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Pate de Fruit (Fruit Paste/Fruit Jellies)

Confections

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#31 andiesenji

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Posted 15 May 2004 - 10:49 AM

These vendors carry basic flavors candy centers.
http://www.confectioneryhouse.com/
http://www.cybercake...dy_centers.html
http://www.sugarcraft.com/D-candy.htm
http://www.sweetc.com/sweetc.htm

This is a site for professionals with links to
other pro sites.
http://www.confectioneryarts.com/

and this
http://www.cookingsc...books-supplies/
http://www.chocovision.com/

The following site has a vast array of links to sites for both professional and non-pro people who want culinary information.
http://www.foodrefer...html/links.html
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#32 LSiegel

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Posted 10 January 2005 - 03:26 PM

The thread on kosher gelatin reminded me of a question I have - I've been trying my hand at fruit gels, unsuccessfully. The recipes I've tried have been based on gelatin as a gelling agent, and I've ended up either with inedible rubber balls, or gels that never properly set up. I assume there is an issue with the ratio of gelatin to liquid in these recipes, but I'm not sure what the correct ratio would be.

Also, on the back page of a recent issue of Fine Cooking, they showed Thomas Haas making his pate de fruit, and noted that he uses apple pectin as his gelling agent. I've not been able to find any recipes based on fruit pectin, but like the idea.

Does anyone have a recipe based on fruit pectin? Or a reliable recipe based on gelatin? Or general thoughts on the relative benefits of using pectin, gelatin, agar agar or any other gelling agent for making fruit gels?

#33 andiesenji

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Posted 10 January 2005 - 04:16 PM

You could try my recipe for lakhoum.
You can substitute any concentrated fruit puree for the orange/lemon, etc.

Lakhoum, also known as
Turkish Delight
Rind of 1 medium lemon finely grated
1/4 cup lemon juice
3 cups sugar (superfine)
1/2 cup (4 oz) water
2 tablespoons gelatin/agar agar or guar gum (for vegetarian candy)
1 cup (8 fl oz) water, extra
2/3 cup cornstarch
1 tablespoon rose flower water or one teaspoon rose extract/food grade
red food coloring - couple of drops only.

1/2 cup icing (confectioners) sugar for coating finished confection.

For orange flavored candy, substitute for the lemon and rose flavors -
Rind of 1 medium orange
1/4 cup (2 fl oz) orange juice concentrate.
3-4 drops of orange flower water.

Other flavors may be used, concentrated syrups, blackcurrant, orgeat, strawberry, cherry and raspberry. Use about 1/4 to 1/3 cup of syrup or strained fruit puree.

Line base and sides of an 8 inch square cake pan with aluminum foil, leaving the edges of the foil extending out over the edges of the pan.
Brush or spray foil with canola oil or melted butter.

Remove white pith from citrus rinds.

Combine the rind, juice, sugar and water in large pan with a heavy bottom.
Stir over medium heat without boiling until the sugar has completely dissolved.
Brush the sugar crystals that form on the sides of pan with a wet pastry brush.
Bring to a boil, reduce heat slightly and continue boiling without stirring for 5 minutes or until a teaspoon of the mixture dropped into cold water forms long threads.
If you are using a sugar thermometer it must reach 221 F.
Combine gelatin with 1/2 cup (4 fl oz) extra water in a small bowl set over barely simmering water.
Stir until dissolved.

In a separate bowl combine cornstarch with the remaining water and mix until smooth.
Add both the gelatin and cornstarch mixtures to the sugar syrup.

Stir the mixture over medium heat until the mixture boils and clears.
Stir in the flower water or rose water and a few drops red food coloring.
Strain mixture through a fine mesh strainer into the foil-lined cake pan.
Refrigerate over night.
When firmly set, turn out onto a cutting board sprinkled with confectioners sugar.
Peel off the foil and cut the confection into cubes.
Roll cubes in confectioner's sugar.

