293 replies to this topic

[Karri]

In italian a c followed by an e is the ch as in che guevara but a little bit sharper. Just as in Castillian a c followed by an e is a th as in cena or thena. But very soft.

[Mjx]

Next time you hear someone say BAY-zill give them a slap for me please. . . .

Best not: He or she may (quite justifiably) strike you back with one of the volumes of the Oxford English Dictionary, which disagrees with you

[Karri]

Webster only differentiates between basil and baasil, as both being correct pronunciations. Might be a humor, humour situation.
Main Entry: ba·sil Pronunciation: \ˈ ba-zəl, ˈ bā-, -səl\Function: noun Etymology: Middle French basile, from Late Latin basilicum, from Greek basilikon, from neuter of basilikos Date: 15th century 1 : any of several aromatic herbs (genus Ocimum) of the mint family; especially : SWEET BASIL 2 : the dried or fresh leaves of a basil used especially as a seasoning

Edit: added what M&W had to say.

Edited by Karri, 15 December 2011 - 06:08 AM.

[Mjx]

Webster only differentiates between basil and baasil, as both being correct pronunciations. Might be a humor, humour situation.
Main Entry: ba·sil Pronunciation: \ˈ ba-zəl, ˈ bā-, -səl\Function: noun Etymology: Middle French basile, from Late Latin basilicum, from Greek basilikon, from neuter of basilikos Date: 15th century 1 : any of several aromatic herbs (genus Ocimum) of the mint family; especially : SWEET BASIL 2 : the dried or fresh leaves of a basil used especially as a seasoning

Edit: added what M&W had to say.

My point precisely: Both pronunciations are regarded as correct.

[Karri]

Neither of which are BAY, as in bay leaves and zill as in chill with a z. My point exactly.

[MikeHartnett]

Webster only differentiates between basil and baasil, as both being correct pronunciations. Might be a humor, humour situation.
Main Entry: ba·sil Pronunciation: \ˈ ba-zəl, ˈ bā-, -səl\

bā-, -səl = "bay-zill". If you don't believe me, click the audio version of the pronunciation (http://www.merriam-w...ictionary/basil). The second audio clip is "bay-zill".

[Karri]

Correct! Regardless, I am still advocating that slap.

[Hassouni]

I can't believe nobody's brought up Cointreau and Courvoisier, among many other Frenchy alcohol names.

For the unenlightend: kwahn-tro, coor-vwah-zee-yay


ETA: Chartreuse -but I can't think of a good way to write out in the french "eu" in a semi-phonetic way. It's NOT shartrooss.

Edited by Hassouni, 15 December 2011 - 04:38 PM.

[Nich]

To be fair, this is approximately how I say these - I can't vouch for my terrible accent being particularly representative of anyone else from Melbourne (Mel-b'n ;).

mocha = MOCK-uh (I hear mo-KAH too)
gyros = Yi-ross (I try to roll the r a little; pretty common to get YEEE-ross)
pecan = PEE-kan
croissant = kru-SONT (unless I'm talking to someone who speaks native francais!)
dolmades = dol-MA-diz (I mostly hear DOLL-mades, and wonder what the doll made)
basil = BAZ-ull (as in pull)
oregano = orry-GAH-no


I might just not be frequenting the right places, but it's rare to actually see/hear shawarma or even gyros; it'll typically just be kebab or souvalaki ( or even just 'souva').

It's rare for me to hear jalapeño screwed up too much, but that seems weird because as delicious as Mexican cuisine is, it's a rarity here, and 'el niño' is often simply rendered 'el nino'.

It is common to hear gelato referred to as gelati - even if it is one scoop of one flavour :< Who am I to insist that it is one gelato and not a million conjoined bits of gelati.

[BarbaraY]

I can't figure out why so called chefs can't learn the correct pronunciation. Today I heard one pronounce Turmeric as Toomeric. I have heard others do this, too. Maybe they moved the "R" to Sherbert.

