977 replies to this topic

[sygyzy]

I ordered the new model from Auberins. They shipped it today. I will be gone this weekend and half of next but I will post a review when I get a chance. I will try the egg first.

[Qwerty]

Wow, I try to keep up with this thread a bit, but I had no idea that setting up a water bath was so easy to do and relatively affordable at home. I'm just a poor line cook so the investment is still pretty significant, but it is definitely do-able.

I have some pro experience with sous vide but the place I worked at didn't do a very good job with it IMO. I'm anxious to experiment at home.

Is there any info out there (like a spreadsheet, table, etc) that shows recommended times and temps for this stuff?

[edsel]

...
Is there any info out there (like a spreadsheet, table, etc) that shows recommended times and temps for this stuff? 

nathanm posted some handy charts (discussion starts here). Unfortunately the formatting has gotten messed up due to changes in the board software. You can copy the HTML into a text file and view it in your browser. Some of the info has been transcribed by other folks (see here).

Presumably all this info will be in Nathan's book.

[DouglasBaldwin]

You may also find my short guide to sous vide useful. It is still a work in progress, but it can be found here. I keep working on it whenever I have a chance. For instance, last week I included photographs illustrating eggs cooked for 75 minutes at 136F, 138F, ..., 152F. Today, I posted an updated and expanded section on food safety. It is my hope that my little guide can act as a stopgap until Nathan's book is released.

[alflauren]

I was wondering if anyone knows if the new Thomas Keller book on Amazon "Under Pressure" is his long awaited volume on Sous Vide. The title sounds weird for Sous Vide and the price is somewhat high.

http://www.amazon.co...d=2L04EQJX0EJWI

The title is the same as a New York Times article about Keller and sous-vide, so my guess would be that this is his sous-vide book. It's not available yet, so maybe when it's offered for sale amazon.com will have excerpts.

[Qwerty]

Thanks for the links.

Has anyone experimented with doing sabayon type sauces sous vide? I've heard of people using the water baths to get the eggs right to the proper temp needed without double boilers, whipping, etc. Anyone tried it?

[Mr. Delicious]

I am interested in buying an immersion circulator, basically I am wanting to cook meats (turkey breasts, roast beef) for sandwichs. This would be commercially and I am wondering on food safety issues of cooking a 5+ lb roast. I know its been covered in 60 pages but I cant search that long. Also is it best to buy a circulator and put it in a hotel pan?? My budget allows 1200 or so for this toy, but I want to make sure its what I want and it will create juicy tender meat for the best sandwiches around??

[Ruth]

I have had a lot of success with beef cooked sous-vide but I think that a 5lb roast is a bit too large to do in one package. Why not divide it into two bags? If you use a stock pot with your circulator two or even three packages will cook perfectly. I find 52°C for about four hours for a three inch thick piece of beef produces perfect rare meat for sandwiches or salad. It can also be seared and served as a steak

[Mr. Delicious]

That wouldnt be an issue to cut into smaller roasts, I think that would be even better having each days roast beef cryovacted seperate, cook a couple roasts at a time open as needed.... Is it easiest to use a circulator in a stock pot??

[Qwerty]

Lexans or hotels are the preferred choices I believe....

[DouglasBaldwin]

I am interested in buying an immersion circulator, basically I am wanting to cook meats (turkey breasts, roast beef) for sandwichs.  This would be commercially and I am wondering on food safety issues of cooking a 5+ lb roast.  I know its been covered in 60 pages but I cant search that long.  Also is it best to buy a circulator and put it in a hotel pan??  My budget allows 1200 or so for this toy, but I want to make sure its what I want and it will create juicy tender meat for the best sandwiches around??

If you are cooking the meat to sell, then the meat should be pasteurized, quickly cooled and stored below 38F (3C) or below 41F (5C) for less than 10 days (to prevent the growth of C. botulinum, C. perfringens, and B. cereus). There are two standards for pasteurization (i) Salmonella spp. and (ii) Listeria monocytogenes -- which one you need to use depends on which country you live in.

As stated many times up thread, the cooking time depends on thickness and not weight.

For poultry cooked in a 141F (60.5C) water bath to a center temperature of 140F (60C), I calculate the following times:

Salmonella (7D reduction):
5mm......00:26:12
10mm....00:30:22
15mm....00:37:25
20mm....00:47:11
25mm....00:59:32
30mm....01:13:57
35mm....01:30:29
40mm....01:55:26
45mm....02:25:48
50mm....02:59:40
55mm....03:37:12
60mm....04:18:35
65mm....05:02:50
70mm....05:51:02

L. monocytogenes (6D reduction):
5mm......00:28:26
10mm....00:32:32
15mm....00:39:28
20mm....00:49:05
25mm....01:01:17
30mm....01:15:34
35mm....01:31:58
40mm....01:55:26
45mm....02:25:48
50mm....02:59:40
55mm....03:37:12
60mm....04:18:35
65mm....05:02:50
70mm....05:51:02

Cooling Time in Ice Water to 41F (5C):
5mm......00:01:14
10mm....00:04:20
15mm....00:09:23
20mm....00:16:23
25mm....00:25:20
30mm....00:36:12
35mm....00:49:03
40mm....01:03:50
45mm....01:20:35
50mm....01:39:15
55mm....01:59:54
60mm....02:22:28
65mm....02:47:01
70mm....03:13:28