Store in an airtight container.
"There are, it has been said, two types of people in the world. There are those who say: this glass is half full. And then there are those who say: this glass is half empty. The world belongs, however, to those who can look at the glass and say: What's up with this glass? Excuse me? Excuse me? This is my glass? I don't think so. My glass was full! And it was a bigger glass!" Terry Pratchett
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#34 tan319

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Posted 10 January 2005 - 08:04 PM

Boiron fruit purees have catalog/charts available that have very good pate de fruit recipes.
All involve apple pectin ( I use the pastry 1/patisfrance one) and I would bet that Hass is using a similar recipe.
A refractometer is usually called for too.
2317/5000

#35 andiesenji

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Posted 10 January 2005 - 09:41 PM

I also have a recipe using apple pectin, it results in a product similar to "Aplets".
I don't have it in my computer so will have to look for the card and type it up.
"There are, it has been said, two types of people in the world. There are those who say: this glass is half full. And then there are those who say: this glass is half empty. The world belongs, however, to those who can look at the glass and say: What's up with this glass? Excuse me? Excuse me? This is my glass? I don't think so. My glass was full! And it was a bigger glass!" Terry Pratchett
My blog:Books,Cooks,Gadgets&Gardening

#36 mckayinutah

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Posted 11 January 2005 - 06:27 AM

Boiron fruit purees have catalog/charts available that have very good pate de fruit recipes.
All involve apple pectin ( I use the pastry 1/patisfrance one) and I would bet that Hass is using a similar recipe.
A refractometer is usually called for too.

View Post



The only time I have made pate de fruit was using Boiron fruit purees and the chart that Ted is refering to. They are the best I have ever had.

I get my apple pectin from Albert Uster imports and it is a rather large conatiner (5 1/2 #), which would make alot of pate de fruit. I also do not know if they ship to the general public.

The recipes that Boiron has do not require a refractometer, if that is of concern.


Take care,

Jason

#37 LSiegel

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Posted 11 January 2005 - 07:48 AM

Thanks for the suggestions.

I found a source for the Boiron fruit purees on-line, but no information on recipes. Any suggestions for where I could find the recipes? Thanks.

#38 JSkilling

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Posted 11 January 2005 - 07:59 AM

Go here:

http://www.boironfre.../uk/uk_docs.htm

And click on the right hand side for any of the recipes. They'll give you the correct amounts to use of each of their purees. This is why you won't need a refractometer if you are using their recipes - they've already done that for you.
Josette

#39 jgarner53

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Posted 11 January 2005 - 11:20 AM

I will chime in my 2¢ worth here with the Boiron purées. I made 5 different flavors of pâte de fruits for the holidays. They all turned out great with the exception of the apple, which had a strange texture and didn't quite set the same way as the others did. I eventually threw them away. Their chart is very helpful.
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#40 FWED

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Posted 11 January 2005 - 12:42 PM

Nightscotsman turned me on to pate de fruits a year ago at Christmas time and I have been making and enjoying them since. It took me a while to find a source of purees and apple pectin in small quantities.

I highly recommend the apple pectin as other supermarket and candy pectins are made from citrus and don't have what it takes to do the job. My first few trials were just that. Trial and error. Once I got the Boiron purees and the apple pectin I was on my way.

Last summer I bought a refractometer and, while it isn't absolutely necessary, I did find that when using it that the quality of my jellies was more consistent. I also found out that temp given on the Boiron direction sheet is just a guide. The hot jelly mixture can reach a brix of 75 a few degrees above or below the 225 temp given. It seems it all depends upon how fast or slow you reach the 225 temp and since all of our stoves and pots and pans cook differently the refractometer takes the guess work out of it for me. Before I got the refractometer I had some luck with jellies that seemed too soft and that weeped after being cut and sugared. I remelted them and brought them up to 225 degrees and poured them out again. I think the added sugar probably brought the brix up to 75 or better. I haven't had to do that lately.

Thanks to Nightscotsman for introducing me to this delight.

Fred Rowe

#41 LSiegel

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Posted 11 January 2005 - 01:51 PM

FWED, what was the source that you found for small quantities of the apple pectin?
So far, I've found a decent source for the fruit puree, but not the pectin.

I also would be interested in info on refractometers, in case I decide to go that route. Don't know much about them - a quick on-line surf revealed a range of options, most at fairly steep prices.

