg yolks back to the heat to thicken and then add the gelatin.  That point isn't exactly clear in the recipe.  I apologize for that.



No need for apologies. The reason I mentioned that I wasn't familiar with the term cremeux, was that I assumed that a PC probably would know to return the mix to the pot. I just added my experience for the other uninitiated folks so they wouldn't have to backtrack like I did.


As to the amount of cake.  That can be reduced as you need.  I usually make it in a small sheet pan and then cut the circles out.  I freeze the left overs and use them for other desserts say with fresh berries and icecream and bits of cake. Or with chocolate and icecream.


Great idea. I'll probably do the same in the future. In retrospect, the cake layers I made are probably too thick, which cause the problem at the end with getting it all to fit correctly in the ring. Even though I cut the tops off, I'm sure I had much less leftover cake than you have when making it in a sheet, so my cake layers are going to fairly thick. Had I split one of the rounds and just reserved the other one, I'm sure it would have been a little easier to assemble.


I'm still not sure why there seems to be a shortage of Bavarian cream.  The majority of the cream should be around the outside not in the middle of the cake.  With 4 layers (two cake, one cremeux, one gelee) each about 1/2 inch thick that shouldn't leave much room in the center for the bavarian cream.  Oh well back to the drawing board.


I thought about that too. I think my mistake was relying too much on a piping bag. I used a bag to make sure I got the cream in the tight spots around the sides, but should have just squirted out a blob and spread it thin with a spatula for the horizontal parts. Instead, I just filled in by piping. So I'm sure my cream layers are much thicker than yours. Next time I'll be a little smarter on the assembly.

And I think I have to go get some raspberries. It dawned on me that since I wasn't able to do the chocolate spray, I'll have a 1/2" ring of exposed Bavarian cream surrounding the gelee. I think I'll place the berries there to prevent it forming a skin.

Thanks again for the recipe and all the tips, Fred. I'm really looking forward to tucking into this thing tonight.
B. Keith Ryder
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#33 Wendy DeBord

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Posted 29 August 2004 - 05:45 AM

If you look back at my previous post Keith, I had the same results as you. I wound up with 2 -9" cakes (mine didn't deflate after baking, you might have over whipped your whites before folding in- I also didn't grease my cake pan).

I also ran tight on the vanilla orange bavarian, it's pretty exact.........so your hollowed out space for your passion fruit must be exact to displace the right volume.........so you have just the right amount to assemble.

No harm though........


Spraying chocolate with a wagner sprayer gives you a thin coating where as pouring chocolate over your cake would be much too thick, impossible to cut. If you don't have a sprayer do like Keith and use a transfer sheet or you could pour some white chocolate ganche over the edges instead. Or just forget the white chocolate all together, use whipped cream to finish.

I think theres 3 elements that make this cake taste great. It's the soft honey cake, the caramel and the orange.........they compliment each other perfectly. The passion fruit, white chocolate or using any other fruit you have on hand is just adding more..........which isn't really needed for this cake, those 3 elements stand on their own merits.

This torte is exactly like Herme's or Bellouet's or Bau's and a dozen other French pc's style. All their tortes are similar, different mousses, cakes, jellies, brulee's- thats all. You just have to break it down into components and work them how ever fits your time frame. If you read through those chefs books- they instruct you to freeze most of your components as you go. That isn't something I learned on my own..., to look at tortes as layers/components then mix and match.

So as I've worked thru these advanced books I've found zillions of different components that I like. I keep those recipes and assemble tortes according to flavors and textures I like. That's all this 'advanced' stuff comes down to.

#34 FWED

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Posted 29 August 2004 - 07:52 AM

Hi Wendy. Thanks for adding the background on these cakes. I probable should have done that in the beginning and yes Laurent Branlard, who gave me this recipe, is French, and French trained. I appreciated you comments on the three elements that you liked in the cake. It just goes to show that the same cake can appeal to different people in different ways. For me the elements that I liked were the cake, the caramel and the gelee but then I love tart things like lemon, lime, and passion fruit. The white chocolate was just window dressing.

I hope more home and self trained bakers like myself, will try this cake and others like it. As you said, once you get used to the concept their are any number of ways to change the elements. Its fun to have a cake or two that is just a little out of the ordinary and has a WOW factor.

Fred Rowe

#35 amccomb

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Posted 29 August 2004 - 09:06 AM

Any ideas wher I can get passion fruit puree? I've looked all over town and can't find passion fruit in any form, except nectar. I can find both fresh and frozen mangoes, so I can make the mango puree myself.

Also, where can I find the transfer sheets mentioned for the white chocolate, and how does one use them?

