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Sous vide short ribs, times, and temperatures

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#31 kryptos1

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Posted 15 March 2012 - 05:08 AM

I took what Chris said "I just think it's a bit more than an hour" to 4 hours of cold smoking (again referring to another thread Chris started) keeping it between 71-73F and 30 seconds on each side in a 550 degree grill. Will post photos when I get it done including my "redneck engineered" cold smoker.

They were vacuum sealed and sitting in the fridge waiting for my SideKIC to arrive hopefully today. It says not to use more then 10 quarts but a few folks have posted they did more. I have a 28 quart cooler but will head to Wally World to see if there is a smaller one.

Edited by kryptos1, 15 March 2012 - 05:09 AM.


#32 Chris Hennes

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Posted 15 March 2012 - 05:49 AM

Make a styrofoam lid and pre-heat the water and the SideKIC should work fine with your cooler. Note that I have not experimented with cold smoking prior to sous vide, only hot-smoking (though obviously with ribs the "hot" isn't all that hot, to avoid overcooking). Cold smoking is a completely different flavor profile from hot, and is often done for much longer periods of time.

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#33 kryptos1

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Posted 15 March 2012 - 07:07 AM

I figured letting the SV doing the cooking and smoke for flavoring would work but do wonder how much smoke will be lost. Learning! Wish UPS would show up soon with the new SV toy :)

#34 lstrelau

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Posted 15 March 2012 - 10:31 AM

I cooked some 'meaty' baby back ribs yesterday. 9 hours at 60 C, just salt pepper and a pinch of garlic powder. Then a light slather of BBQ sauce and a few minutes on a hot BBQ. Nice and tender, juicy and just slightly pink rather than grey. These were not very fatty however.

Smoking would have been nice but don't have a smoker.
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#35 kryptos1

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Posted 17 March 2012 - 11:33 AM

I cooked some 'meaty' baby back ribs yesterday. 9 hours at 60 C, just salt pepper and a pinch of garlic powder. Then a light slather of BBQ sauce and a few minutes on a hot BBQ. Nice and tender, juicy and just slightly pink rather than grey. These were not very fatty however.

Smoking would have been nice but don't have a smoker.



At 9 hours did it cook all the way through and tender? I was intending to SV for 30-48 after reading through this but hey if I can get these ribs for dinner then whoo hoo!

#36 lstrelau

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Posted 17 March 2012 - 12:59 PM

Probably too late now for your ribs for dinner but yes, they were cooked through, medium rare. They were not very fatty but what little there was rendered off on the BBQ. They were not 'falling off the bone' tender but certainly not tough. If I did again I might give them another couple or three hours.

My iPhone Sous Vide app said 8-12 hours at 55C for medium rare and 8-12 hours at 60 for medium and 12-24 H at 68.3 for 'well done/traditional.

I also wanted them for dinner and started them at 55 and then after a couple of hours bumped it up to 60 for the duration. They came straight out of the fridge.

As I said, next time I would give them another hour or three. Can't imagine what would be left at 24 hours at 68 though.

I did find other time/temp recommendations in pretty much every source that I checked though. Doesn't seem to be a consensus.
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#37 Blues_Cookin

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Posted 17 March 2012 - 02:36 PM

I made a rub with brown sugar, cumin, cayenne and a few other spices. Sous vide 48 hours at 145F. Brushed them with Hot Bone Sucking Sauce and grilled long enough to char the sugar.

Best ribs I have ever had in my life.

Used the liquid in the bag to make gravy for mashed potatoes.


Very similar to my approach, I like it very much. In a smoker, 225 is about right for ribs, but in Sous Vide, I think even 180 is too high. I go 5-6 hours at 140 in the smoker with a dry rub, then sous vide at 140 for about 36 hours. Then sauce and caramelize on a hot grill or broiler. I shoot for the BBQ competition mouth feel which is NOT fall-off-the-bone - that is considered over done in comps. They are looking for a rib where the meat comes cleanly off the bone, and the bone dries quickly after the bite, but where the rest of the meat remains intact and adhering to the bone.
Orem, Utah

#38 kryptos1

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Posted 20 March 2012 - 06:53 AM

Well they finally finished yesterday.