Being cooked at a lower temperature, the pasteurization times are much longer
for beef cooked in a 131F (55C) water bath to a center temperature of 130F (54.5C):

Salmonella (6.5D reduction):
5mm......01:31:10
10mm....01:34:57
15mm....01:42:09
20mm....01:52:24
25mm....02:04:47
30mm....02:20:06
35mm....02:38:34
40mm....02:59:06
45mm....03:22:13
50mm....03:47:59
55mm....04:15:46
60mm....04:45:29
65mm....05:17:15
70mm....05:50:44

L. monocytogenes (6D reduction):
5mm......02:24:50
10mm....04:49:54
15mm....05:54:17
20mm....06:05:21
25mm....06:16:42
30mm....06:31:47
35mm....06:50:30
40mm....07:10:23
45mm....07:33:32
50mm....08:00:15
55mm....08:29:10
60mm....09:00:26
65mm....09:34:27
70mm....10:10:41

Cooling Time in Ice Water to 41F (5C):
5mm......00:01:12
10mm....00:04:12
15mm....00:09:05
20mm....00:15:51
25mm....00:24:29
30mm....00:34:59
35mm....00:47:23
40mm....01:01:40
45mm....01:17:49
50mm....01:35:52
55mm....01:55:47
60mm....02:17:34
65mm....02:41:16
70mm....03:06:48

I use my immersion circulator in a counter-top food warmer/steam table so that the water bath is insulated (as per Pounce's suggestion up thread). Moreover, it is important to use a lid to limit evaporation; either make a Lexan lid or you can use steam table pan lids (say a 2/3 in the front and cut up a 1/3 for the back).

[You can find a discussion on how I computed the above times on my sous vide page.]

[commonsewer]

I have REALLY enjoyed reading the first 30 pages of posts...you guys are amazing! I have been cooking sous-vide for a year now...all wildly experimental. While I generally don't consider myself to be a complete idiot; I have been totally unable to make "hide nor hair" out of Nathan's tables...they simply aren't readable in my browser. I've tried both IE and Safari browsers. What am I doing wrong?

Is if possible for someone to PM me a copy? I'd sure appreciate it!

[Baggy]

Not exactly the same as sabayon, but I have made Swiss meringue using a bowl in the waterbath set to 70C. Unsurprisingly it works OK. The downside is the additional height of the waterbath makes beating the egg white less convenient.

Also a bowl in a bain marie is a good fit. A bowl in an open waterbath isn’t, so it takes more firmness to hold the bowl and there’s a good chance of the water being ejected over the edge once the whites start to stiffen.

So on practical grounds I’m sticking to a saucepan of hot water.

[eG Forums Host]

The following table was originally posted by nathanm on 08/05/2005, here.



Here is the table for 54.4C / 130F final core temperature, starting at 5C/41F initial temperature

