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Sous Vide: Recipes, Techniques & Equipment (Part 8)

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#31 Montreal

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Posted 12 November 2010 - 08:39 PM

Another puzzle.

So far all my test were on red meat. I tried some scallops at 49 Celcius... They were awfull.

Any recommendation


Tks

#32 nickrey

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Posted 12 November 2010 - 09:59 PM

Scallops cook so quickly and the searing gives such a nice caramelization I don't think I'd even want to sous vide them.

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#33 e_monster

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Posted 12 November 2010 - 10:04 PM

Scallops cook so quickly and the searing gives such a nice caramelization I don't think I'd even want to sous vide them.


Agreed.

#34 Montreal

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Posted 13 November 2010 - 05:29 PM

Yup... Actually I think so too. I also did some Red Deer 1 cm thick loin and they were so awsome seared that I dont think that it was worth it to sous vide.

Thaks for the reply

#35 MartinH

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Posted 14 November 2010 - 10:02 PM

I've been experimenting with SV custards of various kinds, that is egg-thickened creams such as crème brûlée, crème anglaise, cheesecake, pumpkin pie, and even eggnog.

A few things I've learned:

SV is an excellent method for cooking custards. While custards thicken when the egg proteins in the mix are heated, they curdle when the egg protein is overheated. Traditional methods to prevent curdling include preheating the milk, stirring, adding flour, or placing ramekins in a waterbath in the oven. But SV is much more accurate, more dependable, and far easier.

Preparing the mix couldn't be simpler. Its just a matter of combining the basic ingredients: egg, liquid, sugar, salt, and flavoring. The liquid can be milk, cream, coconut milk, cream cheese (for a chesecake) or variations and combinations thereof.

Ratios vary. An eggnog would be about 1 egg to 1 pint of liquid. A soft custard (English-style custard or crème anglaise) would have about 1 egg to 1 cup of liquid. Firmer custards would have a greater proportion of eggs. Either whole eggs or yolks can be used. Yolks add a little more color and richness, but do not have greater thickening capacity.

Some flavorings appear to work better than others in SV conditions. Vanilla is superb. But strong flavors such as citrus zest (often used in cheesecake recipes) or pungent spices (as in pumpkin pie filling) can be too harsh. Strong flavorings can be toned down by precooking, then cooling and adding to the custard mix.

A temp of ~83C/181F does the trick. Interestingly, this is higher than the ~64C/147F at which egg yolks set; diluted eggs in need a higher temp for their proteins to coagulate.

SV cheesecake or pumpkin pie clearly depart most from the traditional method, since the crust and the filling must be cooked separately. But the traditional method often produces a dry, cracked, hard product. SV cheesecake or pumpkin pie is much more creamy, soft, and delicate. A modernistic cheesecake sprinkled with cookie crumbs, or a new pumpkin pie garnished with a wedge of pastry can be fun.

Since vacuum sealers do not work well with liquids, custards can be cooked in ziploc bags or in small mason jars.

I'd be interested in hearing what anyone else has discovered in this area.

#36 ermintrude

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Posted 14 November 2010 - 11:15 PM

Doing them Sous Vide will work but seems over kill when tey can be done just as well on a hob, with good control and stirring. Or use a thermomix or the new kenwood if you want to do custards etc, with no attention they are perfect for that.
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#37 Chris Birkett

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Posted 14 November 2010 - 11:54 PM

I'm planning to order one of the SousVide Supreme units in the next couple days. They have a special right now where you get their vacuum sealer with the SVS for only $20 extra. I'm kind of concerned about how basic this model is, missing features like pulsed vacuuming or multiple speeds. I recall reading earlier in the thread that you really want a fully-featured sealer for sous vide.

Should I even be considering the vac sealer they carry, cheap or not? The alternative would probably be something like the Foodsaver V2490, which is also fairly cheap but more fully-featured.

#38 Chris Amirault

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 09:20 AM

Hi Chris! I have to say that I've been happy with my FoodSaver (click here for information) and think that there's no need for a home user to upgrade to anything much more than that.

MartinH, thanks for that write-up. It's extremely useful.