#36 bkeith

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Posted 29 August 2004 - 10:56 AM

Any ideas wher I can get passion fruit puree?  I've looked all over town and can't find passion fruit in any form, except nectar.  I can find both fresh and frozen mangoes, so I can make the mango puree myself.

Also, where can I find the transfer sheets mentioned for the white chocolate, and how does one use them?

I get my purees and transfer sheets from (www.auiswiss.com).Albert Uster. I think you can get the purees in single (1 litre) quantities, but I'm not sure with transfer sheets -- they might only sell boxes of 50. That's what I typically buy, and then repackage by the sheet for students and customers. I've got a number of designs I'm willing to part with, but I don't have them online currently. PM me if you're interested. Beryl's also sells by the sheet online. Some cake and candy supply places will carry them, as will most any shop catering to pastry professionals.

As for use, for collaring a cake, I'll cut strips the height of or slightly taller than the cake, lay the strip down on parchment, spread a thin coat of tempered chocolate, and attach it to the side of the cake. Let it set, then peel the plastic off, leaving the design on the chocolate. For an 8-9" cake, it'll take two strips, so you have to be a little careful when joining them.
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#37 bkeith

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Posted 29 August 2004 - 11:02 AM

If you look back at my previous post Keith, I had the same results as you. I wound up with 2 -9" cakes (mine didn't deflate after baking, you might have over whipped your whites before folding in- I also didn't grease my cake pan).

That'll teach me to just grab the recipe and run instead of reading all the followups first. :wink:

I did grease/flour the pans, so I'm sure that's why mine felt free to relax after baking. I think the meringue was ok -- it incorporated pretty easily and didn't look too stiff or dry. Pretty much the same consistency I'd use for a meringue pie.

Thanks for the insight and confirmation.

----8/30/04
Just a quick edit to say the cake was a HUGE success. Dramatic to look at both before and after cutting, and fabulous to eat. Every bite had a slightly different combination of things going on. Definitely a keeper.

Edited by bkeith, 30 August 2004 - 08:30 AM.

B. Keith Ryder
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#38 FoodMan

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Posted 10 September 2004 - 07:19 AM

I started working on my cake last week, following Sinclair's helpful suggestions I made the gelee layer (I had to sub some guava puree for the passion fruit as I also did not have any on hand and had no time to go out to the store and get some :smile:), and the caramel layers and froze them both.
Yesterday I made the honey cake, came out very moist and tasty (I triead some scraps). I baked it in one 9 inch cake pan and cut it in half. Now it resides in my freezer.
I should assemble the whole thing this weekend and I will update this thread hopefully with some pics as well.

I am a little worried about my caramel now after reading Keith's commnets. Should I melt it, cook a little more to thicken, and stir in an ice bath before assembeling? I really do not want it to leak out after all this work :sad:.

Elie

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#39 bkeith

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Posted 10 September 2004 - 09:03 AM

I am a little worried about my caramel now after reading Keith's commnets. Should I melt it, cook a little more to thicken, and stir in an ice bath before assembeling? I really do not want it to leak out after all this work :sad:.



If you didn't return the mixture to the pan and heat it to thicken (as you would for pudding, custard, or pastry cream) after adding the egg yolks, then it'll be too thin. When it thaws, you may find yourself with a mess.

No real need to do the ice bath thing -- I was just hurrying the process. But cooking to thicken, then cooling again before assembling your cake would be a good idea.
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#40 FoodMan

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Posted 10 September 2004 - 11:58 AM

If you didn't return the mixture to the pan and heat it to thicken (as you would for pudding, custard, or pastry cream) after adding the egg yolks, then it'll be too thin.  When it thaws, you may find yourself with a mess.

No real need to do the ice bath thing -- I was just hurrying the process.  But cooking to thicken, then cooling again before assembling your cake would be a good idea.

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Thanks for the reply, I will do that. I am very glad to have checked here first, I would've been very upset if my wonderful layers got soggy with liquid caramel...hmm...that actually does not sound too bad but might not look nice :smile:. I'll make sure to add that comment to my recipe instructions.

Elie

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#41 FoodMan

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Posted 26 September 2004 - 12:54 PM

Finally I have my home PC up and running so here are my cake pictures from a couple of weeks ago. The cake was absolutly delicious and very cool looking. Definitly the most elaborate I've ever made and like Sinclair mentioned the different layers can be used in other preparations, and I intend to do so, especially with the caramel one. For a home cook like myself this was a valuable, pastry lesson. Sorry, I cut the cake a little sooner than I should've and you could see some frost on the top there.