---

Bath C	Bath F	mm	inch	Cook time	Rest time	Core C	Core F	Early -1C	Late +1C
55	131.0	5	0.20	00 : 01 : 41	00 : 00 : 02	54.4	129.9	00 : 00 : 23	∞
56	132.8	5	0.20	00 : 01 : 19	00 : 00 : 03	54.3	129.7	00 : 00 : 11	00 : 00 : 20
60	140.0	5	0.20	00 : 00 : 53	00 : 00 : 03	53.8	128.9	00 : 00 : 03	00 : 00 : 04
65	149.0	5	0.20	00 : 00 : 41	00 : 00 : 03	53.1	127.7	00 : 00 : 02	00 : 00 : 01
55	131.0	10	0.39	00 : 06 : 39	00 : 00 : 09	54.4	129.9	00 : 01 : 25	∞
56	132.8	10	0.39	00 : 05 : 16	00 : 00 : 10	54.3	129.7	00 : 00 : 41	00 : 01 : 24
60	140.0	10	0.39	00 : 03 : 32	00 : 00 : 13	53.9	129.0	00 : 00 : 15	00 : 00 : 16
65	149.0	10	0.39	00 : 02 : 43	00 : 00 : 14	53.1	127.7	00 : 00 : 08	00 : 00 : 08
55	131.0	15	0.59	00 : 14 : 58	00 : 00 : 21	54.4	129.9	00 : 03 : 11	∞
56	132.8	15	0.59	00 : 11 : 50	00 : 00 : 23	54.3	129.7	00 : 01 : 33	00 : 03 : 10
60	140.0	15	0.59	00 : 07 : 58	00 : 00 : 28	53.9	129.0	00 : 00 : 33	00 : 00 : 38
65	149.0	15	0.59	00 : 06 : 06	00 : 00 : 31	53.1	127.7	00 : 00 : 18	00 : 00 : 19
55	131.0	20	0.79	00 : 26 : 57	00 : 00 : 38	54.4	129.9	00 : 06 : 00	∞
56	132.8	20	0.79	00 : 21 : 02	00 : 00 : 38	54.3	129.7	00 : 02 : 45	00 : 06 : 00
60	140.0	20	0.79	00 : 14 : 10	00 : 00 : 50	53.9	129.0	00 : 00 : 58	00 : 01 : 09
65	149.0	20	0.79	00 : 10 : 51	00 : 00 : 57	53.1	127.7	00 : 00 : 32	00 : 00 : 34
55	131.0	25	0.98	00 : 41 : 29	00 : 00 : 56	54.4	129.9	00 : 08 : 48	∞
56	132.8	25	0.98	00 : 32 : 52	00 : 01 : 02	54.3	129.7	00 : 04 : 17	00 : 08 : 46
60	140.0	25	0.98	00 : 22 : 08	00 : 01 : 18	53.9	129.0	00 : 01 : 31	00 : 01 : 48
65	149.0	25	0.98	00 : 16 : 57	00 : 01 : 27	53.1	127.7	00 : 00 : 50	00 : 00 : 54
55	131.0	30	1.18	01 : 00 : 51	01 : 00 : 50	54.4	130.0	00 : 12 : 48	∞
56	132.8	30	1.18	00 : 48 : 17	00 : 48 : 16	54.4	130.0	00 : 07 : 13	00 : 12 : 38
60	140.0	30	1.18	00 : 31 : 40	00 : 01 : 50	53.8	128.9	00 : 02 : 00	00 : 02 : 45
65	149.0	30	1.18	00 : 24 : 25	00 : 02 : 09	53.1	127.7	00 : 01 : 11	00 : 01 : 17
55	131.0	35	1.38	01 : 19 : 33	00 : 01 : 54	54.4	129.9	00 : 15 : 15	∞
56	132.8	35	1.38	01 : 04 : 20	00 : 02 : 03	54.4	129.9	00 : 07 : 34	00 : 15 : 30
60	140.0	35	1.38	00 : 42 : 57	00 : 02 : 32	53.8	128.8	00 : 02 : 54	00 : 05 : 15
65	149.0	35	1.38	00 : 33 : 11	00 : 02 : 51	53.1	127.7	00 : 01 : 36	00 : 01 : 45
55	131.0	40	1.57	01 : 41 : 38	00 : 02 : 26	54.4	129.9	00 : 20 : 31	∞
56	132.8	40	1.57	01 : 21 : 30	00 : 02 : 46	54.3	129.7	00 : 10 : 06	00 : 20 : 17
60	140.0	40	1.57	00 : 57 : 59	00 : 57 : 58	54.4	130.0	00 : 03 : 36	00 : 04 : 16
65	149.0	40	1.57	00 : 45 : 46	00 : 45 : 45	54.4	130.0	00 : 04 : 41	00 : 02 : 11
55	131.0	45	1.77	02 : 05 : 05	00 : 03 : 14	54.4	129.9	00 : 24 : 54	∞
56	132.8	45	1.77	01 : 40 : 39	00 : 03 : 34	54.3	129.7	00 : 12 : 14	00 : 26 : 28
60	140.0	45	1.77	01 : 09 : 12	00 : 04 : 13	53.8	128.8	00 : 04 : 28	00 : 05 : 18
65	149.0	45	1.77	00 : 57 : 18	00 : 57 : 17	54.4	130.0	00 : 02 : 28	00 : 02 : 40
55	131.0	50	1.97	02 : 31 : 22	00 : 04 : 03	54.4	129.9	00 : 31 : 20	∞
56	132.8	50	1.97	02 : 00 : 35	00 : 04 : 23	54.3	129.7	00 : 14 : 26	00 : 31 : 18