What Nick wrote above is my procedure for those juices when I'm feeling virtuous. More often than not, however, my "sauce" isn't classical French but is a quick rustic one with sautéed onions or tomato sauce. So I just fine strain the contents of the bag, push the stuff in the strainer through the mesh, and add the stuff all at once into whatever sauce base I'm making. I'll also add that LTLT-cooked proteins with a lot of collagen in them -- skin, bones, tendons -- have thickening properties that mean that you can skip the cornstarch etc.
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#39 gfweb

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 09:30 AM

I'm planning to order one of the SousVide Supreme units in the next couple days. They have a special right now where you get their vacuum sealer with the SVS for only $20 extra. I'm kind of concerned about how basic this model is, missing features like pulsed vacuuming or multiple speeds. I recall reading earlier in the thread that you really want a fully-featured sealer for sous vide.

Should I even be considering the vac sealer they carry, cheap or not? The alternative would probably be something like the Foodsaver V2490, which is also fairly cheap but more fully-featured.



I have a SVS and have quit on using a vacuum sealer for routine stuff. Careful expulsion of air from a normal zip lock bag (either by rolling or immersing in water and sealing the zip lock) has worked fine.

#40 Chris Amirault

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 09:39 AM

Dave Arnold over at CookingIssues.com likes the ziploks too.
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#41 MartinH

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 11:51 AM

Doing them Sous Vide will work but seems over kill when tey can be done just as well on a hob, with good control and stirring. Or use a thermomix or the new kenwood if you want to do custards etc, with no attention they are perfect for that.


Far from being overkill, I find it easier to do a custard (defined broadly) by the SV method rather than in the traditional ways on the stove top or in the oven. Wouldn't it be overkill to purchase a thermomix or a new kenwood for this when a SV set up does the job just fine?

May I add that SV more generally is not unnecessary, not overkill, not more than is needed to do the job for the simple reason that it is often the best way to do the job.

#42 therippa

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 12:26 PM


Doing them Sous Vide will work but seems over kill when tey can be done just as well on a hob, with good control and stirring. Or use a thermomix or the new kenwood if you want to do custards etc, with no attention they are perfect for that.


Far from being overkill, I find it easier to do a custard (defined broadly) by the SV method rather than in the traditional ways on the stove top or in the oven. Wouldn't it be overkill to purchase a thermomix or a new kenwood for this when a SV set up does the job just fine?

May I add that SV more generally is not unnecessary, not overkill, not more than is needed to do the job for the simple reason that it is often the best way to do the job.


I sv'd custard once for ice cream, and it was the best batch of ice cream I've ever made. Only complaint is how the bag fills with air unless you have a chamber vacuum...what would be handy are bags with one way valves so the air can escape, but I think that'd be overkill :smile:

#43 FoodMan

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 01:40 PM



Doing them Sous Vide will work but seems over kill when tey can be done just as well on a hob, with good control and stirring. Or use a thermomix or the new kenwood if you want to do custards etc, with no attention they are perfect for that.


Far from being overkill, I find it easier to do a custard (defined broadly) by the SV method rather than in the traditional ways on the stove top or in the oven. Wouldn't it be overkill to purchase a thermomix or a new kenwood for this when a SV set up does the job just fine?

May I add that SV more generally is not unnecessary, not overkill, not more than is needed to do the job for the simple reason that it is often the best way to do the job.


I sv'd custard once for ice cream, and it was the best batch of ice cream I've ever made. Only complaint is how the bag fills with air unless you have a chamber vacuum...what would be handy are bags with one way valves so the air can escape, but I think that'd be overkill :smile:


Yeap. Certainly not overkill! I have not made ice cream custard base on the stove top in a long time. SV is just ideal. I use the Pulse feature to get more or less a perfect air-free seal using the FoodSaver and I cook at about 82 C per the instructions in Under Pressure. I think my favorite part, in addition to how simple the whole thing is, is that the sealed bag is not pasteurized and can rest in the fridge for quiet some time until I am ready to churn.

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#44 FoodMan

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 01:42 PM

I am looking to cook some quinces and am wondering what the consensus for timing would be. I think about 85C is fine for temp, but quince is hard and am not sure if I should go for a couple of hours or more. Ideas?

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#45 Chris Birkett

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 01:59 PM

Hi Chris! I have to say that I've been happy with my FoodSaver (click here for information) and think that there's no need for a home user to upgrade to anything much more than that.


I'm wondering more specifically whether the SVS vac sealer is so basic that it's not worth considering, even cheaply, instead of a basic Foodsaver unit that's more expensive. I will definitely be trying out the Ziploc bag technique, but I don't want to pay extra for a vac sealer that's a waste of money, and I have to decide up front since I live in Canada (shipping is $80 per order). It seems like a lot of people use the pulse feature on their Foodsavers, which the SVS model doesn't have. I am happy to spend a bit extra on a Foodsaver if it's more useful for sous vide.