Posted Image
Posted Image

Thanks
Elie

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#42 FWED

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Posted 26 September 2004 - 01:27 PM

I am glad the cake turned out to be such a success. The pictures are great. Everyone at the World Pastry Forum was impressed with it and you are right that for many of us, myself included, this type of confection can be a stretch. I think,however, that this is healthy for any of us and can lead to trying even more complex items.

Fred Rowe

#43 Swisskaese

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Posted 26 September 2004 - 01:29 PM

Foodman that is gorgeous. Makes me want to come through the computer and eat a piece. Good job!!!

#44 Wendy DeBord

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Posted 26 September 2004 - 08:32 PM

I focused in on the same thing Foodman, the caramel layer is terrific! Thanks for sharing your photos Foodman and FWED for sharing the recipe, it's always really fun to see what everyone else is doing and making.

#45 tejon

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Posted 13 October 2004 - 04:33 PM

I'm in the process of making layers and freezing, as Sinclair suggested. It's been invaluable to be able to do each part separately, since there are many firsts for me in this recipe. I just made my first pastry cream this afternoon, and it came out really well. One question - when using gelatin for the gelee and pastry cream, I was unsure if I needed to use hot water to soften, or use some of the ingredients listed in the recipe. I opted to use some of the hot cream in case of the pastry cream, and some water since there wasn't any liquid in the gelee recipe.
Kathy

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#46 lorea

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Posted 13 October 2004 - 05:38 PM

It's amazing how you can begin to crave something just because other people are talking about it! :wub: (<-- We need to find a new "drool" smilie!)

Does anybody have a picture of the actual cake that was submitted in the competition?

#47 FWED

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Posted 13 October 2004 - 06:12 PM

There are several pictures of the cake. The original cake was not submitted for competition but was demonstrated as part of a class, on this style of cake, at the World Pastry Forum. There is a link in the #5 post in this thread to the original posting of pictures of the World Pastry Forum. Go to the #15 post there and the photos are # 7 and 8. In these photos its a square cake. In the #6 post in this thread there is a photo of the cake as I did it as a round cake. Just recently I did this cake and did it as a heart shaped cake.

Fred Rowe

#48 lorea

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Posted 18 October 2004 - 12:12 AM

There are several pictures of the cake.  The original cake was not submitted for competition but was demonstrated as part of a class, on this style of cake, at the World Pastry Forum.  There is a link in the #5 post in this thread to the original posting of pictures of the World Pastry Forum.  Go to the #15 post there and the photos are # 7 and 8.  In these photos its a square cake.  In the #6 post in this thread there is a photo of the cake as I did it as a round cake.  Just recently I did this cake and did it as a heart shaped cake.

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Thanks! I must have missed post #5 in this thread.

I think this cake would be very striking as a heart-shaped cake...sounds like a great idea!

#49 tejon

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Posted 18 October 2004 - 10:53 AM

I finished up the cake this last Saturday and it was a huge hit. I've never attempted something this involved before and am very pleased with the end result. Much learned along the way, including my first creme anglaise and the first time assembling a torte. Next time I will use a thinner layer of gelee, and put a bit of the bavarian in between each layer to keep them from separating on the plate. The taste and texture were amazing. I will definitely make this up again. Thank you, FWED! And a special thank you to Sinclair for suggesting making this in parts and freezing as you go. It made the whole process much easier and less daunting for someone not so familiar with pastry techniques.

Here's the finished cake (power went out for several hours, so this was taken outside):
Posted Image

Slice of cake. I pressed finely grated white chocolate into the sides in lieu of spraying the cake. It worked well and provided a bit of texture (and covered up any irregularities in the sides :wink:):
Posted Image

Edited by tejon, 18 October 2004 - 10:55 AM.

Kathy

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#50 Patrick S

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Posted 01 August 2006 - 11:04 AM

I finally got around to making this last week. The only thing I think I would change next time would be to reduce the amount of whipped cream in the bavaroise, so that the orange flavor is not diluted as much.

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Posted Image
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#51 amccomb

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Posted 01 August 2006 - 11:17 AM

Where can I order froze fruit puree online? I've searched locally and come up empty handed.