60	140.0	50	1.97	01 : 23 : 29	00 : 05 : 22	53.8	128.8	00 : 05 : 41	00 : 06 : 15
65	149.0	50	1.97	01 : 05 : 16	00 : 06 : 11	53.0	127.3	00 : 00 : 58	00 : 03 : 14
55	131.0	55	2.17	02 : 56 : 40	00 : 05 : 05	54.4	129.9	00 : 36 : 18	∞
56	132.8	55	2.17	02 : 21 : 01	00 : 05 : 25	54.3	129.7	00 : 18 : 05	00 : 36 : 17
60	140.0	55	2.17	01 : 37 : 39	00 : 06 : 35	53.7	128.6	00 : 06 : 02	00 : 07 : 09
65	149.0	55	2.17	01 : 16 : 48	00 : 07 : 35	52.8	127.1	00 : 03 : 24	00 : 03 : 42
55	131.0	60	2.36	03 : 22 : 16	00 : 06 : 17	54.4	129.9	00 : 41 : 21	∞
56	132.8	60	2.36	02 : 41 : 38	00 : 06 : 47	54.3	129.7	00 : 20 : 33	00 : 41 : 21
60	140.0	60	2.36	01 : 52 : 26	00 : 08 : 07	53.7	128.6	00 : 06 : 50	00 : 08 : 06
65	149.0	60	2.36	01 : 28 : 24	00 : 09 : 27	52.7	126.8	00 : 03 : 49	00 : 04 : 37
55	131.0	65	2.56	03 : 48 : 32	00 : 07 : 39	54.4	129.9	00 : 47 : 04	∞
56	132.8	65	2.56	03 : 02 : 15	00 : 08 : 09	54.3	129.7	00 : 23 : 02	00 : 46 : 26
60	140.0	65	2.56	02 : 06 : 32	00 : 09 : 49	53.6	128.4	00 : 07 : 34	00 : 09 : 42
65	149.0	65	2.56	01 : 40 : 10	00 : 11 : 18	52.6	126.7	00 : 04 : 28	00 : 04 : 53
55	131.0	70	2.76	04 : 14 : 54	00 : 09 : 11	54.4	130.0	00 : 53 : 04	∞
56	132.8	70	2.76	03 : 22 : 44	00 : 09 : 41	54.3	129.7	00 : 25 : 31	00 : 53 : 03
60	140.0	70	2.76	02 : 21 : 04	00 : 11 : 41	53.6	128.5	00 : 09 : 00	00 : 10 : 43
65	149.0	70	2.76	01 : 51 : 14	00 : 13 : 40	52.4	126.4	00 : 04 : 37	00 : 05 : 35
55	131.0	75	2.95	04 : 41 : 42	04 : 41 : 41	54.4	130.0	00 : 59 : 53	∞
56	132.8	75	2.95	03 : 42 : 51	00 : 11 : 33	54.3	129.7	00 : 27 : 57	00 : 59 : 28
60	140.0	75	2.95	02 : 34 : 35	00 : 13 : 53	53.5	128.3	00 : 09 : 03	00 : 11 : 37
65	149.0	75	2.95	02 : 02 : 14	00 : 16 : 18	52.3	126.1	00 : 05 : 00	00 : 06 : 04
55	131.0	80	3.15	05 : 06 : 33	05 : 06 : 32	54.4	130.0	01 : 05 : 06	∞
56	132.8	80	3.15	04 : 02 : 31	00 : 13 : 35	54.3	129.7	00 : 30 : 22	01 : 05 : 02
60	140.0	80	3.15	02 : 48 : 27	00 : 16 : 25	53.5	128.3	00 : 10 : 34	00 : 11 : 41
65	149.0	80	3.15	02 : 12 : 51	00 : 19 : 18	52.2	125.9	00 : 05 : 56	00 : 06 : 31
55	131.0	90	3.54	05 : 53 : 50	05 : 53 : 49	54.4	130.0	01 : 11 : 56	∞
56	132.8	90	3.54	04 : 43 : 10	00 : 18 : 29	54.4	129.9	00 : 38 : 03	01 : 11 : 54
60	140.0	90	3.54	03 : 13 : 59	00 : 22 : 08	53.4	128.2	00 : 12 : 05	00 : 14 : 19
65	149.0	90	3.54	02 : 32 : 05	00 : 26 : 09	51.8	125.3	00 : 06 : 39	00 : 07 : 18
55	131.0	100	3.94	06 : 37 : 46	06 : 37 : 45	54.4	130.0	01 : 19 : 06	∞
56	132.8	100	3.94	05 : 20 : 05	00 : 24 : 13	54.4	129.9	00 : 41 : 31	01 : 19 : 03
60	140.0	100	3.94	03 : 36 : 12	00 : 28 : 50	53.2	127.8	00 : 13 : 19	00 : 17 : 02
65	149.0	100	3.94	02 : 50 : 01	00 : 33 : 10	51.6	124.8	00 : 08 : 03	00 : 08 : 03
55	131.0	150	5.91	09 : 23 : 30	09 : 23 : 29	54.4	130.0	01 : 49 : 35	∞
56	132.8	150	5.91	07 : 35 : 58	07 : 35 : 57	54.4	130.0	01 : 01 : 10	01 : 48 : 09
60	140.0	150	5.91	05 : 02 : 25	00 : 52 : 34	53.0	127.4	00 : 19 : 42	00 : 25 : 11
65	149.0	150	5.91	03 : 53 : 28	00 : 58 : 03	50.5	122.9	00 : 10 : 43	00 : 12 : 58