#46 FoodMan

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 02:10 PM


Hi Chris! I have to say that I've been happy with my FoodSaver (click here for information) and think that there's no need for a home user to upgrade to anything much more than that.


I'm wondering more specifically whether the SVS vac sealer is so basic that it's not worth considering, even cheaply, instead of a basic Foodsaver unit that's more expensive. I will definitely be trying out the Ziploc bag technique, but I don't want to pay extra for a vac sealer that's a waste of money, and I have to decide up front since I live in Canada (shipping is $80 per order). It seems like a lot of people use the pulse feature on their Foodsavers, which the SVS model doesn't have. I am happy to spend a bit extra on a Foodsaver if it's more useful for sous vide.

My suggestion is to skip theirs and either just use Ziploc bags or spend the extra cash on a better FoodSaver with Pulse. I use that Pulse feature 99% of the time honestly because even "dry" items will still leach liquid once you push that "Vaccum" button.

E. Nassar
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#47 therippa

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 02:56 PM




Doing them Sous Vide will work but seems over kill when tey can be done just as well on a hob, with good control and stirring. Or use a thermomix or the new kenwood if you want to do custards etc, with no attention they are perfect for that.


Far from being overkill, I find it easier to do a custard (defined broadly) by the SV method rather than in the traditional ways on the stove top or in the oven. Wouldn't it be overkill to purchase a thermomix or a new kenwood for this when a SV set up does the job just fine?

May I add that SV more generally is not unnecessary, not overkill, not more than is needed to do the job for the simple reason that it is often the best way to do the job.


I sv'd custard once for ice cream, and it was the best batch of ice cream I've ever made. Only complaint is how the bag fills with air unless you have a chamber vacuum...what would be handy are bags with one way valves so the air can escape, but I think that'd be overkill :smile:


Yeap. Certainly not overkill! I have not made ice cream custard base on the stove top in a long time. SV is just ideal. I use the Pulse feature to get more or less a perfect air-free seal using the FoodSaver and I cook at about 82 C per the instructions in Under Pressure. I think my favorite part, in addition to how simple the whole thing is, is that the sealed bag is not pasteurized and can rest in the fridge for quiet some time until I am ready to churn.


I was talking more about how the bag fills with air while you SV it...I released it twice, was afraid it wouldn't cook evenly if I didn't since it displaced so much space.

#48 alanjesq

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 06:11 PM

Does Hollendaise sauce = custard?? Anyone tried to make SV???

#49 Paul McMichael

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 06:48 PM





Doing them Sous Vide will work but seems over kill when tey can be done just as well on a hob, with good control and stirring. Or use a thermomix or the new kenwood if you want to do custards etc, with no attention they are perfect for that.


Far from being overkill, I find it easier to do a custard (defined broadly) by the SV method rather than in the traditional ways on the stove top or in the oven. Wouldn't it be overkill to purchase a thermomix or a new kenwood for this when a SV set up does the job just fine?

May I add that SV more generally is not unnecessary, not overkill, not more than is needed to do the job for the simple reason that it is often the best way to do the job.


I sv'd custard once for ice cream, and it was the best batch of ice cream I've ever made. Only complaint is how the bag fills with air unless you have a chamber vacuum...what would be handy are bags with one way valves so the air can escape, but I think that'd be overkill :smile:


Yeap. Certainly not overkill! I have not made ice cream custard base on the stove top in a long time. SV is just ideal. I use the Pulse feature to get more or less a perfect air-free seal using the FoodSaver and I cook at about 82 C per the instructions in Under Pressure. I think my favorite part, in addition to how simple the whole thing is, is that the sealed bag is not pasteurized and can rest in the fridge for quiet some time until I am ready to churn.


I was talking more about how the bag fills with air while you SV it...I released it twice, was afraid it wouldn't cook evenly if I didn't since it displaced so much space.


I have been using the SV water bath as a heat source for ice cream base for the last few months - works great. I messed with bags just once. I now use a quart jar with a plastic storage cap. Simple and easy. After the custard thickens (about an hour) the jar can go into an ice bath if I am in a hurry or just into the fridge to churn the next day.

