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Chocolate Mousse: Recipes, Questions

Chocolate Dessert

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#91 chiantiglace

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Posted 22 November 2010 - 02:47 AM

Lets look at some percentages shall we?



170g (6oz) dark chocolate (52% cocoa)
150ml (5fl oz) full-fat milk
1 egg yolk
4 egg whites
20g (3/4oz) powdered sugar

So out of 495g total we have:

170 - 34% Chocolate
150 - 30% Milk
15 - 3% yolk
140 - 28% white
20 - 4% sugar

setting agent is at 34% and aeration agent is at 28%. Unfortunately your aeration is too low and unstable for your setting amount. You have a few options, all leading to reducing your liquifying agent at 37% (milk, sugar, yolk) and since you are not cooking this mix eggs will simply count as a liquefier.

Here are your options, you can replace all ingredients, besides chocolate, with heavy cream and even reduce your chocolate quantity as low as 20%, or you can reduce your milk by half which is completely logical as well. A two to one ratio of chocolate to milk will give you enough stabilization to gain a firm mousse. You can also use a more stable aeration and reduce your liquefier by a quarter. A stable aeration like whipped cream, pate a bombe or italian meringue. Part of your problem is the egg whites breaking down as the mousse sets. The egg whites are very dry on top as all of the moisture/water molecules drop to the bottom, thats why it appears to be set on top and not all the way through, really its just forming a thick aerated skin. You may have also over whipped the egg whites and or waited to long to incorporate, having a more stable aerating ingredient can resolve these issues.

Switching to cream for the milk in a "ganache" is not going to give you a much better result, not really at all because the cream is not being aerated and remains in the liquid form. Try to get your aeration percentage above 50% and you will be just fine.
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#92 Varun Sheth

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Posted 22 November 2010 - 03:58 AM

Lets look at some percentages shall we?



170g (6oz) dark chocolate (52% cocoa)
150ml (5fl oz) full-fat milk
1 egg yolk
4 egg whites
20g (3/4oz) powdered sugar

So out of 495g total we have:

170 - 34% Chocolate
150 - 30% Milk
15 - 3% yolk
140 - 28% white
20 - 4% sugar

setting agent is at 34% and aeration agent is at 28%. Unfortunately your aeration is too low and unstable for your setting amount. You have a few options, all leading to reducing your liquifying agent at 37% (milk, sugar, yolk) and since you are not cooking this mix eggs will simply count as a liquefier.

Here are your options, you can replace all ingredients, besides chocolate, with heavy cream and even reduce your chocolate quantity as low as 20%, or you can reduce your milk by half which is completely logical as well. A two to one ratio of chocolate to milk will give you enough stabilization to gain a firm mousse. You can also use a more stable aeration and reduce your liquefier by a quarter. A stable aeration like whipped cream, pate a bombe or italian meringue. Part of your problem is the egg whites breaking down as the mousse sets. The egg whites are very dry on top as all of the moisture/water molecules drop to the bottom, thats why it appears to be set on top and not all the way through, really its just forming a thick aerated skin. You may have also over whipped the egg whites and or waited to long to incorporate, having a more stable aerating ingredient can resolve these issues.

Switching to cream for the milk in a "ganache" is not going to give you a much better result, not really at all because the cream is not being aerated and remains in the liquid form. Try to get your aeration percentage above 50% and you will be just fine.


Very informative post!

Is tempereing eggs considered cooking them? Because I am pouring the hot milk and melted chocolate over my eggs. Sugar is not cooked yes.

I whipped my whites to stiff peaks though there was some liquid present in the whites when I folded it into the above mixture. This is maybe overwhipping them.

Perhaps as you have suggested I should reduce my quantity of milk by half to get a more stable mousse (this would make aeration % 33) or I can altogether omit the milk as it just dilutes the melted chocolate and then this would give me aeration % 40. Leaving the yolk in would give it that extra richness either way since there is no cream. I would prefer whipped egg whites over whipped cream as it is lighter and would last longer in the refrigerator than cream would. Advantage of cream would be that it would be eggless dessert and that sells from where I am.

Should give both versions a try and report back with some pics. What say?

Edited by Varun Sheth, 22 November 2010 - 04:01 AM.


#93 Varun Sheth

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Posted 22 November 2010 - 08:57 AM

I tried two versions, one with no milk but egg yolk egg whites remained same and so did the sugar. The volume I achieved with this was very poor and the mousse was too dense and I had to put in effort to take a scoop of the mousse. What I will do next time is make it with half the milk from the original recipe as you suggested and the consistency would be much better.