[eG Forums Host]

The following table was posted by nathanm here.




Here is the fish cooking table - starting at 5C/41F and ending with a core temperature of 45C/113F.

As noted above this temperature is not sufficient to sterilize the food so you must be very hygenic, start with top quality fish, do NOT do cook and hold, and cut the thickness down to the point where the cooking time is reasonable.

---

Bath C	Bath F	mm	inch	Cook time	Rest time	Core C	Core F	Early -1C	Late +1C
46	114.8	5	0.20	00 : 01 : 23	00 : 00 : 03	44.9	112.8	00 : 00 : 15	∞
47	116.6	5	0.20	00 : 01 : 08	00 : 00 : 03	44.8	112.6	00 : 00 : 09	00 : 00 : 15
50	122.0	5	0.20	00 : 00 : 50	00 : 00 : 03	44.5	112.0	00 : 00 : 04	00 : 00 : 04
46	114.8	10	0.39	00 : 05 : 31	00 : 00 : 10	44.9	112.8	00 : 00 : 58	∞
47	116.6	10	0.39	00 : 04 : 36	00 : 00 : 11	44.8	112.7	00 : 00 : 36	00 : 00 : 57
50	122.0	10	0.39	00 : 03 : 21	00 : 00 : 13	44.5	112.0	00 : 00 : 17	00 : 00 : 19
46	114.8	15	0.59	00 : 12 : 25	00 : 00 : 24	44.9	112.8	00 : 02 : 09	∞
47	116.6	15	0.59	00 : 10 : 20	00 : 00 : 26	44.8	112.7	00 : 01 : 22	00 : 02 : 08
50	122.0	15	0.59	00 : 07 : 32	00 : 00 : 29	44.5	112.0	00 : 00 : 38	00 : 00 : 45
46	114.8	20	0.79	00 : 22 : 04	00 : 00 : 43	44.9	112.8	00 : 03 : 50	∞
47	116.6	20	0.79	00 : 18 : 22	00 : 00 : 43	44.8	112.7	00 : 02 : 26	00 : 03 : 49
50	122.0	20	0.79	00 : 13 : 23	00 : 00 : 51	44.5	112.0	00 : 01 : 07	00 : 01 : 21
46	114.8	25	0.98	00 : 34 : 27	00 : 01 : 04	44.9	112.8	00 : 05 : 58	∞
47	116.6	25	0.98	00 : 28 : 42	00 : 01 : 10	44.8	112.7	00 : 03 : 47	00 : 05 : 57
50	122.0	25	0.98	00 : 20 : 54	00 : 01 : 23	44.5	112.0	00 : 01 : 44	00 : 02 : 00
46	114.8	30	1.18	00 : 50 : 37	00 : 50 : 36	45.0	113.0	00 : 09 : 42	∞
47	116.6	30	1.18	00 : 41 : 13	00 : 01 : 37	44.8	112.7	00 : 05 : 24	00 : 09 : 41
50	122.0	30	1.18	00 : 30 : 05	00 : 02 : 04	44.5	112.0	00 : 02 : 30	00 : 03 : 02
46	114.8	35	1.38	01 : 06 : 30	00 : 02 : 07	44.9	112.8	00 : 09 : 55	∞
47	116.6	35	1.38	00 : 56 : 59	00 : 56 : 58	45.0	113.0	00 : 06 : 51	00 : 09 : 41
50	122.0	35	1.38	00 : 40 : 50	00 : 02 : 45	44.5	112.0	00 : 03 : 22	00 : 05 : 34
46	114.8	40	1.57	01 : 25 : 15	00 : 02 : 48	44.9	112.8	00 : 14 : 05	∞
47	116.6	40	1.57	01 : 11 : 40	00 : 02 : 58	44.8	112.7	00 : 07 : 22	00 : 14 : 03
50	122.0	40	1.57	00 : 55 : 09	00 : 55 : 08	45.0	113.0	00 : 03 : 59	00 : 04 : 50
46	114.8	45	1.77	01 : 45 : 11	00 : 03 : 36	44.9	112.8	00 : 17 : 03	∞
47	116.6	45	1.77	01 : 28 : 44	00 : 03 : 56	44.8	112.7	00 : 11 : 01	00 : 17 : 02
50	122.0	45	1.77	01 : 05 : 35	00 : 04 : 35	44.4	111.9	00 : 01 : 42	00 : 05 : 53
46	114.8	50	1.97	02 : 05 : 58	00 : 04 : 34	44.9	112.8	00 : 20 : 08	∞
47	116.6	50	1.97	01 : 46 : 32	00 : 05 : 04	44.8	112.7	00 : 12 : 59	00 : 20 : 06
50	122.0	50	1.97	01 : 19 : 14	00 : 05 : 54	44.4	111.9	00 : 05 : 44	00 : 06 : 57
46	114.8	55	2.17	02 : 27 : 13	00 : 05 : 46	44.9	112.8	00 : 23 : 17	∞
47	116.6	55	2.17	02 : 04 : 45	00 : 06 : 16	44.8	112.7	00 : 14 : 59	00 : 24 : 16
50	122.0	55	2.17	01 : 32 : 47	00 : 07 : 16	44.3	111.7	00 : 06 : 34	00 : 08 : 29
46	114.8	60	2.36	02 : 48 : 44	00 : 07 : 09	44.9	112.8	00 : 26 : 30	∞
47	116.6	60	2.36	02 : 23 : 10	00 : 07 : 39	44.8	112.7	00 : 18 : 21	00 : 28 : 27
50	122.0	60	2.36	01 : 46 : 55	00 : 08 : 58	44.3	111.7	00 : 07 : 55	00 : 09 : 36
46	114.8	65	2.56	03 : 12 : 27	00 : 08 : 41	44.9	112.9	00 : 31 : 56	∞
47	116.6	65	2.56	02 : 41 : 33	00 : 09 : 21	44.8	112.7	00 : 20 : 32	00 : 31 : 54
50	122.0	65	2.56	02 : 01 : 02	00 : 11 : 00	44.3	111.7	00 : 08 : 50	00 : 10 : 44

[eG Forums Host]

The following table was posted by nathanm here.



Here is the table for a wide variety of foods started at 5C/41F and cooked to an internal temperature of 60C/140F. I cook chicken this way, also fois gras and pork.

