Jump to content


Welcome to the eG Forums!

These forums are a service of the Society for Culinary Arts & Letters, a 501c3 nonprofit organization dedicated to advancement of the culinary arts. Anyone can read the forums, however if you would like to participate in active discussions please join the Society.

Photo

Cooking & Curing from "Charcuterie": Part 3

Charcuterie Cookbook

  • This topic is locked This topic is locked
596 replies to this topic

#301 mdbasile

mdbasile
  • legacy participant
  • 238 posts
  • Location:southeastern, mi

Posted 20 June 2006 - 08:40 AM

OK, you bunch of pushers.  I just spent the entire day (I'm at work, and it's slow, OK?) reading all fifty pages of this thread, and I finally just gave in and ordered the book on Amazon.  I asked for it for Christmas, and again for my birthday, didn't get it, and reading all your posts just pushed me over the edge.

I got the KA grinder and stuffer attachment for Christmas, though; I made the same error as someone else, a-way upthread - the first time I used it I failed to put the KNIFE BLADE into the grinder, and then couldn't figure out why it was so hard to get the meat to come through.  I hate the plastic plunger and keep meaning to buy a dowel or something instead - meat gets stuck in the "cross" part of the plunger and comes back out.

And I agree about the quality of the KA stuffer attachment... ugh.  But before I buy the Grizzly or other stuffer, I have to convince myself I'll have the time to make enough sausage to make it worthwhile.

I'm sure my first foray will be with the salmon, because that seems nonthreatening.  Then on to air-cured whole meats.  Chris, I really like your curing box setup and will likely steal that idea.  I have to check the temp/humidity in my basement sometime soon.

ETA: Susan, I also bought a Weber kettle this weekend and will be using it for all of my smoking needs - your posts have convinced me it will all work out.  Right?  Right.

View Post


Trust me on this - I made a shit load of sausages(20lbs 80+ links) with the KA and it was a royal pain in the ass. If I had known just how bad the KA stuffer was, there is no way I would have used it. Not only is it difficult, but it ruins the sausage by smearing it. You need a piston stuffer - period!! Trust me.

Edited by mdbasile, 20 June 2006 - 08:52 AM.


#302 mdbasile

mdbasile
  • legacy participant
  • 238 posts
  • Location:southeastern, mi

Posted 20 June 2006 - 08:43 AM

YUM !!!!!!!!!!

Did you try the duck ham recipe yet? I've been curious about that recipe.

View Post

Tried it today with the chicken and turkey, which turned out great:

Posted Image

Let me say that I didn't cure the duck for as long as I'd have liked; it was a muscovy duck breast, not pekin/long island (that's all Whole Paycheck had, at $15 a pound, too); I used ruby port instead of madeira.

OK, having said that: this stuff is duck crack.

Posted Image

Here it is on a plate with the last of my peperone. The color isn't as good in the photo as the duck turned out; it's more pink than brown. You can get a better sense of the colors here:

Posted Image

I've had my doubts about adding flavorings to the brine of stuff I'm going to smoke, out of a sense that it's often hard to pick up the nuances. But I really could pick up the flavorings here, which played fantastically off the smoke.

I really, really encourage you to make this recipe.

View Post



#303 mdbasile

mdbasile
  • legacy participant
  • 238 posts
  • Location:southeastern, mi

Posted 20 June 2006 - 08:48 AM

A quick question, and I'm sorry if it's been addressed - I couldn't find the Search within Topic button.  While I anxiously await the arrival of my book, can anyone tell me what ingredients are required for the salmon that seems to be the For Beginners Who Are Scared recipe from this book? A PM would be fine if copyright is an issue here. The book's scheduled to arrive on Wednesday, and I'd like to start curing that night when I get home from work (at 11:30pm), which means I should go shopping tomorrow.

I do not like fennel at all and planned on leaving it out, which I may have already stated.  Mistake?  Perhaps I will just use the seeds, as Elie did on page 1 of this thread.