What I did and learned:
Smoking: Did a 4 hour cold smoke before the SV. The result didn't have as much smoke as I wanted and the water really was strong smelling. Just a slight smoke ring
SV: Did 46 hours @ 140F/60C
Result: Falling off the bone with good flavor from the rub but as mentioned lacked the smoke
Result after searing: Interesting crispy outside with hotter inside....not 100% sure if I like this better

I also did a tri-tip for 30 hours. Flavor was more smoky with a decent smoke ring but was a little spongy on texture. It was tender, but spongy...maybe I am too used to eating overcooked smoked meats. I cut off some 50MMx50MM/~2"x2", put on a corn syrup/water mixture (from what I learned Douglas Baldwin's chicken video), and seared each side. Where the side had the smoke/rub it was crispier and the inside firmed up just a little. I definately liked this better.

Thanks all for the information. I think I will follow the suggestion to smoke afterwards next time and see how that goes.

I need a better camera.
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#39 rotuts

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Posted 20 March 2012 - 07:04 AM

thanks for the picture. Always helpful.

#40 torolover

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Posted 16 February 2013 - 02:19 PM

Anyone have a good time and temperature for Sous Vide short ribs that are meltingly tender, (no knife needed) but still moist?

134 or 140F at 72 hours is good, but more like a steak, (not falling apart).

Modernist Cuisine suggests 149F at 24 hours, but it was still very tough.

I tried 191F at 7 hours, but still not meltingly tender, and dry.

Anyone have some good experiences?

Edited by torolover, 16 February 2013 - 02:20 PM.


#41 FeChef

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Posted 16 February 2013 - 03:04 PM

I would like to know aswell. I have tried short ribs at 132F for 48 hours and came out like saw dust. One thing i noticed is that the short ribs ive seen cooked sv on the internet seem thick, but all i can find in my local grocery are 1" thick and to me thats a bit thin and may be why they keep comming out like saw dust.

#42 scubadoo97

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Posted 16 February 2013 - 05:06 PM

I did boneless short ribs 56C/65 hr. They were pink and tender

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Edited by scubadoo97, 16 February 2013 - 05:07 PM.


#43 FeChef

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Posted 16 February 2013 - 05:29 PM

scuba, those look good. How thick were they?

#44 torolover

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Posted 16 February 2013 - 07:46 PM

Thanks Scuba, but in my original post I've tried 134F at 48 and 72 hours. It is great, but more like a steak, and not falling apart tender.

I'm looking more for a traditional braised short ribs, but still moist, and not dry. Anyone have suggestions for time and temp for a traditional braised short rib, but keeping it moist?

#45 nickrey

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Posted 16 February 2013 - 09:43 PM

Try 60C (140F) for 48 hours. This is the temperature and time that David Chang presents in the Momofuku cookbook. Anything over 150F will result in greater loss of moisture.

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#46 pbear

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Posted 16 February 2013 - 10:48 PM

Hmm, I've done short ribs 24 hours at 150ºF and was very happy with the results. Nicely tender, though not falling apart. For that, I'd try 36 hours. Nickrey's suggestion probably gets to the same place as regards reduction of collagen to gelatin, though the texture would be a bit softer (less water extracted, which is either good or bad depending on personal preference). Given your stated objectives, torolover, I suspect you'll like my approach better, but you should try both.

But, frankly, I wonder whether the problem is the meat you're sourcing. Have you prepared conventional braised short ribs with that meat? Were you happy with the results? If you haven't done that test, I'd recommend it first. If nothing else, it'll give you a baseline for comparison. And maybe it's simply that this isn't a cut you like done sous vide. Nothing wrong with that.

#47 torolover

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Posted 17 February 2013 - 06:30 AM

I don't think it's the ribs, since I got them at Whole Foods and they have lots of marbling in them. My goal is to get short ribs that are almost falling apart so I don't need a knife, but still moist and not stringy or tough. I have tried the low temps so far, but have not succeeded.