---

Bath C	Bath F	mm	inch	Cook time	Rest time	Core C	Core F	Early -1C	Late +1C
61	141.8	5	0.20	00 : 01 : 30	00 : 00 : 03	59.9	139.9	00 : 00 : 15	∞
62	143.6	5	0.20	00 : 01 : 16	00 : 00 : 03	59.9	139.8	00 : 00 : 10	00 : 00 : 14
65	149.0	5	0.20	00 : 00 : 57	00 : 00 : 03	59.5	139.2	00 : 00 : 04	00 : 00 : 04
61	141.8	10	0.39	00 : 06 : 00	00 : 00 : 10	59.9	139.9	00 : 01 : 01	∞
62	143.6	10	0.39	00 : 05 : 01	00 : 00 : 10	59.8	139.7	00 : 00 : 34	00 : 00 : 56
65	149.0	10	0.39	00 : 03 : 46	00 : 00 : 11	59.5	139.2	00 : 00 : 16	00 : 00 : 17
61	141.8	15	0.59	00 : 13 : 23	00 : 00 : 20	59.9	139.8	00 : 02 : 09	∞
62	143.6	15	0.59	00 : 11 : 17	00 : 00 : 23	59.8	139.7	00 : 01 : 16	00 : 02 : 08
65	149.0	15	0.59	00 : 08 : 29	00 : 00 : 26	59.5	139.2	00 : 00 : 36	00 : 00 : 43
61	141.8	20	0.79	00 : 23 : 47	00 : 00 : 37	59.9	139.8	00 : 03 : 49	∞
62	143.6	20	0.79	00 : 20 : 03	00 : 00 : 42	59.8	139.7	00 : 02 : 15	00 : 03 : 48
65	149.0	20	0.79	00 : 15 : 06	00 : 00 : 45	59.5	139.2	00 : 01 : 04	00 : 01 : 12
61	141.8	25	0.98	00 : 37 : 07	00 : 00 : 55	59.9	139.8	00 : 05 : 57	∞
62	143.6	25	0.98	00 : 31 : 19	00 : 01 : 01	59.8	139.7	00 : 03 : 30	00 : 05 : 56
65	149.0	25	0.98	00 : 23 : 35	00 : 01 : 12	59.5	139.2	00 : 01 : 41	00 : 01 : 53
61	141.8	30	1.18	00 : 54 : 29	00 : 54 : 28	60.0	140.0	00 : 08 : 41	∞
62	143.6	30	1.18	00 : 46 : 02	00 : 46 : 01	60.0	140.0	00 : 06 : 03	00 : 08 : 40
65	149.0	30	1.18	00 : 33 : 56	00 : 01 : 47	59.5	139.2	00 : 02 : 34	00 : 02 : 42
61	141.8	35	1.38	01 : 11 : 27	00 : 01 : 52	59.9	139.8	00 : 09 : 40	∞
62	143.6	35	1.38	01 : 02 : 04	01 : 02 : 03	60.0	140.0	00 : 06 : 47	00 : 09 : 38
65	149.0	35	1.38	00 : 47 : 30	00 : 47 : 29	60.0	140.0	00 : 04 : 58	00 : 03 : 47
61	141.8	40	1.57	01 : 31 : 28	00 : 02 : 34	59.9	139.8	00 : 13 : 56	∞
62	143.6	40	1.57	01 : 17 : 53	00 : 02 : 44	59.8	139.7	00 : 08 : 17	00 : 15 : 04
65	149.0	40	1.57	01 : 01 : 22	01 : 01 : 21	60.0	140.0	00 : 03 : 56	00 : 02 : 55
61	141.8	45	1.77	01 : 52 : 44	00 : 03 : 13	59.9	139.8	00 : 16 : 54	∞
62	143.6	45	1.77	01 : 36 : 16	00 : 03 : 23	59.8	139.7	00 : 10 : 31	00 : 16 : 52
65	149.0	45	1.77	01 : 13 : 29	00 : 04 : 03	59.4	139.0	00 : 04 : 55	00 : 05 : 56
61	141.8	50	1.97	02 : 14 : 52	00 : 04 : 02	59.9	139.8	00 : 19 : 58	∞
62	143.6	50	1.97	01 : 55 : 24	00 : 04 : 22	59.8	139.7	00 : 12 : 59	00 : 19 : 57
65	149.0	50	1.97	01 : 28 : 32	00 : 05 : 01	59.4	139.0	00 : 05 : 48	00 : 07 : 00
61	141.8	55	2.17	02 : 37 : 32	00 : 05 : 05	59.9	139.8	00 : 23 : 07	∞
62	143.6	55	2.17	02 : 15 : 01	00 : 05 : 25	59.8	139.7	00 : 15 : 01	00 : 23 : 06
65	149.0	55	2.17	01 : 43 : 25	00 : 06 : 14	59.3	138.8	00 : 06 : 38	00 : 08 : 38
61	141.8	60	2.36	03 : 02 : 38	00 : 06 : 07	59.9	139.9	00 : 28 : 29	∞
62	143.6	60	2.36	02 : 34 : 50	00 : 06 : 37	59.8	139.7	00 : 17 : 04	00 : 26 : 18
65	149.0	60	2.36	01 : 58 : 58	00 : 07 : 36	59.3	138.8	00 : 07 : 31	00 : 09 : 06
61	141.8	65	2.56	03 : 25 : 50	00 : 07 : 28	59.9	139.9	00 : 31 : 57	∞
62	143.6	65	2.56	02 : 54 : 37	00 : 07 : 59	59.8	139.7	00 : 19 : 07	00 : 31 : 57
65	149.0	65	2.56	02 : 14 : 29	00 : 09 : 08	59.3	138.8	00 : 09 : 01	00 : 10 : 10
61	141.8	70	2.76	03 : 48 : 51	00 : 09 : 00	59.9	139.9	00 : 35 : 26	∞
62	143.6	70	2.76	03 : 14 : 16	00 : 09 : 31	59.8	139.7	00 : 21 : 10	00 : 35 : 24
65	149.0	70	2.76	02 : 29 : 05	00 : 10 : 50	59.3	138.7	00 : 09 : 12	00 : 11 : 10
61	141.8	75	2.95	04 : 11 : 29	00 : 10 : 32	59.9	139.9	00 : 38 : 52	∞
62	143.6	75	2.95	03 : 33 : 33	00 : 11 : 12	59.8	139.7	00 : 23 : 11	00 : 38 : 51
65	149.0	75	2.95	02 : 43 : 16	00 : 12 : 48	59.2	138.5	00 : 09 : 59	00 : 13 : 03
61	141.8	80	3.15	04 : 33 : 52	00 : 12 : 24	59.9	139.9	00 : 42 : 28	∞
62	143.6	80	3.15	03 : 52 : 25	00 : 13 : 14	59.8	139.7	00 : 25 : 10	00 : 42 : 13
65	149.0	80	3.15	02 : 57 : 51	00 : 15 : 08	59.2	138.5	00 : 11 : 38	00 : 14 : 09
61	141.8	85	3.35	04 : 56 : 48	00 : 14 : 36	60.0	140.0	00 : 47 : 10	∞
62	143.6	85	3.35	04 : 10 : 44	00 : 15 : 18	59.8	139.7	00 : 27 : 06	00 : 47 : 10
65	149.0	85	3.35	03 : 12 : 03	00 : 17 : 28	59.2	138.5	00 : 12 : 32	00 : 15 : 10
61	141.8	90	3.54	05 : 18 : 37	00 : 16 : 49	60.0	140.0	00 : 51 : 20	∞
62	143.6	90	3.54	04 : 28 : 27	00 : 17 : 49	59.8	139.7	00 : 28 : 58	00 : 51 : 20
65	149.0	90	3.54	03 : 25 : 42	00 : 20 : 19	59.2	138.5	00 : 13 : 21	00 : 16 : 15
61	141.8	95	3.74	05 : 39 : 49	05 : 39 : 48	60.0	140.0	00 : 55 : 33	∞
62	143.6	95	3.74	04 : 45 : 29	00 : 20 : 29	59.8	139.7	00 : 30 : 46	00 : 55 : 33
65	149.0	95	3.74	03 : 37 : 46	00 : 23 : 09	59.1	138.4	00 : 14 : 05	00 : 17 : 08
61	141.8	100	3.94	05 : 59 : 15	05 : 59 : 14	60.0	140.0	00 : 58 : 41	∞
62	143.6	100	3.94	05 : 01 : 51	00 : 23 : 20	59.8	139.7	00 : 32 : 31	00 : 57 : 32
65	149.0	100	3.94	03 : 49 : 11	00 : 26 : 20	59.0	138.2	00 : 14 : 45	00 : 19 : 13

