432 replies to this topic

[pazzaglia]

Through my searching I have read that Modernist Cuisine recommends the Rikon as does the team over at Cooking Issues because it will not vent at cooking pressure which means it heats up more quickly, preserves volatile compounds from escaping and does not have as much evaporation during long cooking.

What the authors are referring to is a pressure cooker with a spring-valve, as opposed to the older generation pressure cookers (which are still being sold, by the way) with jiggler and weight-modified valves which retain pressure by releasing vapor. So when you are researching a pressure cooker look for the word "spring-valve" in the specs.

Kuhn Rikon, Fagor, Fissler - they will all get you to your destination (pressure cooked food), two have "leather seats", one has an extra-fine polish, and one is an economy car. But in all of them the result will be = pressure cooked food!

Just one note on Fagor: they have about three models with only ONE pressure setting "high" while their Futuro and Duo models have two pressure settings (which are standard for Kuhn Rikon and Fissler). I only mention this because I just published a recipe for pressure cooking eggs, and some of my readers cannot use the method because they have a Fagor which only reaches High pressure.

Be judicious with your budget, but don't get these ultra-economy models with one pressure setting!

I have a Fissler blue point I bought a couple of weeks ago. I LOVE it...I've used it 4x in the past two weeks for soup, chicken, etc. It's made so well, everything comes apart to be washed, and it's so quiet. It's more expensive, but like you said, you should only have to buy it once.

So glad to hear your pressure cookers arrived! Did you try the whole chicken in the pressure cooker, recipe or something else? Aren't the Fisslers easy to clean?



Ciao,

L

[AaronM]

Found this Fissler set on Amazon for $180 - it was listed as Used but the description was that it is still in the original box, and the order is fulfilled by Amazon.

[avaserfi]

Kuhn Rikon, Fagor, Fissler - they will all get you to your destination (pressure cooked food), two have "leather seats", one has an extra-fine polish, and one is an economy car. But in all of them the result will be = pressure cooked food!

Thanks for the info. I am looking at the Fagor duo which does both low and high pressure settings. I was kind of getting the sense that the differences between the Rikon and Fagor (and Fissler) were mostly cosmetic. Are there any functional differences between the pressure cookers? That I still can't figure out.

If I recall some places suggest that the Rikon is a completely sealed system at pressure (I think this is true of the Fissler too), while the Fagor does release some steam at pressure. Am I misunderstanding the situation and does this steam release matter?

[bmdaniel]

I think the kuhn rikon makes it easier to cook without venting any steam. If you follow the Fagor manual, you are supposed to have a slight but steady stream of steam while you are cooking at pressure (I guess this guarantees that you are at the target pressure). If you don't want to vent (e.g. for stock where it has been shown to produce a less flavorful outcome), I have had success turning down the temperature slightly to the point where it is not venting but still at the desired pressure (you have to get used to it on your cooker/range b/c it's easy to drop further down as well). I've found listening to the interior contents (mild bubbling) as a helpful indicator to make sure it is getting enough heat.

[MelissaH]

If I recall some places suggest that the Rikon is a completely sealed system at pressure (I think this is true of the Fissler too), while the Fagor does release some steam at pressure. Am I misunderstanding the situation and does this steam release matter?

We have a Fagor Duo and have been happy with it. Based on what I've seen, it doesn't seem to release steam at pressure, but it does release steam on its way up to pressure. When it gets up to pressure, a little button-indicator pops up and that seems to block the hole the steam was escaping from.

MelissaH

[bmdaniel]

We have a Fagor Duo and have been happy with it. Based on what I've seen, it doesn't seem to release steam at pressure, but it does release steam on its way up to pressure. When it gets up to pressure, a little button-indicator pops up and that seems to block the hole the steam was escaping from.

MelissaH

On my 8qt Fagor Duo, before it gets pressurized steam escapes through the handle - I think this is unavoidable and based on the safety valve catching at pressure, like you said. Once at pressure, it depends on how much heat you are giving it (steam can escape through the selector dial opening).