View Post


Jeniac - I have made the salmon about 7 times and I am happy with the following:

3 lb Costco Salmon
3/4 cup koscher salt
1.5 cups mixed light and dark brown sugar
1/4 scotch
zest of 1 lime.

Comes out perfect everytime. Also let it sit at least 2 days after it is done - seems to get better that way....

#304 Abra

Abra
  • participating member
  • 3,186 posts
  • Location:Bainbridge Island, WA

Posted 20 June 2006 - 09:32 AM

Look, green jowl bacon!

#305 FoodMan

FoodMan
  • eGullet Society staff emeritus
  • 4,316 posts

Posted 20 June 2006 - 10:41 AM

A quick question, and I'm sorry if it's been addressed - I couldn't find the Search within Topic button.  While I anxiously await the arrival of my book, can anyone tell me what ingredients are required for the salmon that seems to be the For Beginners Who Are Scared recipe from this book? A PM would be fine if copyright is an issue here. The book's scheduled to arrive on Wednesday, and I'd like to start curing that night when I get home from work (at 11:30pm), which means I should go shopping tomorrow.

I do not like fennel at all and planned on leaving it out, which I may have already stated.  Mistake?  Perhaps I will just use the seeds, as Elie did on page 1 of this thread.

View Post


Jeniac - I have made the salmon about 7 times and I am happy with the following:

3 lb Costco Salmon
3/4 cup koscher salt
1.5 cups mixed light and dark brown sugar
1/4 scotch
zest of 1 lime.

Comes out perfect everytime. Also let it sit at least 2 days after it is done - seems to get better that way....

View Post


Also I entered the recipe for the awsome Pastrami salmon in Recipe Gullet. You can find it here.

E. Nassar
Houston, TX

My Blog
contact: enassar(AT)gmail(DOT)com


#306 jeniac42

jeniac42
  • participating member
  • 647 posts
  • Location:Adrian, MI

Posted 20 June 2006 - 11:18 AM

Thanks for all the replies. Amazingly, when I came into work today at 1:30 MY BOOK WAS ON MY CHAIR ALREADY! Let's hear it for faster-than-anticipated shipping! I haven't had time to open it and take a look yet, but I should do after five. Then I can start dreaming of all the delicious meat products in my future....
Jennie

#307 melicob

melicob
  • participating member
  • 21 posts
  • Location:San Francisco, CA

Posted 20 June 2006 - 11:48 AM

Not to sound like an idiot, but what is the proper storage for air dried sausage? Fridge? Freezer? Counter? I sliced some and brought it to work and it turned dull brownish all over... Is that from it not curing the entire 18 days? (It lost 50% of it's weight in 14 days so I took it down and threw it in the fridge.) I used all the recommended amounts of the bactoferm and curing salt #2, but now I'm insecure about my work and don't want to harm anyone that samples it!

Does the brown mean rot? (There were a couple brown spots when it was "cured" and I cut those off, assuming they had something to do with unpricked air pocket.) Did I do something bad by not letting it cure for the right amount of time? If I cook it (in paella) will it still be OK?

Please enlighten me oh experienced dry curers!

#308 Richard Kilgore

Richard Kilgore
  • eGullet Society staff emeritus
  • 6,378 posts
  • Location:home, home on the range....

Posted 21 June 2006 - 10:19 AM

I picked up an 8 lb belly last night and divided it up into three pieces, plus some pieces for salt pork. The three main pieces I did the basic three ways mentioned in the book: plain, maple syrup and savory. Since these were then smaller 1.5 to 3.0 lb pieces, I put each one in a one gallon bag rathe than a 2 gallon and I used 45 gm basic cure rather than 50.

I'm making this up these adjustments as I go, so I would appreciate it if anyone sees any problem with the bag size or the amount of cure.