[adey73]

Mr. False Economy here, so after using those super cheaps bags I found... (y'know what's coming next) I arrive home to find 10litres of exquisite duck fat soup that was supposed to be confit that has been cooked at 82c for 10hrs.

Anyway the plastic orbs I use in the bath for heat retention have a glorious duck fat sheen and can't shift it with washing up liquid. Any recommendations for a man, who one day will, look gift horses in the mouth?

Edited by adey73, 14 April 2008 - 04:29 PM.

[sygyzy]

I know most/all SV discussion here is for immediate service but what needs to be done for cook and hold? i am not talking for days but a few hours maybe. What needs to be done after the bag is removed? I assume it needs to be chilled then heated again for service but any specifics would be appreciated. I am just curious.

[DouglasBaldwin]

Well, it of course depends on what you are cooking. If you are cooking at below 131F (55C), then you shouldn't hold it at all. If you are cooking at or above 131F (55C) and only want to hold it for a couple hours, then I would recommend holding it in the water bath.

If you want to hold it longer than a couple hours, then you should rapidly cool it in a ice water bath (see my tables above) and then refrigerate it at
a) below 36.5F (2.5C) for up to 90 days,
b) below 38F (3.3C) for less than 31 days,
c) below 41F (5C) for less than 10 days, or
d) below 50F (10C) for less than 5 days.
This will prevent the outgrowth of non-proteolytic C. botulinum.

If you are doing a confit (or similar recipe) with the center temperature at 176F (80C) for longer than 6 hours (or 185F {85C} for longer than 36 minutes), then it just needs to be stored at below 50F (10C). Unless there is sufficient air left in the package to allow B. cereus to grow (i.e., you used a clamp style vacuum sealer rather than a chamber style vacuum sealer), in which case it must be stored at below 39F (4C).