I also forgot to mention above - if you are trying to avoid venting, you also obviously have to let the cooker cool naturally rather than releasing the steam at the end (can take 30+ minutes for a full batch of stock in my cooker)

[pazzaglia]

All new generation, spring valve, pressure cookers operate by expelling oxygen from the pan first lightly then forcefully until the pan begins to reach pressure and you hear a "click" where it seals shut and the pressure indicator either begins to rise to the desired temperature ring or pops up a signal. When the desired pressure is reached, the heat should be turned down to the lowest possible setting without loosing pressure (it takes a little adjustment to get it right). If the heat is not lowered enough, vapor will escape from the valve as a safety measure to keep the pressure inside from getting too high.

I have a Kuhn Rikon, Fagor and several Fisslers. But cannot really see the mechanics of all the valves because some of them are in a proprietary casing (which I cannot open without destroying it). The Kuhn Rikon valve is super-minimalist and it's really just a metal rod, a spring and a screw. The Fagor valve is a little "doo dad" with a spring, suspended in a plastic-type casing that can be easily removed. The Fissler valve cannot really be seen on any of the models I have because they are integrated in their "Euromatic" handle - but from what I can see all the pieces are metal.

My Fagor Futuro does not have a steady stream of steam coming out of it while it is at pressure (only when it is over), it does have an occasional light whisp of vapor that escapes during cooking. The Kuhn Rikon and Fissler do not have any vapor escaping during cooking - you cannot even smell if something is burning in them (yes, I've had experiments go wrong!)

Ciao,

L

Edited by pazzaglia, 07 April 2011 - 06:00 AM.

[Jose Nieves]

I've had a 7-3/8Q Kuhn for a number of years (I just found an old receipt for $100) that has served me very well. When I bought it, the choice for "good" PCs was either Kuhn or Fagor and I got the Kuhn because of it's size and advanced safety-features (I believe that they were the only ones with spring-loaded valves at the time). Cook's Illustrated recommends the Fagor on a 2005 article but I fail to understand the 2 issues (lack of a locking mechanism and the quick release) they had with the Kuhn. At the same time, buying 2 Fagors for the price of one Kuhn is a plus..

The only small tiny issue with it was finding gaskets for it (the only part I've had to replace on this) and now I can easily find them online. I'm almost certain that I've seen Fagor gaskets and parts at major retailers. Cleaning-wise, the Kuhn is so easy it's ridiculous.

[Jose Nieves]

[It is truly a joy to cook in and, when I don't rotate my pans for photographing I'm always using their Vitavit Premium for my family cooking (that model is only available in Europe right now - don't know if they will be bringing it to the U.S.)

I've been looking around to buy a Vitavit Edition but have been unable to find it online. I'm gonna have to call my sister in Berlin and have her ship me one..

[Jethro]

Hi -

I would recommend to start out using what I have: the Fagor Rapida set. One 4 qt., one 8 qt., a universal pressure lid and glass lid for both, plus a steamer basket. The advantage? A new 6 liter (~6 qt.) Kuhn Rikon Ecomatic is about $100 on Amazon. Or you can get the Fagor set on eBay for the same price: http://cgi.ebay.com/...=item35b132accc




- J

[pazzaglia]

Jethro, your set is beautiful, and well-acessorised!

I would caution on the selection of Fagor models . They make several models with just one pressure setting "high", this includes the Rapida. Only their Duo and Futuro models have two pressure settings. Important if you want to cook anything delicate like veggies, fish or eggs. For stocks, meats, ect. it doesnt matter -- but I'm getting lots of feedback from my readers that they can't make the pressure steamed soft boiled eggs in their pressure cooker because it has only one pressure setting.

Here is the info from Fagor...

Fagor's Economy Model -Rapida:
http://www.fagoramerica.com/cookware/pressure_cookers/rapida_line/rapida_2x1_5_piece_set
"Spring type mechanism with one pressure setting: High (15psi)"

Fagor's Mid-range model -Duo:
http://www.fagoramerica.com/cookware/pressure_cookers/duo_line/duo
"Spring type mechanism with two pressure settings: Low (8psi) and High (15psi)"

Fagor's Premium Model -Futuro (I have this one):
http://www.fagoramerica.com/cookware/pressure_cookers/futuro_line/futuro
"Triple Safety System features dual pressure control valve plus two independent over pressure release valves"

If you want to go with a Fagor, I highly recommend getting a model with two pressure settings!

Ciao,

L

Edited by pazzaglia, 09 April 2011 - 01:04 AM.