And thanks for the suggestions on how to fix bad batches if I don't get one.

#42 rickster

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Posted 11 January 2005 - 02:23 PM

l'epicerie.com sells 6 oz of apple pectin for $9.50. It's in their "hard to find" baker's pantry section. I've also seen it at meilleurduchef.com in 1 kilo quantities.

I'd be interested in small quantity sources for high quality fruit purees.

#43 McDuff

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Posted 11 January 2005 - 02:44 PM

There's an outfit in Worcester MA called Primarque which has apple pectin in pound or two pound cans. Do a google thing and they should turn up, as they have a web site. I've tried Michel Roux's recipe and Michael Hu gave me his recipe and I tried that too. Tricky little devils. Boiling something to 217 that is that thick is problematic, but I've had successes and failures. I used Perfect Puree.

#44 FWED

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Posted 11 January 2005 - 03:26 PM

I got my refractometer on ebay and there are several discussions about them here on eGullet. Just go to search and type in refractometer. I use mine for candy only so I got a model that only goes form 40 to 80 brix. It was cheaper that way. I get my purees and apple pectin from a small candy supply company here in town. To bad they doesn't do mail order. I do understand the Perfect Purees will sell in smaller quantities.

Fred Rowe

#45 stscam

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Posted 11 January 2005 - 05:19 PM

You should be able to get a decent refractometer on E-bay for well less than $100. If you're doing pate de fruits, you need one in the 40-80 range. While one of these "scopes" is not necessary, as others have said, it sure takes the guess work out of making pate. I use a thermometer now just to monitor when to add my ingredients. Once they're all in I switch to the refractometer. You want to aim for 72-75 Brix. When you've hit that, turn off the heat, add the tartartic or citric acid, stir quickly, then pour. A properly made pate will begin to gel almost immediately. A kilo of puree will make a full Half Sheet of pate de fruit.

Good luck and have fun.

Cheers,
Steve Smith
Glacier Country

#46 Gary

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Posted 20 February 2005 - 09:30 AM

I'm almost ready to take the plunge and try making these pate de fruits at home. I had some at LeNotre in Las Vegas and they were good. Before I start, I'd like to ask a few questions of the group:

- Did you use "tartaric acid" or just lemon juice in the Boiron recipe?
- What type of pan should be used to form the pate de fruit? A jelly roll pan?
- Do you spray the jelly roll pan with Pam or something to prevent sticking?
- Does it really have to sit for 48 hours before cutting? Does it rest on a cookie sheet or in the pan?

Thanks!

Gary

#47 andiesenji

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Posted 20 February 2005 - 09:48 AM

I use a half-sheet pan and a Silpat liner.
"There are, it has been said, two types of people in the world. There are those who say: this glass is half full. And then there are those who say: this glass is half empty. The world belongs, however, to those who can look at the glass and say: What's up with this glass? Excuse me? Excuse me? This is my glass? I don't think so. My glass was full! And it was a bigger glass!" Terry Pratchett
My blog:Books,Cooks,Gadgets&Gardening

#48 jackal10

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Posted 20 February 2005 - 09:57 AM

Can one use pectin sold for jam making, like Certo? Its sold in small quantities in most supermarkets, next to the jam suger and is apple pectin.

Q:  What is Certo made of?

A:  Certo is made from the residue of pressed apples, which is a rich source of pectin.

Q:  Is Certo a natural product?

A:  The pectin used in Certo is extracted from apples and is extensively filtered so that only the pectin and water used in the process remain.  In this natural state Certo then requires a minor adjustment in acidity to assist setting performance and the addition of a small amount of preservative. Therefore, under UK guidelines, Certo cannot be described as completely ‘natural’.



#49 culinary bear

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Posted 20 February 2005 - 10:08 AM

I've just stumbled onto this thread...

We use a red wine pate de fruits in the kitchen at work; basically a gelled red wine poaching liquor that's been used to poach figs (the pate accompanies this).

The pectin we buy is French, apple-derived, and costs well under US$20 a kilo.

For a beginner, the boiron charts are very useful, as is the 'peanut butter and jelly' recipe from the French Laundry cookbook - the basic measurements are spot on, and it's a pate de fruit by another name.