Second version was made with whipped cream and melted chocolate nothing else. This completely took away the rich chocolate flavor. However the consistency was spot on.

#94 Chefkitty

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Posted 24 November 2010 - 08:25 PM

I like to add some espresso to my chocolate mousse. Roughly 1/2 of a shot to a cup of cream. It's subtle, but the bitterness frames the chocolate flavor nicely.

#95 LindaK

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Posted 29 November 2010 - 08:55 PM

Interesting how different chocolate mousse recipes can be. The problem you describe is one I've had only with leftover mousse after many days, maybe a week, sitting in the fridge, when it starts to separate. It hardly ever lasts that long anyway. I could not have offered you the beautifully detailed critique of your recipe that chiantiglace provided, my hat's off.

My basic recipe could not be more different but I've been making it for years and it has not yet failed me. Credit to Patricia Wells, "Bistro Cooking."

8 oz/250 g bittersweet chocolate
4 oz/120 g unsalted butter
8 large egg yolks
1/2 cup/100 g sugar
5 large egg whites
flavorings such as vanilla (I always use it), coffee, grand marnier, etc.

good luck!


 


#96 Shalmanese

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Posted 30 November 2010 - 07:56 PM

Did you leave it in the fridge covered or uncovered? It could be that the top has dehydrated which gives it the appearance of being set.
PS: I am a guy.

#97 QbanCrackr

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Posted 01 September 2011 - 02:04 PM

ok sooooo my chocolate mousse used to be ok when i'd make small batches....but i've had to increase my production and its just not the same product anymore its like a 50/50 chance it'll either come out smooth or grainy

this is my recipe

4# 8oz milk chocolate
16oz whole milk
3 sticks butter
24oz heavy cream
2tbsp gelatin
9c heavy cream

melt milk & butter, pour over chocolate, stir to combine
bloom gelatin in 16oz cream, melt & combine with chocolate mixture
whip 9c cream to soft/medium peaks then combine it all together (after its all properly cooled)

could i be overmixing it? i'm honestly not sure what to do here, i've used this recipe for the better part of a year now and its always worked well but now with the larger quantities its getting frustrating =/

does anyone have some knowledge as to why this could be happening? i'll even switch to a different recipe thats easier to work with in larger amounts if need be

thanks in advance
Danny

#98 Lisa Shock

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Posted 01 September 2011 - 02:49 PM

You may be burning the chocolate. What happens when you increase the volume of a recipe like this is that the hot milk, butter, and cream represents a proportionately larger hot mass that won't cool off as quickly because of the physics of the surface area to mass ratio. Also, it's the hottest part of the summer and your ambient room temperature is hotter as well. Even a few degrees difference in the room temperature affects things.

I would:
Carefully monitor and regulate the temperature of the milk.
Add the butter after the milk has heated the chocolate, just before stirring -maybe cut into small chunks.
Carefully regulate the temperature of the cream as it heats.
Temp the mixture as you work and try to keep it as low as possible.
Take notes about the room's temperature each time.

Hope this helps!

#99 Broken English

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Posted 01 September 2011 - 05:15 PM

I would say that the chocolate is overheated, but I'm not sure how given your method. Hope you can get it sorted.

Edited by Broken English, 01 September 2011 - 05:25 PM.

James.

#100 QbanCrackr

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Posted 02 September 2011 - 04:44 AM

yeah, at first i could just mix the chocolate, milk & butter and melt them all together and it was ok. but once the #s went up, i started burning it..so i heated the milk & butter together, then poured it over the chocolate and combined it. if it didn't melt completely i'd just put it over a dbl boiler and finish melting it. i think i'm going to try melting the chocolate first, melting the butter with the milk, and then combine the 2 liquids and see how that goes =/

it always ends up coming out as a nice dense mousse, not the typical light and airy fluffy mousse you see everywhere else so i'm really hoping to be able to keep it like this hehe
Danny

#101 KaffeeKlatsch

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Posted 02 September 2011 - 08:13 AM

this is my recipe

4# 8oz milk chocolate
16oz whole milk
3 sticks butter
24oz heavy cream
2tbsp gelatin
9c heavy cream

melt milk & butter, pour over chocolate, stir to combine
bloom gelatin in 16oz cream, melt & combine with chocolate mixture
whip 9c cream to soft/medium peaks then combine it all together (after its all properly cooled)


Just curious. When is the other 8 oz of cream added? You're whipping 9 cups and you're using 16 of the otheer 24 oz to bloom the gelatin. Is it added with the milk, or do you add it to the 16 oz after the gelatin is bloomed?