[OliverB]

It's unlikely that I'll buy a centrifuge or even an industrial vacsealer anytime soon, but there appear to be recipes using a pressure cooker in Modernist Cuisine, and I've been thinking about getting one for a while. Today at the hardware store I came across this Presto Pressure Canner (and cooker) and started to wonder, if I couldn't get a two in one unit, as I love canning things as well, but don't have a pressure canner, which you need for certain things.

This unit goes up to 15psi, I can't tell if it has different settings or can be set to anything on the scale.

Would this be a purchase that makes sense? It's mostly a canner, but the box says you can use it as a cooker as well. It doesn't go up to the Asian turbo setting of 21psi, but does any pot you can buy here in the US? Do I need that option? I can't tell.

I do like that this unit is big enough to use as a decent size canner, I really don't want to have a canner and a pressure cooker sitting around, there's a limit to how much stuff I can store.

If anybody here has this unit (or a similar one) I'd be curious to hear what you think about it as a cooker, as I'm sure it'll work fine as a canner, being advertised as such. Amazon reviews also indicate a good product and the price is certainly good.

[Emily_R]

I have a presto canner / cooker, that I use for canning salsa and applesauce. If I'm not mistaken, it has an aluminum interior? I personally wouldn't use mine for cooking, as I find the aluminum picks up weird off smells in the canning process, that I wouldn't want to transfer to food I cooked. Not to mention I'd be concerned with cooking anything acidic (with tomatoes) in there...

Emily

[avaserfi]

I just got my Rikon duromatic and am testing it out. I was under the impression that these units are silent unless brought to too high of a pressure. Mine gives off a constant, slight hissing sound (seems to be from the top valve) which I assume is pressure release. Is this normal? I was under the impression that this is not supposed to happen. This hissing starts to occur as soon after the pressure indicator begins to rise and is present regardless of pressure.

Edited by avaserfi, 14 April 2011 - 07:46 PM.

[pazzaglia]

Today at the hardware store I came across this Presto Pressure Canner (and cooker) and started to wonder, if I couldn't get a two in one unit, as I love canning things as well, but don't have a pressure canner, which you need for certain things.

This unit goes up to 15psi, I can't tell if it has different settings or can be set to anything on the scale.

Oliver, as Emily mentioned, this has an aluminum pot base, which is reactive, and should not be used for any recipes including tomatoes, lemons, vinegar or wine. The other two drawbacks are: 1. It has a "giggle" type valve, which operates by giggling (and you have to regulate the giggling from lively to slow - which alot of people can't figure out) which maintains pressure by releasing large amounts of vapor through the giggler. 2. The size seems a little unweildy to be hauling out regularly, using, and cleaning. The product features do not even mention how many pressure settings there are - my guess is one.

After knowing all that, if you still want it, go to the store with a measuring tape -- you may not even have enough width on your stovetop burner or height under the range hood to accommodate it!

Are you a big canner, or is this something you would like to explore?

The best of both worlds, is the Fagor Pressure Cooker/Canner. It is stainless steel, has a spring valve (with the Fagor VERY LITTLE vapor release during operation), dual pressure control, and is a good size to keep with the rest of your pans, or fit the base in the dishwasher which means you'll use it more often.

I just got my Rikon duromatic and am testing it out. I was under the impression that these units are silent unless brought to too high of a pressure. Mine gives off a constant, slight hissing sound (seems to be from the top valve) which I assume is pressure release. Is this normal? I was under the impression that this is not supposed to happen. This hissing starts to occur as soon after the pressure indicator begins to rise and is present regardless of pressure.

No, it is not normal. Constant hissing means that it is operating over-pressure and it is releasing the excess pressure.

Make sure to turn the heat down ALOT after the pan reaches the ring of the desired pressure (just when the ring appears out of the hole). I have a gas stove-top and even the lowest setting is not low enough, I have to turn the handle it past Max to minimize the flame even more. Another trick (especially if you have an electric range), is to simply move the pan over to a smaller burner with less heat. It will take a few recipes to get the hang of it and hit the "sweet spot" of heat that is as low as it can go without loosing pressure (the signal going down) or kicking-in the over pressure safety (release steam that hisses).

Ciao!