I've made turkish delight with pectin, and have to report that the texture differs from gelatine-set. Just doesn't have the same mouthfeel. You'll find that pectin requires acidity and a certain sugar concentration to work properly, whereas gelatine can work independently of these two requirements.
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#50 Sweet Kate

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Posted 25 November 2005 - 06:09 PM

I have been making pate de fruit lately using cap fruit recipes and purees. I find them a bit too sweet but am afraid to adjust the sugar content and risk having it over or under gel.
Has anyone coated their pate de fruit with sour sugar? I assume I can just add citric acid to sugar. Formulas?

#51 hotgemini77

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Posted 27 February 2006 - 12:24 AM

I made pate de fruit and i thought it was too sweet can i lessen the sugar by a 100g and come up with the same result, like will it still be firm enough to cut....should i do something like increase the pectin?

#52 nicolekaplan

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Posted 27 February 2006 - 07:51 AM

why not try a recipe from one of the puree companies. they are all carefully balanced
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#53 stscam

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Posted 27 February 2006 - 03:27 PM

why not try a recipe from one of the puree companies. they are all carefully balanced


Generally speaking, you can use glucose to lower the sweetness level in the pates, but balance is crucial. - you can't really do a 1:1 substitution.

But Nicole is right. Boiron publishes a sheet with formulas for their purees. Though we make our own purees here, we've had great success with the Boiron recipes (slightly tweaked - we use a refractometer to check the sugar level of the fruit, then adjust that to bring it up to the values shown on the Boiron sheet). You might be able to find the Boiron formula sheet on their website.

A refractometer is not absolutely necessary (though immensely helpful if you plan to do a lot of pates). Without one, knowing when your mass has cooked long enough becomes much more of an art than a science. Still, you should be able to achieve good results. Just keep stirring the mixture all the time and keep a close eye on its viscosity. It's easy to overcook and find your pate de fruit setting up as you try to pour it into your pan.

Good luck and keep us posted!

Cheers,
Steve Smith
Glacier Country

#54 Truffle Guy

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Posted 27 February 2006 - 04:39 PM

I made pate de fruit and i thought it was too sweet can i lessen the sugar by a 100g and come up with the same result, like will it still be firm enough to cut....should i do something like increase the pectin?

View Post



I echo the previous posts, Boiron has a good recipe. I did get a great reaction when I added citric acid to the recipe once when I was out of tartaric acid, it made the pate de fruit more tart. Not sure if it is what you want to do but it certainly got a positive reaction with the Passion Fruit and Morello Cherry.

#55 John DePaula

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Posted 27 February 2006 - 09:03 PM

I think this is the link to Boiron's Pates de fruits recettes:
Boiron Pates de fruits Recipes
John DePaula
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#56 hotgemini77

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Posted 28 February 2006 - 12:55 AM

thanks for all the helpful info. Yes, i do have the Boiron pate de fruit guide sheet, since i only Boiron for my jellies. However, i do find the calculations inaccurate, the strawberry recipe, i made 3x and it did not se. First time i got, jam, second, i got a thicker jam and third try i got a jelly i could barely cut. I increased pectin, varied cooking time and still got nothing. I do not have a refractometer, so Yes i have to watch it carefully, after 20 tries on 3 fruit purees, the blackberry, strawberry and cassis, I have learned a lot. My findings were that the blackberry is the only one that i can get to set nicely, firm enough to cut but still soft and chewy. I know that strawberry is lower in pectin but increasing the pectin and tartaric acid does not seem to help. I am a bit stuck..........i would like to have more flavours than just my blackberry.
this is the recipe i used:

pate de fruit blackberry

500g puree, i like Boiron blackberry and 50 g sugar
- boil then add 20 g pectin
- Boil 3 min
- add sugar 480 g
- Boil 2min
- Add glucose 100 g
Boil 106 F
add 10ml citric acid, pour into mold.

this recipe i made seems to only be good with the blackberry....help me.....

#57 stscam

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Posted 28 February 2006 - 10:58 AM

What kind of pectin are you using? This can make all the difference in the world.