#309 Chris Amirault

Chris Amirault
  • eGullet Society staff emeritus
  • 19,626 posts
  • Location:Rhode Island

Posted 21 June 2006 - 10:23 AM

Richard, that all sounds good to me!
Chris Amirault
camirault@eGstaff.org
eG Ethics Signatory
Sir Luscious got gator belts and patty melts

#310 jmolinari

jmolinari
  • participating member
  • 1,362 posts

Posted 21 June 2006 - 10:29 AM

Melicob. Store cured meats in the fridge. I don't know why your salame turned brown.
sorry

#311 ronnie_suburban

ronnie_suburban
  • eGullet Society staff emeritus
  • 5,977 posts
  • Location:Suburbs of Chicago

Posted 21 June 2006 - 12:48 PM

Melicob. Store cured meats in the fridge. I don't know why your salame turned brown.
sorry

View Post

Light can also adversely affect the quality of cured meats (fats tend to go bad faster), so that's another good reason to store them in the fridge.

=R=
"Hey, hey, careful man! There's a beverage here!" --The Dude, The Big Lebowski

LTHForum.com -- The definitive Chicago-based culinary chat site

ronnie_suburban 'at' yahoo.com

#312 ronnie_suburban

ronnie_suburban
  • eGullet Society staff emeritus
  • 5,977 posts
  • Location:Suburbs of Chicago

Posted 21 June 2006 - 12:58 PM

Look, green jowl bacon!

View Post

I'm proud to be a trendsetter! :biggrin:

=R=
"Hey, hey, careful man! There's a beverage here!" --The Dude, The Big Lebowski

LTHForum.com -- The definitive Chicago-based culinary chat site

ronnie_suburban 'at' yahoo.com

#313 Dave Weinstein

Dave Weinstein
  • participating member
  • 222 posts
  • Location:Duvall, WA

Posted 21 June 2006 - 01:11 PM

For those in the Seattle area (or who could be, for the right incentive), Porcella is doing a sausage (fresh and dried) making class on July 9th, limited to 10 spots, at $40 for the class.

#314 Chris Amirault

Chris Amirault
  • eGullet Society staff emeritus
  • 19,626 posts
  • Location:Rhode Island

Posted 21 June 2006 - 07:37 PM

Update on my sopressata after ten days. The slurry seems not to have produced anything quite yet, but they are looking mighty fine. I had to toss one link for green mold and washed 'em all down with a vinegar solution to be sure.
Chris Amirault
camirault@eGstaff.org
eG Ethics Signatory
Sir Luscious got gator belts and patty melts

#315 Doc-G

Doc-G
  • participating member
  • 76 posts
  • Location:Adelaide, Australia/London, UK

Posted 22 June 2006 - 11:29 PM

Hi Guys and Gals,

Thought I would do a little update.

I have made some Spanish Chorizo and some Hungarian Salami. We had to make a couple of recipe adjustments for Salt as we have different versions of Starter Cultures, Nitrates and Nitrites here in Australia.

I have to say that we were pretty pleased with the results. I even made a little label from our company labels to make it up as a 'packaged product' to give out to friends as presents.

Hope you like!!

Posted Image
Spanish Chorizo

Posted Image
Hungarian Salami

Posted Image
Labeled up as 'Presents'

I'm following all the stuff everyone here is doing and have to say that this would surely have to be the most impressive thread on egullet at the moment. Well done to everybody for keeping the interest up.

Cheers,

Doc-G

#316 ronnie_suburban

ronnie_suburban
  • eGullet Society staff emeritus
  • 5,977 posts
  • Location:Suburbs of Chicago

Posted 23 June 2006 - 07:56 AM

Beautiful stuff, Doc-G, absolutely gorgeous.

The 2 sausages seem quite different from each other, even visually. Can you describe the differences in the grinding or other elements of the technique which help to differentiate their textures?

Thanks for sharing!