I have tried:

134F for 48 hours and 72 hours- great, but not what I'm looking for. Still need a knife and it's not falling apart.
140F for 48 hours and 72 hours- great, a little more flaky, but still need a knife
150F for 24 hours- not great, tough to chew and still need a knife
150F for 48 hours- not great, still tough to chew and need a knife
191F for 7 hours- OK, yes, falling apart, don't need a knife, BUT tough to chew on, and dry

I will try 160F at 24 hours next, and then at 36 hours.

Anyone else have good temp or times for moist, traditional falling apart short ribs?

Edited by torolover, 17 February 2013 - 06:53 AM.


#48 sigma

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Posted 17 February 2013 - 08:18 AM

180 for 8 hours is going to give you a pretty traditional braise texture for any meat you use, yet it will be significantly juicier than meat braised traditionally in a 350 oven.

#49 FeChef

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Posted 17 February 2013 - 09:19 AM

I don't think it's the ribs, since I got them at Whole Foods and they have lots of marbling in them. My goal is to get short ribs that are almost falling apart so I don't need a knife, but still moist and not stringy or tough. I have tried the low temps so far, but have not succeeded.

I have tried:

134F for 48 hours and 72 hours- great, but not what I'm looking for. Still need a knife and it's not falling apart.
140F for 48 hours and 72 hours- great, a little more flaky, but still need a knife
150F for 24 hours- not great, tough to chew and still need a knife
150F for 48 hours- not great, still tough to chew and need a knife
191F for 7 hours- OK, yes, falling apart, don't need a knife, BUT tough to chew on, and dry

I will try 160F at 24 hours next, and then at 36 hours.

Anyone else have good temp or times for moist, traditional falling apart short ribs?


Wow you are dedicated. I pretty much gave up after two attempts @ 48 hours each time and $40 dollars waisted. I just dont have the time or money to waste on this dish. My chuck roasts turn out amazing and cost a fraction of what short ribs cost.

#50 nickrey

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Posted 17 February 2013 - 09:59 PM

Cooking it low and slow produces moist, tender meat but with a steak like consistency, which most of us see as a good thing. Cooking it above 150F will lead to the meat falling apart but the temperature means you lose liquid and it becomes dry. There may not be a happy medium where you get both things that you want.

 

I wouldn't discount experimenting with different meat sources as well. Marbling is one component of meat but there are many more that affect how it will react to cooking.


Edited by nickrey, 17 February 2013 - 10:00 PM.

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#51 Twyst

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Posted 18 February 2013 - 07:05 AM

It sounds as though you may just want to  stick to braising when it comes to short ribs.  The allure of sous vide shortribs is the steak like consistency.  If you want melt in your mouth, shred with your fork texture a simple braise is the best way to accomplish that. 



#52 torolover

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Posted 23 February 2013 - 06:02 AM

I don't think it's the ribs, since I got them at Whole Foods and they have lots of marbling in them. My goal is to get short ribs that are almost falling apart so I don't need a knife, but still moist and not stringy or tough. I have tried the low temps so far, but have not succeeded.

I have tried:

134F for 48 hours and 72 hours- great, but not what I'm looking for. Still need a knife and it's not falling apart.
140F for 48 hours and 72 hours- great, a little more flaky, but still need a knife
150F for 24 hours- not great, tough to chew and still need a knife
150F for 48 hours- not great, still tough to chew and need a knife
191F for 7 hours- OK, yes, falling apart, don't need a knife, BUT tough to chew on, and dry

I will try 160F at 24 hours next, and then at 36 hours.

Anyone else have good temp or times for moist, traditional falling apart short ribs?


Wow you are dedicated. I pretty much gave up after two attempts @ 48 hours each time and $40 dollars waisted. I just dont have the time or money to waste on this dish. My chuck roasts turn out amazing and cost a fraction of what short ribs cost.