L

Edited by pazzaglia, 14 April 2011 - 10:43 PM.

[avaserfi]

I just got my Rikon duromatic and am testing it out. I was under the impression that these units are silent unless brought to too high of a pressure. Mine gives off a constant, slight hissing sound (seems to be from the top valve) which I assume is pressure release. Is this normal? I was under the impression that this is not supposed to happen. This hissing starts to occur as soon after the pressure indicator begins to rise and is present regardless of pressure.

No, it is not normal. Constant hissing means that it is operating over-pressure and it is releasing the excess pressure.

Make sure to turn the heat down ALOT after the pan reaches the ring of the desired pressure (just when the ring appears out of the hole). I have a gas stove-top and even the lowest setting is not low enough, I have to turn the handle it past Max to minimize the flame even more. Another trick (especially if you have an electric range), is to simply move the pan over to a smaller burner with less heat. It will take a few recipes to get the hang of it and hit the "sweet spot" of heat that is as low as it can go without loosing pressure (the signal going down) or kicking-in the over pressure safety (release steam that hisses).

Ciao!

L

I must have a defective unit then. Mine gives off the hiss as soon as the pressure valve starts to rise and never stops. I've had it balanced with just the second barely showing and it still hissed. I will call Kuhn today to work out the problem.

[pazzaglia]

No, it is not normal. Constant hissing means that it is operating over-pressure and it is releasing the excess pressure.

Make sure to turn the heat down ALOT after the pan reaches the ring of the desired pressure (just when the ring appears out of the hole). I have a gas stove-top and even the lowest setting is not low enough, I have to turn the handle it past Max to minimize the flame even more. Another trick (especially if you have an electric range), is to simply move the pan over to a smaller burner with less heat. It will take a few recipes to get the hang of it and hit the "sweet spot" of heat that is as low as it can go without loosing pressure (the signal going down) or kicking-in the over pressure safety (release steam that hisses).

Ciao!

L

I must have a defective unit then. Mine gives off the hiss as soon as the pressure valve starts to rise and never stops. I've had it balanced with just the second barely showing and it still hissed. I will call Kuhn today to work out the problem.

Vapor should exit from the valve right before it begins to build pressure. Then, as the indicator begins to rise, there should not be any more vapor exiting until it has risen too much, and then it begins to exit again. The only other thing I can think it could be would be the pot being filled with liquid beyond the "max" line etched inside the pot.

I hope that Khun Rikon will get you taken care of and pressure cooking, again, soon!

L

[OliverB]

Thanks pazzaglia and others, that's great info! I overlooked the aluminum issue, definitely a no no. I don't can much, well, not at all with pressure so far, but it's something I like to explore. I love making pickles, mostly make the quick ones that need to stay in the fridge, and my fridge is tiny, so something that stores in the pantry makes more sense.

I think I'll put that Fagor on my wishlist, seems to be exactly what I'm looking for, thank you so much!!

Oliver

[Jose Nieves]

I just got my Rikon duromatic and am testing it out. I was under the impression that these units are silent unless brought to too high of a pressure. Mine gives off a constant, slight hissing sound (seems to be from the top valve) which I assume is pressure release. Is this normal? I was under the impression that this is not supposed to happen. This hissing starts to occur as soon after the pressure indicator begins to rise and is present regardless of pressure.

No, it is not normal. Constant hissing means that it is operating over-pressure and it is releasing the excess pressure.

Make sure to turn the heat down ALOT after the pan reaches the ring of the desired pressure (just when the ring appears out of the hole). I have a gas stove-top and even the lowest setting is not low enough, I have to turn the handle it past Max to minimize the flame even more. Another trick (especially if you have an electric range), is to simply move the pan over to a smaller burner with less heat. It will take a few recipes to get the hang of it and hit the "sweet spot" of heat that is as low as it can go without loosing pressure (the signal going down) or kicking-in the over pressure safety (release steam that hisses).

Ciao!

L

I must have a defective unit then. Mine gives off the hiss as soon as the pressure valve starts to rise and never stops. I've had it balanced with just the second barely showing and it still hissed. I will call Kuhn today to work out the problem.

Have you given the valve a looksie? Mine gets stuck ever so often even though I clean it quite regularly. A little twist or pull when it's starting to build pressure and it's back to normal.