=R=
"Hey, hey, careful man! There's a beverage here!" --The Dude, The Big Lebowski

LTHForum.com -- The definitive Chicago-based culinary chat site

ronnie_suburban 'at' yahoo.com

#317 Richard Kilgore

Richard Kilgore
  • eGullet Society staff emeritus
  • 6,378 posts
  • Location:home, home on the range....

Posted 23 June 2006 - 08:10 AM

I picked up an 8 lb belly last night and divided it up into three pieces, plus some pieces for salt pork. The three main pieces I did the basic three ways mentioned in the book: plain, maple syrup and savory. Since these were then smaller 1.5 to 3.0 lb pieces, I put each one in a one gallon bag rathe than a 2 gallon and I used 45 gm basic cure rather than 50.

I'm making this up these adjustments as I go, so I would appreciate it if anyone sees any problem with the bag size or the amount of cure.

View Post


This appears to be working okay, except that one bag leaked. It appears it was only the maple syrup version. So what's the impact of losing that fluid? Should I add some cure and a little water and/or maple syrup now, or just leave it alone?

#318 Chris Amirault

Chris Amirault
  • eGullet Society staff emeritus
  • 19,626 posts
  • Location:Rhode Island

Posted 23 June 2006 - 08:12 AM

I'd leave it alone if it's less than 1/4 cup, but if little of the belly is in contact with the cure, then I'd add a bit more, yes.

edited to degarblize -- ca

Edited by chrisamirault, 24 June 2006 - 04:15 AM.

Chris Amirault
camirault@eGstaff.org
eG Ethics Signatory
Sir Luscious got gator belts and patty melts

#319 mdbasile

mdbasile
  • legacy participant
  • 238 posts
  • Location:southeastern, mi

Posted 23 June 2006 - 09:30 AM

Doc-G - like that packaging!!! Also what perfect looking product. What kind of casings did you use?

#320 Dave Weinstein

Dave Weinstein
  • participating member
  • 222 posts
  • Location:Duvall, WA

Posted 23 June 2006 - 11:50 AM

This weekend we're going to be making a fair bit of sausage (especially since my new Grizzly arrived this week), but I had some meat that was moving rapidly into the "now or never" category, plus some scraps in the freezer.

So, I got up early, cut up the chicken thighs, some very fatty pork, and the fat trimmings from some prosciutto that I had in the freezer, added fresh garlic and a lot of fresh rosemary, and made a (mostly) chicken sausage this morning. Then I formed it into balls, rolled them in panko, flatted them out, made sure they had a nice coat of panko, and layed them out on wax paper to freeze (with the exception of the one I held out for lunch).

It worked really nicely, and I plan on making a lot more. And for those looking at making the jump to fresh sausage, the patties are easier than making links (especially with the KA stuffer).

#321 Doc-G

Doc-G
  • participating member
  • 76 posts
  • Location:Adelaide, Australia/London, UK

Posted 23 June 2006 - 03:03 PM

The Chorizo was ground with a combination to two sized plates. One third of the mixture was left 'coarse' minced with a 10mm plate and the rest was minced a second time through a 5mm plate to give two different textures.

With the Hungarian Salami, all the mixture was minced through a 10mm plate and then through a 5mm plate. That is why the texture is 'even'. Also, the mixture was VERY cold when minced. It is on the way to being frozen, which is what we call 'tempered'. This is also good temperature for slicing very thin slices of beef for carpaccio or something.

The skins are a fibrous skin that come from a Butcher supplier. They cost about $1 or so each and can be bought in any quantity you like. One end is already tied with a loop at the end so that all you have to do is stick it on the end of your filler and fill it whilst maintaining the pressure and then twist the other end and tie it. We were thinking of getting a clipper but the $3000 price tag for it didn't seem to justify this as it is only a hobby for us and not part of our core business.

Hope this answers your questions.

Cheers,

Doc-G

#322 ronnie_suburban

ronnie_suburban
  • eGullet Society staff emeritus
  • 5,977 posts
  • Location:Suburbs of Chicago

Posted 23 June 2006 - 03:11 PM

Thanks, Doc-G, for the detailed info. It's much appreciated.