 

I don't think it's the ribs, since I got them at Whole Foods and they have lots of marbling in them. My goal is to get short ribs that are almost falling apart so I don't need a knife, but still moist and not stringy or tough. I have tried the low temps so far, but have not succeeded.

I have tried:

134F for 48 hours and 72 hours- great, but not what I'm looking for. Still need a knife and it's not falling apart.
140F for 48 hours and 72 hours- great, a little more flaky, but still need a knife
150F for 24 hours- not great, tough to chew and still need a knife
150F for 48 hours- not great, still tough to chew and need a knife
191F for 7 hours- OK, yes, falling apart, don't need a knife, BUT tough to chew on, and dry

I will try 160F at 24 hours next, and then at 36 hours.

Anyone else have good temp or times for moist, traditional falling apart short ribs?I'm pretty close to finding the perfect time and temp for traditional falling apart short ribs, but keeping it stil moist!

I want to keep you guys updated on my experiments.  I'm pretty close to finding and temp/time for traditional falling apart short ribs that are still moist and not stringy!!

 

160F at 24 hours- still not falling apart or fork tender

160F at 38 hours- falling apart, fork tender, still moist

160F at 42 hours- even more falling apart, need no knife, still moist

 

I'm going to try 180F at 6 hours and 8 hours next!!

 

Thanks for the tips guys!!



#53 torolover

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Posted 24 February 2013 - 09:06 AM

 

I don't think it's the ribs, since I got them at Whole Foods and they have lots of marbling in them. My goal is to get short ribs that are almost falling apart so I don't need a knife, but still moist and not stringy or tough. I have tried the low temps so far, but have not succeeded.

I have tried:

134F for 48 hours and 72 hours- great, but not what I'm looking for. Still need a knife and it's not falling apart.
140F for 48 hours and 72 hours- great, a little more flaky, but still need a knife
150F for 24 hours- not great, tough to chew and still need a knife
150F for 48 hours- not great, still tough to chew and need a knife
191F for 7 hours- OK, yes, falling apart, don't need a knife, BUT tough to chew on, and dry

I will try 160F at 24 hours next, and then at 36 hours.

Anyone else have good temp or times for moist, traditional falling apart short ribs?


Wow you are dedicated. I pretty much gave up after two attempts @ 48 hours each time and $40 dollars waisted. I just dont have the time or money to waste on this dish. My chuck roasts turn out amazing and cost a fraction of what short ribs cost.

 

>I don't think it's the ribs, since I got them at Whole Foods and they have lots of marbling in them. My goal is to get short ribs that are almost falling apart so I don't need a knife, but still moist and not stringy or tough. I have tried the low temps so far, but have not succeeded.

I have tried:

134F for 48 hours and 72 hours- great, but not what I'm looking for. Still need a knife and it's not falling apart.
140F for 48 hours and 72 hours- great, a little more flaky, but still need a knife
150F for 24 hours- not great, tough to chew and still need a knife
150F for 48 hours- not great, still tough to chew and need a knife
191F for 7 hours- OK, yes, falling apart, don't need a knife, BUT tough to chew on, and dry

I will try 160F at 24 hours next, and then at 36 hours.

Anyone else have good temp or times for moist, traditional falling apart short ribs?I'm pretty close to finding the perfect time and temp for traditional falling apart short ribs, but keeping it stil moist!

I want to keep you guys updated on my experiments.  I'm pretty close to finding and temp/time for traditional falling apart short ribs that are still moist and not stringy!!

 

160F at 24 hours- still not falling apart or fork tender

160F at 38 hours- falling apart, fork tender, still moist

160F at 42 hours- even more falling apart, need no knife, still moist

 

I'm going to try 180F at 6 hours and 8 hours next!!

 

Thanks for the tips guys!!

 

Another update.  So far I found 180F at 9 hours and a half the best yet!!!  Falling apart, no knife needed, still moist and not stringy!!

 

Thanks for the tip Sigma!!!!



#54 Lawless Cooks

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Posted 24 February 2013 - 05:55 PM

My first attempt at any longer cooking time Sous Vide and my first with short ribs.