#102 QbanCrackr

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Posted 02 September 2011 - 12:54 PM

Just curious. When is the other 8 oz of cream added?


whoooops yeah thats part of the cream to bloom the gelatin in, don't know how that escaped me :blink:
Danny

#103 pastrygirl

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Posted 03 September 2011 - 06:24 AM

I think you could be overmixing it. The larger batch is going to take a few more strokes,
and if your cream is on the stiff side that could be enough to break it.

I'm skeptical about the scorched chocolate theory posted above. Anything is
possible, but since when does boiling liquid scorch chocolate? I have used boiling
Caramel sauce with a much higher heat capacity to melt chocolate and not
had problems.

You changed your method of making your ganache base, so now you need
To make sure your new method gets it to the same temperature. Agitating this
mixture at too cool a temp could cause it to break. And with the
bigger batch try whipping your cream a little softer so it will allow a little
more mixing.

Edited by pastrygirl, 03 September 2011 - 06:49 AM.


#104 QbanCrackr

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Posted 04 September 2011 - 09:18 AM

I think you could be overmixing it. The larger batch is going to take a few more strokes,
and if your cream is on the stiff side that could be enough to break it.

yeah since its such a large volume, i use a whisk first to kind of bring it together then fold it all in, but even then its just so much :blink:

You changed your method of making your ganache base, so now you need
To make sure your new method gets it to the same temperature. Agitating this
mixture at too cool a temp could cause it to break. And with the
bigger batch try whipping your cream a little softer so it will allow a little
more mixing.

after adding the gelatin, i'd let the whole mixture come to room temperature, then add about 20-25% of the whipped cream to lighten the mixture, then fold in the rest...dump it in a plastic container and wait until the following day to see if it turned out ok :wacko:

but i'm going to try whipping the cream softer when i make some today...thing is since its always a big hot in my kitchen, i whip it a little firmer so it holds up longer..or at least that was the idea
Danny

#105 mm84321

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Posted 03 January 2013 - 08:10 PM

Is it technically possible to "unset" a sabayon based chocolate mousse after it has already set in the refrigerator, in order to make it spreadable again and then allow it to "reset" in the fridge? Can I just temper it in a bain marie, or will that ruin the texture of the mousse?

#106 jmacnaughtan

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Posted 04 January 2013 - 01:55 AM

If you heat it you'll risk losing all of the air. Can you not just use it as is, or is it too firm? I've used a crème anglaise based mousse like this, so a sabayon-base might work as well.

#107 JohnT

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Posted 22 February 2014 - 02:47 PM

Hi All, this is my first post on the eG forums. I make pre-cooked frozen meals in Cape Town and have started adding some desserts to my menu. One I am struggling with is a chocolate mousse which tends to separate slightly (gets a bit mushy on the bottom) when defrosted. I am using an old recipe used for many years (but never before needing to freeze), consisting of:

6 large eggs, separated, whites whipped to hard peak stage
300 g Bournville chocolate, melted
500 ml cream, whipped to hard peak stage
Yolks mixed into the chocolate when slightly cooled then egg whites folded in followed by the cream folded in and refrigerated.

Any suggestions or pointers to a chocolate mousse recipe that will not separate when frozen and then defrosted?

John
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#108 Shel_B

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Posted 23 February 2014 - 11:20 AM

What is Bournville chocolate?  Is it a brand?  A type of chocolate?  What's the cocoa percentage?


.... Shel


#109 jmacnaughtan

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Posted 23 February 2014 - 11:34 AM

If you add a touch of gelatin, it should hold up better in the freezer.  Try around 0.5% by weight, then adjust if necessary.

 

Also, you may be overwhipping your cream.  Try whipping it just to soft peaks.


Edited by jmacnaughtan, 23 February 2014 - 11:35 AM.


#110 JohnT

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Posted 23 February 2014 - 11:59 AM

@ Shel_B - I should have stated that Bournville Chocolate is a dark chocolate produced by Cadbury. It is high in cocoa solids and used a lot in cooking. They also produce Bournville Cocoa Powder. We have a limited choice of chocolate for cooking available in Southern Africa. Our main chocolate suppliers are Nesle and Cadbury but Nesle chocolate is pretty bad when heated to make a ganache, as it cristalises into a solid lump with even slight heat.