Edit: Fixed formating.

[sygyzy]

Douglas,

Thank you so much. That is exactly the straight-to-the-point fact packed answer I was looking for. I am going to save that to my little cheatsheet.

[Baggy]

I think it’s fabulous sharing this information. Could you give the source. Obviously, this type of information on storage times/temperatures cannot be easily verified and is pretty safety-critical. I’d like to use the data, but clearly it would be difficult to justify without a reference. Thanks.

[sygyzy]

I believe, at least for Nathan and Daniel, they calculated the values themselves so you can cite them.

[pounce]

I think it’s fabulous sharing this information.  Could you give the source.  Obviously, this type of information on storage times/temperatures cannot be easily verified and is pretty safety-critical.  I’d like to use the data, but clearly it would be difficult to justify without a reference.  Thanks.

Douglas has some references on the great SV page he has been building.

http://amath.colorad.../sous-vide.html

[Baggy]

pounce – thanks for posting the link. Happy I can track the storage temperatures back to a reviewed source.

Douglas – Great work! Love the egg pictures – looks just like the ones that come out of my water bath. Do you have experimental data that confirms the heating/cooling tables you’ve put together? For example, I’ve found that in the case of a sausage vs the same thickness piece of meat, the sausage ‘cooks’ a good deal faster (measured with a probe thermometer), so geometry could be an additional factor.

Any idea if there is a measurable difference between the use of a circulating and non-circulating bath? I’ve only got a non-circulating bath, and haven’t found an inexpensive way of pushing the water around at, say, 70C so I can test the difference.

[sygyzy]

Baggy - Of course you had to expect your results right? The charts that Douglas and Nathan provided are assuming you are using normal cuts of proten (beef, chicken, pork, fish). They are not charts for head cheese, sausage, dumplings, or

[e_monster]

Any idea if there is a measurable difference between the use of a circulating and non-circulating bath?  I’ve only got a non-circulating bath, and haven’t found an inexpensive way of pushing the water around at, say, 70C so I can test the difference.

How significant the difference in water temps will be in the bath depends on where the heat source is located and the insulation characteristics.

A number of us have found that an aquarium air pump (less than $10) will provide ample circulation for most baths. They can be used with or without air stones.

[Baggy]

sygyzy – you’re right, and I was expecting a difference. What I didn’t know until I tried it was how big a difference there is between items of different geometries. Initially I started with a simple theoretical model based on Peter Barham’s formula included in his book ‘The Science of Cooking’. Unfortunately, the experimental approach seems to be at variance with the theory. So, I pose the question – has the theory been subjected to any real-world testing? I’m feeling my way in this area and have the impression that we are not quite ready to recommend a 20 mins a lb approach.

e_monster – thanks for the thought. I’ve been measuring the water temperature and find some minor variation depending on location within the bath. What surprised me was the additional variation caused when a pack is added – the temperature is consistently higher than the thermostat setting. So I figured that some circulation might help. After a long conversation (convoluted) with my local aquarium shop I came away with some doubts about using a circulating pump due to the high temperatures (and kit in the UK doesn’t seem to be as inexpensive as in the US). I guess that an aerator seems to work OK for you – how much stuff can you put in the bath before the circulation is slowed?

[pounce]

If you want to try an aquarium approach you don't want a power head or a water pump. You want an air pump.

http://www.aquatics-...-and-spares.asp

It's just going to bubble air through a plastic hose in your SV.

This works find for long times. Short times benefit from faster moving water. You aren't just keeping the water in the bath the same temp by mixing it you are effecting how fast the item in the bath heats the item by keeping the fluid that is in contact with the item at the right temp. Think about it. If you put a frozen steak in a still, but hot, pot the water will be hot most everywhere, but the water right next to the frozen steak will be cooled. If I was smarter I would quote all sorts of thermal and fluid dynamics stuff. I just know that the faster the water flows (within reason) and the more consistent you can keep the overall fluid temp the faster the item will arrive at temp.

[e_monster]

e_monster – thanks for the thought.  I’ve been measuring the water temperature and find some minor variation depending on location within the bath.  What surprised me was the additional variation caused when a pack is added – the temperature is consistently higher than the thermostat setting.  So I figured that some circulation might help.  After a long conversation (convoluted) with my local aquarium shop I came away with some doubts about using a circulating pump due to the high temperatures (and kit in the UK doesn’t seem to be as inexpensive as in the US).  I guess that an aerator seems to work OK for you – how much stuff can you put in the bath before the circulation is slowed?

I have cooked up to an 11 pound brisket (which took up a significant percentage of the surface area) and the temperature distribution remained quite even when the air pump was in use. (Within 0.75F everywhere that I measured when the brisket was in the bath). With a less massive piece of meat, the temperature distribution is much more even than that in my cooker.

With my setup, the heat changes slowly enough that the circulation provided by the air pump is enough to keep the heat evenly distributed. You can search this topic for posts by me to read more about the setups that I use.

[Baggy]

pounce – you are my link master! Now I have to figure out which pump. Any ideas which of the less expensive aerators sit outside the bath (not in it)?