 

Followed MCAH recipe and cooked at the higher end of their suggested range - 144F for 72 hours. 

 

A day in I started having second thoughts about a temp so high. When they came out, they were great. I would have preferred slightly more towards mid-rare, but I'm on board, some of the best short ribs I've ever had. Next time I might try 136 or 138F.

 

They weren't fall apart/no knife, but fairly close. I didn't really care though. They were so moist and had so much more beef flavor than I was used to with restaurant short ribs.

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Edited by Lawless Cooks, 24 February 2013 - 05:55 PM.


#55 Zmaster

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Posted 09 March 2013 - 03:07 AM

My first attempt at any longer cooking time Sous Vide and my first with short ribs.

 

Followed MCAH recipe and cooked at the higher end of their suggested range - 144F for 72 hours. 

 

A day in I started having second thoughts about a temp so high. When they came out, they were great. I would have preferred slightly more towards mid-rare, but I'm on board, some of the best short ribs I've ever had. Next time I might try 136 or 138F.

 

They weren't fall apart/no knife, but fairly close. I didn't really care though. They were so moist and had so much more beef flavor than I was used to with restaurant short ribs.

Lawless,

 

Those ribs look fantastic.  

 

I have done short ribs several time and I have had great success with Heston Blumenthal's recipe which calls for pre-salting, multiple baths with a final bath temp of 56 C / 133 for 72 h.  When they were done, you did not need a knife to cut, and were not at all tough with a great beefy flavor.



#56 Lawless Cooks

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Posted 09 March 2013 - 07:24 AM

Thanks - they tasted as good as they looked!

 

For my second attempt, I used 72 hours @ 138. The meat was sourced from a local butcher this time as opposed to Whole Foods last time. Not sure if it was the temperature or meat that made the difference but I think I liked the first time better. Need a few more experiments (followed by 5K runs) to figure it all out.

 

I want to get HB at Home and start playing around with his recipes and techniques. Have been watching him on YouTube and using his potato puree trick lately:steep the peels in the mile you are going to use ...

 

Sounds interesting, multiple temperatures and would like to understand the effects better.

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#57 AzHP

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Posted 16 September 2013 - 08:17 PM

So my 3 day short ribs at 140F/60C came out, and while I can attest that the Anova cooked them perfectly, and they were pink and tender inside. Unfortunately, when I took them out of the vacuum packaging I could tell they smelled fishy. I gave them a generous helping of salt and pepper and seared them with a blowtorch, but the fishy taste persisted. It's unfortunate as I was looking forward to preparing a delicious meal for the last 3 days, but it was extremely disappointing. Any ideas on what went wrong?



#58 dcarch

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Posted 16 September 2013 - 09:16 PM

I am not sure what do you mean by "fishy" or "gamy".

 

Next time:

 

1. Make sure that the beef you buy is really fresh and in good condition.

 

2. Before you bag the beef, follow very strict cleanliness routines.

 

3. Sanitize the bag by boiling, and all the seasonings.

 

4. Sear/blow torch the beef to sanitize the meat before bagging.

 

For long cooks, it is very important to keep things very clean.

 

dcarch



#59 AzHP

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Posted 16 September 2013 - 09:22 PM

Thanks for the reply. The freshness of the beef may have been a concern. I bought the short rib towards the end of the day and while one of them was bright and moist looking, the other was a little darker red and dried out. I guess for long cook times the freshness of the meat really does come into play. 

 

Additional notes, I used a foodsaver vacuum which I think took out all the air as the package sank straight to the bottom. I know that gamey flavors can be caused by oxidization of unsaturated fats, so I was wondering if it could be that the vacuum wasn't tight enough.



#60 cookalong

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Posted 17 September 2013 - 01:02 AM

It's quite common that beef, in particular, can taste/smell somewhat off after really prolonged cooking, due to surface bacterias. It happened to me once or twice. After that, I always briefly put the bag in really hot water before putting it in the waterbath (usually I put it in 80C for a couple of minutes). Haven't had any problems since I started doing that.







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