[Jose Nieves]

I just did medium boiled eggs using Laura's recommendations and was very impressed on how easy it was to peel my fresh (still warm from Ms. Cluck Cluck) eggs.

[pazzaglia]

I just did medium boiled eggs using Laura's recommendations and was very impressed on how easy it was to peel my fresh (still warm from Ms. Cluck Cluck) eggs.

Where is the "yaay!" button? I enjoy hearing about successes (and failures, too)!

Here is the link again, for anyone who is interested...

Soft, Medium & Hard Boiled Eggs in the Pressure Cooker-my recipe ode to Modernist Cuisine

Ciao,

L

[Todd in Chicago]

I just got my Rikon duromatic and am testing it out. I was under the impression that these units are silent unless brought to too high of a pressure. Mine gives off a constant, slight hissing sound (seems to be from the top valve) which I assume is pressure release. Is this normal? I was under the impression that this is not supposed to happen. This hissing starts to occur as soon after the pressure indicator begins to rise and is present regardless of pressure.

Hi there Avaserfi...

I just picked up a Kuhn Rikon Duromatic today and made the carrot soup as presented in "Modernist Cuisine". I've never used a pressure cooker before so was a bit cautious. I must say mine worked flawlessly. I had the pressure cooker on a burner smaller than the circumfrence of the cooker and on my gas stove around med-high. Once the top "popped up" and went to the second ring, I immediately lowered the heat to almost as low as it would go to see if I would lose pressure - I didn't, so I put it on as low as it would go. The pressure remained steady at the second ring for the entire cooking time (50) minutes. No sound at all - virtually silent.

BTW....the carrot soup was outta this world!

Todd in Chicago

[JBailey]

Todd

Did Northwestern have a second one on the shelf? Like you, I have been cautious and conservative about that particular piece of equipment having heard too many tales from years ago about 'pressure cooker painted' ceilings as I wrote elsehwere. Maybe now is the time to invest in a pressure cooker.

[avaserfi]

I just got my Rikon duromatic and am testing it out. I was under the impression that these units are silent unless brought to too high of a pressure. Mine gives off a constant, slight hissing sound (seems to be from the top valve) which I assume is pressure release. Is this normal? I was under the impression that this is not supposed to happen. This hissing starts to occur as soon after the pressure indicator begins to rise and is present regardless of pressure.

No, it is not normal. Constant hissing means that it is operating over-pressure and it is releasing the excess pressure.

Make sure to turn the heat down ALOT after the pan reaches the ring of the desired pressure (just when the ring appears out of the hole). I have a gas stove-top and even the lowest setting is not low enough, I have to turn the handle it past Max to minimize the flame even more. Another trick (especially if you have an electric range), is to simply move the pan over to a smaller burner with less heat. It will take a few recipes to get the hang of it and hit the "sweet spot" of heat that is as low as it can go without loosing pressure (the signal going down) or kicking-in the over pressure safety (release steam that hisses).

Ciao!

L

I must have a defective unit then. Mine gives off the hiss as soon as the pressure valve starts to rise and never stops. I've had it balanced with just the second barely showing and it still hissed. I will call Kuhn today to work out the problem.

Have you given the valve a looksie? Mine gets stuck ever so often even though I clean it quite regularly. A little twist or pull when it's starting to build pressure and it's back to normal.

I pulled the valve apart and everything looks fine from the little I know about pressure cookers. I did try pushing and pulling the indicator while it was on, but that didn't seem to help in the long term. The hissing would stop temporarily and start up again.

I just got my Rikon duromatic and am testing it out. I was under the impression that these units are silent unless brought to too high of a pressure. Mine gives off a constant, slight hissing sound (seems to be from the top valve) which I assume is pressure release. Is this normal? I was under the impression that this is not supposed to happen. This hissing starts to occur as soon after the pressure indicator begins to rise and is present regardless of pressure.

Hi there Avaserfi...

I just picked up a Kuhn Rikon Duromatic today and made the carrot soup as presented in "Modernist Cuisine". I've never used a pressure cooker before so was a bit cautious. I must say mine worked flawlessly. I had the pressure cooker on a burner smaller than the circumfrence of the cooker and on my gas stove around med-high. Once the top "popped up" and went to the second ring, I immediately lowered the heat to almost as low as it would go to see if I would lose pressure - I didn't, so I put it on as low as it would go. The pressure remained steady at the second ring for the entire cooking time (50) minutes. No sound at all - virtually silent.