=R=
"Hey, hey, careful man! There's a beverage here!" --The Dude, The Big Lebowski

LTHForum.com -- The definitive Chicago-based culinary chat site

ronnie_suburban 'at' yahoo.com

#323 Abra

Abra
  • participating member
  • 3,186 posts
  • Location:Bainbridge Island, WA

Posted 23 June 2006 - 11:36 PM

Posted Image
What does this have to do with charcuterie, you may wonder. The bottle is empty, the glass is full. This is all post-processing refreshment, reinforcement, renewal. Wish you (at least one of you) were here to help me out! Instead, alone, this is what my kitchen looks like

Posted Image

A fucking abbatoir, that's what. If you're thinking of making boudin noir, plan to have someone else to help you. Someone weird, who loves blood all over the place. Someone with a strong stomach. Someone who loves to clean up. Like, in my case, my husband is out of town. You know how sausage goes better with four hands? Well, my stuffmeister husband is out of town, and I had to go it alone tonight, because I have a "girl chef" dinner party tomorrow and need to get this sausage on the road. Me, I normally don't drink a lot of straight Scotch, but tonight, if the bottle weren't empty, I'd be drinking more. Actually, I am drinking more, but I've switched to bourbon. It's that bad.

Ok, so let's start from the beginning. Maybe my "small dice" is not small enough, but here's how the mix looked when I first started, following the directions closely, with the exception that I couldn't find any fresh chervil, so I subbed a bit of fennel pollen.

Posted Image

Utterly gross, right? You're supposed to taste it for seasoning by frying up a bit. I didn't want to get another pan dirty - little did I know - so I microwaved a portion. I'll spare you the picture of the micro'ed sample, but suffice it to say that I had to go sit in the comfy chair and take a few deep breaths before I could even bring myself to put some in my mouth. It looked like cat food. Way worse than cat food. Now, I like blood sausage. I've eaten it in two or three countries and loved it. But this boudin noir looked horrifying. If you think it looks bad raw, just be grateful that I'm sparing you a picture of how it looked after being zapped in the micro.

Hey, guess what, it tastes good! One important thing - I used the Asian blood product, which has water and salt added. After I weighed out the salt called for in the recipe, an intelligent little voice in my head said "wait, this blood has added salt!" So, I added only about 1/4 - 1/3 of the salt called for in the recipe. That was already enough, when I tasted. If you're getting that same Asian blood, with water and salt added, be very careful when you add additional salt!

Ok, more deep breaths, let's have a go with the immersion blender. When I've eaten blood sausage before, it had a pleasingly smooth texture. So I had at it with the immersion blender until it was a lot smoother, but still with a few bits left to provide definition, even though it looked more horrifying than ever.

Posted Image

See what I mean? But hey, I have an sort of emulsion, and I'm ready to stuff. The trouble is, I have no wide-mouthed funnel. Ok, my husband isn't here to solve this problem, so I take a chef's knife and an extra funnel and give it a mighty whackl. Voila, wide-mouthed funnel. Oh, the cut's not straight? Drat. So now I need duct tape. That's what a guy would do, right? Duct tape the sucker to one of the stuffer tubes? Rats, where has he put the duct tape? Ok, here's some shipping tape, why wouldn't that work? See where this is going? I get so enamoured of my improved stuffing tool that I forget that nothing's holding the casing onto the tube. Oh my god, the casing slips off the tube and the blood goop is running out all over the place

Posted Image

I take a picture of how clean I am personally, just to make myself feel better.

Posted Image

Amazing, right?

Lots more deep breaths. I finally get the stuff into the casings, and rinsed off.

Posted Image

Not too terrible, right? But now, the sausage doesn't fit into the fucking pan. I only made half the recipe, and I have the big Le Creuset saute pan, and I have it at 170 degrees, which in itself is an issue, and it's way too much sausage for the pan.