#52 Patrick S

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Posted 01 August 2006 - 11:30 AM

You might want to check large liquor stores. I buy a frozen fruit mix (Passion Fruit, Mango, many other flavors) that is made of puree, sugar and citric acid. I can't remember the brand name, but I think it is "____ Island" or something like that. If the recipe calls for sugar to be mixed with puree, you can use this stuff, and adjust the sugar accordingly.
"If you are irritated by every rub, how will you be polished?" - Rumi

#53 Patrick S

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Posted 01 August 2006 - 11:33 AM

Its Island Oasis brand. BTW, mix IO brand Passionfruit (or mango, or pineapple, or a mixture) with vanilla vodka, and use a dropper or syringe to put a tablespoon or so of Chambord on the bottom of the glass (looks like a cherry on the bottom), and you have a killer cocktail.
"If you are irritated by every rub, how will you be polished?" - Rumi

#54 alanamoana

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Posted 01 August 2006 - 02:01 PM

PatrickS,

just a quick question on the gelee...it looks like a rather thick layer to my eye. does the recipe call for that, or is it a matter of personal taste? i feel like (just from seeing, not tasting) that it might cover up the other flavors of the cake and bavarois? what do you think?

edited to add: it is beautiful!

Edited by alanamoana, 01 August 2006 - 02:02 PM.


#55 duckduck

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Posted 01 August 2006 - 02:11 PM

The original from the class was very thin and there were several thin inner layers not just one of each mousse. It would look more like the entremets you see in PA&D.
Pamela Wilkinson
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#56 Patrick S

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Posted 01 August 2006 - 07:31 PM

PatrickS,

just a quick question on the gelee...it looks like a rather thick layer to my eye.  does the recipe call for that, or is it a matter of personal taste?  i feel like (just from seeing, not tasting) that it might cover up the other flavors of the cake and bavarois?  what do you think?

edited to add:  it is beautiful!

View Post


Proportionally, the gelee layer is quite thick. Its slightly thicker than it should be, because the gelee was molded in an 8" pan rather than a 8 3/4" mold, as the recipe called for. It didn't overwhelm the other layers, but I personally I think it would be best if all the layers were about equal thickness. This was my first time using this recipe, and I'll probably reduce the size of the gelee layers next time around.
"If you are irritated by every rub, how will you be polished?" - Rumi

#57 oli

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Posted 02 August 2006 - 01:03 AM

PatrickS,

just a quick question on the gelee...it looks like a rather thick layer to my eye.  does the recipe call for that, or is it a matter of personal taste?  i feel like (just from seeing, not tasting) that it might cover up the other flavors of the cake and bavarois?  what do you think?

edited to add:  it is beautiful!

View Post


Proportionally, the gelee layer is quite thick. Its slightly thicker than it should be, because the gelee was molded in an 8" pan rather than a 8 3/4" mold, as the recipe called for. It didn't overwhelm the other layers, but I personally I think it would be best if all the layers were about equal thickness. This was my first time using this recipe, and I'll probably reduce the size of the gelee layers next time around.

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Patrick, what is that dark ring around your cake in the photo, or is that a metal ring that you used for assembly?

Edited by oli, 02 August 2006 - 06:35 AM.


#58 Patrick S

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Posted 02 August 2006 - 05:11 AM

PatrickS,

just a quick question on the gelee...it looks like a rather thick layer to my eye.  does the recipe call for that, or is it a matter of personal taste?  i feel like (just from seeing, not tasting) that it might cover up the other flavors of the cake and bavarois?  what do you think?

edited to add:  it is beautiful!

View Post


Proportionally, the gelee layer is quite thick. Its slightly thicker than it should be, because the gelee was molded in an 8" pan rather than a 8 3/4" mold, as the recipe called for. It didn't overwhelm the other layers, but I personally I think it would be best if all the layers were about equal thickness. This was my first time using this recipe, and I'll probably reduce the size of the gelee layers next time around.

View Post

Patrick, what is that dark ring around your cake in the photo, or is that a metal ring that you use for assembly?

View Post



The cake is sitting on the base of a 9" springform pan, which the cake was assembled in, and the cake+springform base are sitting on a glass cake stand.
"If you are irritated by every rub, how will you be polished?" - Rumi

#59 alanamoana

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Posted 02 August 2006 - 08:42 AM

thanks for the reply patrick. sounds good.

i meant to ask you about this on the dessert thread...you posted a mousse roll recently...did you use a specific recipe for the sponge? it rolled so perfectly, no cracking etc. a thing of beauty. maybe i should post this over there?

#60 K8memphis

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Posted 02 August 2006 - 09:47 AM

I've got the cakes baked. And I'm in process of making a run to the store/s for the vanilla beans, purees, some more eggs & stuff. But nobody seems to have the purees in Memphis that I can find. sniff

Maybe I should call a restaurant.

Edited to say: ok I went back & read page 2. So I will try the liquor stores to find the Island Oasis stuff. Thanks, guys.

Edited by K8memphis, 02 August 2006 - 09:56 AM.






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