BTW....the carrot soup was outta this world!

Todd in Chicago

Thanks for letting me know. It sounds like I got a defective unit. The problem is being taken care of. Soon I should have a fully operational cooker!

[JBailey]

I just happened to look at Carol Blymire's Alinea at Home. She is making a truffle stock that requires the use of a pressure cooker. Carol Blymire has managed to create a very successful 'using a pressure cooker' tutorial. Maybe I now have a bit more confidence to buy one and try using it with the great visuals she has shared.

[Todd in Chicago]

Todd

Did Northwestern have a second one on the shelf? Like you, I have been cautious and conservative about that particular piece of equipment having heard too many tales from years ago about 'pressure cooker painted' ceilings as I wrote elsehwere. Maybe now is the time to invest in a pressure cooker.

JBailey...

Yes they did! They had one more on the shelf, $223 - they also had the 5 quart one which was $189 or $199. I was pretty surprised to find the price on line with Amazon as it usually seems most things on Amazon are able to be had for at least a bit cheaper. A little off topic but I first walked in I saw a Kikuchi 9.5 inch sushi knife on sale for $149 and was almost going to get that before I saw the pressure cooker. I needed to make a decision between the knife and the cooker and of course I realized that I really LIKED the knife but don't really NEED the knife...so the pressure cooker was more or less a no-brainer. ;-)

Todd in Chicago

[Todd in Chicago]

I just happened to look at Carol Blymire's Alinea at Home. She is making a truffle stock that requires the use of a pressure cooker. Carol Blymire has managed to create a very successful 'using a pressure cooker' tutorial. Maybe I now have a bit more confidence to buy one and try using it with the great visuals she has shared.

JBailey...

Thanks for that link. I must say I had visions of exploding pots as well, and let me tell you I was VERY cautious when twisting the handles to "free" the lid from the cooker. After my first attempt at using this, it really helped put those feelings back in check. Obviously one needs to take the proper precautions, but pressure cookers have been used for many years and the advances in the technology now are very good. This does not mean an accident cannot happen, but if you use common sense and follow the directions, I think these can be very safe. I can't wait to try more recipes using this device. Tonight though, pork chops sousvide (pork from "The Butcher and the Larder" on Milwaukee). Big thick inch and half chops, as they said "the hog was walking around on Monday, had a bad day on Tuesday, and was in the shop on Wednesday".

Cheers...

Todd in Chicago

[avaserfi]

I just got around to testing my replacement cooker today. It seems better than the first and I'm probably being over vigilante, but at pressure there is a very subtle hiss and occasionally vapor is visible on the steam guard. According to Kuhn, this is normal operation.

Below are two pictures, showing the pressure settings I used when testing for any hiss - it was present in both. Also linked is an out of focus video, but you can hear the hiss in it and see the wisp of vapor I am talking about (around 4-5 seconds on). I am under the impression that the first photo is the proper setting for pressure, but I tried both.







So am I being crazy or is this normal?

[Todd in Chicago]

I just got around to testing my replacement cooker today. It seems better than the first and I'm probably being over vigilante, but at pressure there is a very subtle hiss and occasionally vapor is visible on the steam guard. According to Kuhn, this is normal operation.

Below are two pictures, showing the pressure settings I used when testing for any hiss - it was present in both. Also linked is an out of focus video, but you can hear the hiss in it and see the wisp of vapor I am talking about (around 4-5 seconds on). I am under the impression that the first photo is the proper setting for pressure, but I tried both.







So am I being crazy or is this normal?

Avaserfi.....

I thought we had the same models, but I guess I was mistaken. Yours looks differnt than mine. My top is like this (this is my model actually): http://www.sears.com...=21-107544885-2

I could swear that when I made the carrot soup, it was virtually silent. So unfortunately since we have different models I cannot tell you if that is normal, but I would guess if Kuhn says it is....than...

Todd in Chicago

Todd in Chicago

[AaronM]

Had to order a new seal ring for the used Fissler set I got.

Apparently someone had cooked Indian in it and the curry scent is pretty powerful.