@ jmacnaughtan - Thanks for the gelatin idea. I was thinking along these lines as I did it with a non-baked cheesecake and it freezes well and defrosts extremely well and still holds up - tastes darn good! However, what I was thinking of doing was to whip it in with the cream as that is the last ingredient that gets folded into the bowl. I will give this a go during the week with a test batch and see if it holds the mousse together after defrosting.

John
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#111 jmacnaughtan

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Posted 23 February 2014 - 12:13 PM

You might find it easier to heat the egg yolks to 40-50°C then incorporate the bloomed gelatin into them.  It would lower the risk of the gelatin pre-setting or not mixing in properly. 


Edited by jmacnaughtan, 23 February 2014 - 12:13 PM.


#112 JohnT

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Posted 23 February 2014 - 12:53 PM

Thanks, that makes more sence and will give it a go. I will report back after doing a test batch.

John
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#113 teonzo

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Posted 23 February 2014 - 01:27 PM

The main problem is given by the egg whites, you whip them at hard peaks and without making them stable (Italian meringue). You end up overwhipping and overmixing them while you mix your batters, in this way the whites separate a bit and you get the mushy effect.

Plus you have the troubles of using raw eggs (unless you pasteurize them or use already pasteurized eggs, but doesn't seem so if you talk about separating them).

 

I would try a simpler and quicker recipe, like this one:

 

350 g dark chocolate 70%

350 g cream

500 g cream

Make a ganache with the chocolate and the first amount of cream. If your chocolate has a different % then you need to re-balance the ganache,

Wait until the ganache cools to 35°C, then add the second amount of cream (whipped to soft peaks).

This mousse is stable and really easy to make.

 

When you make mousses and similars you always have to whip your stuff to soft peaks and not to hard peaks, this way it will be much easier to mix the batters and you will avoid overwhipping and overmixing troubles (mostly resulting in air/volume loss and separation).

 

 

 

Teo


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#114 JohnT

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Posted 23 February 2014 - 01:45 PM

Hi Teo,

Thanks. However, I have done it your way and that is worse! I am not using it with any batter, but as a stand alone dessert chocolate mousse that I set in portions in the refrigerator and then freeze, once they have set. They are then defrosted in the refrigerator for the day they are needed. It is when defrosting the product that it separates slightly. If they are not frozen, I have no separation problems. But, they have to be frozen due to the business I am in!

John

Edited by JohnT, 23 February 2014 - 01:46 PM.

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#115 teonzo

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Posted 23 February 2014 - 03:03 PM

Then it seems that the problem lies in how you freeze and defrost them. There should be no need to let them set in the refrigerator before freezing them, you should try to put them immediately in the freezer. Pay attention on how you defrost them, if you get the same problem with 2 different recipes then it sounds more like a problem of condensation during defrosting.

 

 

 

Teo


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#116 JohnT

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Posted 27 February 2014 - 04:02 AM

Test Results

A quick feed-back. I made a test batch of mousse on Monday, using the exact original recipe I posted at the start of the thread, except I added 8g of powdered gelatin, dissolved in 20ml hot water, to the egg yolks before mixing the yolks into the melted chocolate. I whipped the egg whites and folded into the mixture and then whipped the cream to soft peak stage and folded that into the mixture. Portioned it, chilled it, wrapped and labeled then froze. Defrosted a couple overnight and an excellent result - no separation and cannot detect any difference in mouth-feel.

Thanks to all that responded to my query.

John
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#117 leonidas

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Posted 22 March 2014 - 02:24 PM

Hello everyone......   :smile:

I'm reading you for a long time like a visitor and i'm glad that i became a member at last...

 

Can anyone help me please with this chocolates strawberry and caramel flavour....???

I don't have any info about the chocolates because i bought them in bulk from a coffee shop... :unsure:

Chips.jpg
free image hosting

 

I want to make two different mousse's,a strawberry mousse and a caramel mousse but without real strawberry's and caramel  in saucepan because flavour and colour is in the chocolate's already, correctly...???? :unsure:

 

Can anyone help me please with an idea or recipe..???

 

Thank you for your time and i'm sorry for my English,is not my native language....  :blush: :blush:







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