[HowardLi]

I can't figure out why so called chefs can't learn the correct pronunciation. Today I heard one pronounce Turmeric as Toomeric. I have heard others do this, too. Maybe they moved the "R" to Sherbert.

It's naht a tumah-ric!

*rimshot*

[Dignan]

I say proshutt and the rest because I pretend I'm talking to Tony and Carmella and that makes it fun.

[Panaderia Canadiense]

I always thought that the first "r" in turmeric was next to silent (semivocal) and I pronounce it as too{r}meric. Funny, though, I pronounce the "r" in the Spanish equivalent (curcuma) fully.


Edited because something funky happened with the symbol I used for the semivocal r.

Edited by Panaderia Canadiense, 06 January 2012 - 06:44 PM.

[rarerollingobject]

There's a TV chef here in Aus. who pronounces "pestle" (as in mortar and pestle) with a hard t. Pest-ell. I cringe every time.

[annachan]

Paella! Drives up nuts hearing how people here in Australia and the Brits pronoun it. I just cannot bring myself to say Pa-ella.

[JAZ]

Why is it that American TV/radio food people pronounce "marinade" as "mar-i-naaahhhd"? Lynn Rosetto Kasper and Sara Moulton are two of the worst. Do they think it sounds high-class, or European? Drives me crazy.

[Alcuin]

Why is it that American TV/radio food people pronounce "marinade" as "mar-i-naaahhhd"? Lynn Rosetto Kasper and Sara Moulton are two of the worst. Do they think it sounds high-class, or European? Drives me crazy.

This hits on what drives me crazy about over the top food pronunciations. I'm a descriptivist by nature, so anything that you grew up saying is fine in my book. Mispronunciations, like saying no-chee when you should be saying nyo-kee (or something like it), don't count for this. As long as your in the ballpark, or the way you pronounce the word fits in with some large (it's got to be large) segment of speakers, it's fine by me.

My dad is from Philly, I grew up there for part of my life, so while I say prosciutto, he says "pruh-zhoot." It gets kind of funny sometimes too: capicola becomes "gahba-ghoul"! I think these pronunciations are valid for their time and place though, and would never correct him. For him they are correct.

What I can't stand are people who put on some sort of voice when trying to sound sophisticated saying things like "mar-i-naaaaahhhd" or dropping into some strange pseudo accent when saying things like "chilaquiles" or "coq au vin" or anything else. Just pronounce the words casually. And don't show off your lame pronunciation by using some accent, as if you are speaking Spanish or French or Italian, etc., in the middle of your English sentence.

[Michael Speleoto]

Regarding Courvoisier, I asked for one in a (terrible) bar using the proper pronunciation and the smart-arse "bartender" replied with "Don't you mean core-voice-seer"

Ugh. Didn't even get one in the end.

[kayb]

PEEE-can vs puh-CAHN -- I grew up in the South saying the latter. My Northern friends tend toward the former.

Other regional differencews are CRAW-fish and CRAY-fish (in Arkansas and Tennessee, they're the former), and PRAW-leens and PRAY-leens. I'm of the PRAW-leen persuasion.

[Karri]

Jalapeño, following Spanish pronounciation would be actually pronounced halapeenyo. In a word with no accent the stress is placed on the penultimate syllable, ha-la-PEE-nyo.

Edit: Frame of reference México without the accent would be Me-HII-co.

Edited by Karri, 18 February 2012 - 04:32 PM.

[Andreas]

The one thing that I often have to laugh about are the pronunciation tries of most of the scotch distilleries. But on the other hand...Gaelic is not really that easy to pronounce...

my favorites:
. Glen Garioch : glen–geery (river valley in mountain or hill country)
. Laphroaig : la–froyg ("Hollow by the Big Bay")
. Ledaig : lay–chuck ("The Small Slope")
. Poit Dhubh : posh–doo
. Strathisla : strath–eye–la ("The Valley of the River Isla")
. Te Bheag : chay–vek
. Auchentoshan : ocken–toshun ("Corner of the field")

(Copied from a list I collected over some time, in the brackets are the translations/meanings, I do hope the pronunciations in the list are correct ;) )

[Shalmanese]

Why is it that American TV/radio food people pronounce "marinade" as "mar-i-naaahhhd"? Lynn Rosetto Kasper and Sara Moulton are two of the worst. Do they think it sounds high-class, or European? Drives me crazy.