#50 MartinH

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 07:47 PM

Does Hollendaise sauce = custard?? Anyone tried to make SV???


A "quasi-custard" perhaps? It is similar to a custard being egg-thickened, but water-based rather than milk-based. I haven't tried it SV, but I can think of two different ways to do it. Either cook the egg+liquid then whisk in the butter; or, slightly warm the egg+liquid enough to blend in the butter and then cook. No idea if either works.

#51 ScottyBoy

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Posted 16 November 2010 - 12:29 AM

Hollandaise is an emulsification. I wouldn't think SV would have any use in making that sauce.
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#52 Corymoto

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Posted 16 November 2010 - 12:13 PM

FYI - The Modernist Cuisine website has an 'about the book' pdf file that has a recipe for Sous Vide Instant Hollandaise. I made it about a week ago, worked very well, pretty foolproof. Here's a link.

#53 epicureanrebel

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Posted 16 November 2010 - 12:55 PM

my thoughts exactly but it only uses sv to cook the egg with the wine reduction, then removing it and blending in butter as usual. So i think its could work i'm going to try it, the book it comes from is very interesting and with a $625 dollar list price with recipes from Grant Achatz and some of the other great food scientist, it looks promising gonna try it wednsday i will post pics and recipe we will see how it gos.

#54 HiRoller

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Posted 17 November 2010 - 11:55 AM

Curious to know how our experts would handle this...

It looks like I'll have more guests than expected for Thanksgiving. Keeping with tradition, I'll be doing a fried turkey. Can't go with a larger turkey because of the limitations of the fryer, so I thought I'd do some extra turkey legs on the side. I love SV'd turkey legs. But the wife wants them to have crispy skin. Turkey legs come out of the bag so moist that frying the legs directly afterwards would be difficult, if not dangerous. Not sure that merely patting them dry would be enough. I could SV them the day before, let them dry out in the fridge and then throw them in the fryer the next day until they come up to temperature, but I'm not sure that they wouldn't be overcooked in the fry process. Any thoughts?

TIA.

#55 therippa

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Posted 17 November 2010 - 12:26 PM

Since the meat will be cold from being refrigerated overnight, I would put them in a warm oven until the meat comes up to plating temperature, then throw them in the fryer. They'd only need a couple of minutes and wouldn't (shouldn't) overcook.

Just curious, what temp are you doing the legs at? If you're doing it confit style (176F), you won't have to really worry about it overcooking anyway.

edit: readability

Edited by therippa, 17 November 2010 - 12:47 PM.


#56 HiRoller

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Posted 17 November 2010 - 02:04 PM

I will be cooking them for 10-12 hrs at 180F. I'm not worry about overcooking during the SV portion, but overcooking while bringing it up to temp in the fryer. Your suggestion would resolve that - assuming that warming doesn't bring juices back to the surface...

#57 therippa

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Posted 17 November 2010 - 02:23 PM

I will be cooking them for 10-12 hrs at 180F. I'm not worry about overcooking during the SV portion, but overcooking while bringing it up to temp in the fryer. Your suggestion would resolve that - assuming that warming doesn't bring juices back to the surface...


Even if juices come to the surface, most of it would be fat which would just meld with the fat in the fryer. I think your legs will turn out crispy as hell :)

#58 Paul Kierstead

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Posted 17 November 2010 - 03:02 PM

FYI - The Modernist Cuisine website has an 'about the book' pdf file that has a recipe for Sous Vide Instant Hollandaise. I made it about a week ago, worked very well, pretty foolproof. Here's a link.


I'm very interested in your results. Looking at another's results, I wonder if you had the same 'foam' outcome ... the recipe calls for a siphon (I presume a soda siphon?) and the blogger used a "whip" which I am guessing is a whipped cream dispenser, which is quite likely a different outcome? I have no idea about these devices.

Was yours foamy?

#59 PedroG

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Posted 17 November 2010 - 06:54 PM

HiRoller,
did you read the turkey throw down ?
Maybe a blowtorch instead of a broiler would do the job as well.
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#60 Montreal

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Posted 17 November 2010 - 06:56 PM

I have now a shoulder pork roast in the 59.5 C bath for the last 27 hours. The temp in the center has been at 59.5 c for several hours.

The amount of callogen transforming is incredible.. It seem that the piece is actually melting. Is there a rule on how many hours I should let it sit at that temp ?

It seems to be a consensus on ribs at 48 hours

Tks in advance for your help





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