Posted Image

Crap, now what? I can't cope. It's too much, I feel faint. I let it cook as best it can. I come back every so often to try to turn the sausages, to ensure even cooking. Bloody water splashes all over the floor and the cabinets. What am I, totally fucking crazy? Evidently.

Finally, the sausage seems to be about 150, although not in every part. I surrender, and set the oven for 170. After 15 minutes in there, we have sausage.

Posted Image

I put it into the fridge, and open the liquor cabinet. It'll chill, and so will I. Tomorrow, I'll probably saute it up, in slices. If I don't feed it all to the cats. We'll see. And I'll let you know.

#324 Chris Amirault

Chris Amirault
  • eGullet Society staff emeritus
  • 19,626 posts
  • Location:Rhode Island

Posted 24 June 2006 - 04:24 AM

Well, you've clearly fallen off the deep end, Abra. That's the best post I've read in months! What photos -- "fucking abbatoir" is right! I'm dying to find out... er... I'm really eager to find out what they're like.

Speaking of the deep end, since I've been up repeatedly all night to tend to my butt, I think I'll go give my sopressata another vinegar wash, or maybe I'll toss another cheese rind into the "good mold" ooze....
Chris Amirault
camirault@eGstaff.org
eG Ethics Signatory
Sir Luscious got gator belts and patty melts

#325 helenjp

helenjp
  • eGullet Society staff emeritus
  • 3,232 posts

Posted 24 June 2006 - 05:03 AM

Now THAT is devotion to duty!

#326 jmolinari

jmolinari
  • participating member
  • 1,362 posts

Posted 24 June 2006 - 06:10 AM

Abra.. wow. Whatn i saw the first picture i had forgotten you were doing blood sausage, and i thought you put your cat or your arm through the grinder by accident. Man...you are really rather devoted to blood sausage. Good job. Amazing.

Chris...if you spray with good mold solution, then wipe with vinegar, you're killing any mold spores you put on there. Explains why nothing grew.

jason

#327 Bombdog

Bombdog
  • participating member
  • 527 posts
  • Location:South Carolina

Posted 24 June 2006 - 07:20 AM

That's the best post I've read in months!

View Post


I have to go clean my monitor of coffee spew now!
Dave Valentin
Retired Explosive Detection K9 Handler
"So, what if we've got it all backwards?" asks my son.
"Got what backwards?" I ask.
"What if chicken tastes like rattlesnake?" My son, the Einstein of the family.


#328 Chris Amirault

Chris Amirault
  • eGullet Society staff emeritus
  • 19,626 posts
  • Location:Rhode Island

Posted 24 June 2006 - 07:30 AM

Chris...if you spray with good mold solution, then wipe with vinegar, you're killing any mold spores you put on there. Explains why nothing grew.

View Post

Actually, I failed to mention that I resprayed with another cheese mold slurry, and I also tossed the rinds into the salted distilled water inside the chamber for good measure. I'm happy to report that I'm getting good, chalky, white mold!
Chris Amirault
camirault@eGstaff.org
eG Ethics Signatory
Sir Luscious got gator belts and patty melts

#329 ronnie_suburban

ronnie_suburban
  • eGullet Society staff emeritus
  • 5,977 posts
  • Location:Suburbs of Chicago

Posted 24 June 2006 - 07:46 AM

Abra . . . that is simply awesome! Can't wait to hear about how it turned it.

=R=
"Hey, hey, careful man! There's a beverage here!" --The Dude, The Big Lebowski

LTHForum.com -- The definitive Chicago-based culinary chat site

ronnie_suburban 'at' yahoo.com

#330 Doc-G

Doc-G
  • participating member
  • 76 posts
  • Location:Adelaide, Australia/London, UK

Posted 24 June 2006 - 08:59 AM

Abra,

I love it.

G





Also tagged with one or more of these keywords: Charcuterie, Cookbook