I used to get bags of pectin from my supplier. It worked very well - our pates always set. Going to a new bag of what we thought was the same stuff, we couldn't get any batches to set. Talk about frustration! The supplier told me it was exactly the same stuff, but there was no way that was true. So we spent about two months (and 30-some batches) searching for something else that would work.

Finally, we discovered the 100% Pure Apple Pectin from Pastry1 (Paris Gourmet). It worked like a charm and we've been using it ever since. It's proved to be very reliable and very consistent. We get ours from Provvista in Portland, Oregon, but other suppliers are bound to have it.

I've heard good things about the Louis Francoise line of pectins. But they have at least eight separate kinds and we just don't have the time to experiment. They are less widely available, but try Great Ciao in Minneapolis.

Likek Truffle Guy, we also use citric acid now, rather than tartaric acid. For one thing, it's a lot cheaper.



Good luck!

Cheers,
Steve Smith
Glacier Country

#58 stscam

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Posted 28 February 2006 - 11:13 AM

pate de fruit blackberry

500g puree, i like Boiron blackberry and 50 g sugar
- boil then add 20 g pectin
- Boil 3 min
- add sugar 480 g
- Boil 2min
- Add glucose 100 g
Boil 106 F
add 10ml citric acid, pour into mold.


I was just looking at your recipe and noted a possible anomaly. You say you boil the puree and sugar, then add the pectin. If you're not mixing sugar with your pectin that could be part of your problem - pectin on its own will clump in liquid and that may reduce it's effectiveness. Also, it looks to me like you may not be cooking long enough.

Try this recipe:

Blackberry Puree 500g
Sugar + Pectin 50g + 13g (thoroughly mixed dry)
Sugar 500g
Glucose 100g
Citric Acid 15 grams

Cook the puree until it reaches about 100F.
Add the sugar+pectin mixture and cook until the temp reaches about 190F.
Add the sugar in 2-3 batches, trying not to let the temp drop below 175F.
When the sugar is well incorporated, and the temp is back up to about 190F, add the glucose.
Now bring to a boil and let the temp rise to about 215-217F.
Cook at this temp until the mixture is very thick, but still pourable.
Turn off the heat and quickly add the citric acid.
Pour into molds.

At every stage you must stir, stir, stir.

Let me know how this works out.

Cheers,
Steve Smith
Glacier Country

#59 Bernaise

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Posted 28 February 2006 - 11:40 AM

I couldn't be happier that this topic has started. This year as part of the holiday goodies tray we decided to make pate de fruit. I had returned from Alsace last year and had some gorgeous pate de fruit...so when I saw a recipe in Bon Appetit I thought perfect.
Sadly, not so perfect. The ingredient list was clear but the method was not. We used frozen fruit (thimbleberry, blackberry and strawbs) from home gardens and ended up tripling the liquid pectin called for.

About a week after we made the pate we noticed that some had started to weep and what remained were almost rubbery in texture. My thought was that because of all the extra pectin we had this result.

In retrospect, should we have followed the recipe and waited for the pate to mature or ripen for a week in the freezer?

Any other thoughts, feedback or tips would be welcome.
Life! what's life!? Just natures way of keeping meat fresh - Dr. who

#60 stscam

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Posted 01 March 2006 - 10:38 AM

Weeping is a common problem with pates. It usually happens when the fruit isn't cooked enough or if the recipe is unbalanced. It's possible that tripling the liquid pectin threw the formula out of whack.

Weeping also occurs if you refrigerate the pates. The chill breaks down the sugar structure and the pieces will literally turn to liquid over a period of a few days. So, do not refrigerate or freeze them. Just let them sit, covered, at room temp.

Pate de Fruit does not mature or ripen, it will just start to get dried out. The mixture should set within 10-30 minutes of being poured. It will get firmer within the first 24 hours. So wait until the day after you make it to cut them. Over the next 4-8 weeks the pieces will degrade somewhat by drying up. Eventually, they'll get moldy. We suggest to buyers of our pates that they consume them within a week or so.

Hope this helps.

Cheers,
Steve Smith
Glacier Country





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