The cooks on America's Test Kitchen do this all the time and what bugs me the most is that it's inconsistent! 80% of the time, they'll sale mah-ri-naughde and then, occasionally, they'll slip up and say it the normal way. It's like it's a deliberate affectation.

[Mjx]

Jalapeño, following Spanish pronounciation would be actually pronounced halapeenyo. In a word with no accent the stress is placed on the penultimate syllable, ha-la-PEE-nyo.

. . . .

Actually, ha-la-PEH-nyo; the letter 'e' is never pronounced as an 'ee' in Spanish (for that, they use the letter 'i').

[Broken English]

I don't get the American pronounciation of parmesan, or parmigiano as "parma-john". Either say it in English, or say it in Italian, don't bastardise two languages.

Also, pizza and pie are two very different things, they are not interchangeable.

[ChrisTaylor]

Also, pizza and pie are two very different things, they are not interchangeable.

This is one matter in which I'll join Public Enemy and fight the power. A pie involves a pastry lid and braised meat (or, if you're so inclined, stewed fruit). A pizza is ... pizza. One of these things is not like the other. I do not understand people--and there are many here--who deem a baked disk of bread topped with cheese, tomato, et al to be pie.

Edited by ChrisTaylor, 20 February 2012 - 12:55 AM.

[Hassouni]

ditto Parmesan vs. Parmigiana, and the whole pizza is not a pie thing.

I mean really, Parmesan is a perfectly valid English word. We don't say Parisien with a French accent, we say Parisian.

I don't know how pizza came to be known as a pie...








in my book pies are sweet!


*preparing for onslaught of devout English and otherwise savoury pie fans...*

[Shalmanese]

Also, pizza and pie are two very different things, they are not interchangeable.

This is one matter in which I'll join Public Enemy and fight the power. A pie involves a pastry lid and braised meat (or, if you're so inclined, stewed fruit). A pizza is ... pizza. One of these things is not like the other. I do not understand people--and there are many here--who deem a baked disk of bread topped with cheese, tomato, et al to be pie.

Structurally, a pecan pie and a Chicago deep dish sausage pizza have a lot in common with each other.

[David A. Goldfarb]

Interestingly, the Italian-Americans at our local pizzeria in Queens, New York, generally refer to what they sell as "pies" and not as "pizzas" or even "pizza pies." I'll ask for a "medium pizza, half plain, half pepperoni and mushrooms," and the guy behind the counter will confirm, "medium pie,..."

I'd chalk that up to assimilationism from two or three generations ago, when they started calling tomato sauce "red gravy" or "Sunday gravy," because that's what working-class Americans called any kind of sauce at the time. I remember the first time I heard an old Italian guy from Brooklyn talking about the family dinners they made when he was growing up with "gravy" on everything, and I thought it really strange that they were having brown sauce on their pasta, fried fish, etc.

[JeanneCake]

I'd chalk that up to assimilationism from two or three generations ago, when they started calling tomato sauce "red gravy" or "Sunday gravy," because that's what working-class Americans called any kind of sauce at the time. I remember the first time I heard an old Italian guy from Brooklyn talking about the family dinners they made when he was growing up with "gravy" on everything, and I thought it really strange that they were having brown sauce on their pasta, fried fish, etc.

It wasn't until I was in grade school that I learned "gravy" could be something other than the red sauce we had all the time, and especially on Sundays!

[Hassouni]

I find it rather quaint when I see curries described as having a gravy...