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Sous Vide: Recipes, Techniques & Equipment (Part 8)

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#391 FeChef

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Posted 10 February 2013 - 09:16 AM

Mmmmm. I have a SideKIC with a pump that just stopped working. Duncan is sending out a new one and was very quick to respond but makes me wonder if these home based units are built well enough to provide years of service. Is that an unrealistic expectation?


I built my own SV setup so i cant comment on the SideKIC but i can tell you from experience that over time plastics will degrade from prolonged high temps. Also any metal that is not Stainless steel will either rust or degrade aswell. Even if the metal doesnt submerge in the water bath the steam rising will get in and cause it to rust. An example of metal degrading is aluminum. I had to make a bracket out of aluminum 1/4 inch aluminum strip and even though aluminum doesnt rust, I started to get calcium build up on it within one 24 hour session. The calcium clings to it like a magnet would to metal. After brushing off all the calcium, there was pits in the aluminum bracket. I probably wont get much more use out of the bracket and will have to special order some 1/4 strip in stainless steel for long term use.

#392 rotuts

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Posted 10 February 2013 - 10:33 AM

if the aluminum is readily available and much easer to bend, why not do this experiment: put several coats of enamel on it and then use it. Hot Pink might be Best! :cool:

#393 FeChef

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Posted 10 February 2013 - 11:03 AM

Even if i trusted the enamel to be food grade safe, im pretty sure it would chip off when fastening the pump and heating element onto the bracket. But yeah your right hot pink would probably produce the best results. :raz:

#394 Reignking

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Posted 12 February 2013 - 02:51 PM

I never buy frozen fish, but I just read a tidbit in Michael Chiarello's Bottega cookbook about slacking, or slowly thawing out frozen fish in the refrigerator over three days. I've never considered buying frozen fish, but I need to -- for convenience's sake and just getting more fish into my diet.

My SV question -- if you bought pre-vacuum-packed frozen fish, would you thaw it for three days, and then SV it? Or thaw, drain, re-seal? Or just go straight to the SV?

#395 rotuts

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Posted 12 February 2013 - 03:01 PM

First of all not all frozen fish is the same.

Ive been very happy with some frozen fish from trader joe's, paying careful attention to the plastic wrapper to make sure there had not been a pinhole leak that let are into it: easy to tell: frost and a non air tight fitting.

not that this is Gospel: I take out the frozen fish, use my seasoning and the re-bag and SV

#396 FeChef

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Posted 12 February 2013 - 06:20 PM

My SV question -- if you bought pre-vacuum-packed frozen fish, would you thaw it for three days, and then SV it? Or thaw, drain, re-seal? Or just go straight to the SV?


Im sure others will disagree, or say im being to cautious, but I always thaw meats/poultry,fish in a bucket of cold water for 30 min per pound to thaw, then i SV. Its the safest way to thaw and cook.

#397 Joe Blowe

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Posted 12 February 2013 - 06:34 PM

Im sure others will disagree, or say im being to cautious, but I always thaw meats/poultry,fish in a bucket of cold water for 30 min per pound to thaw, then i SV. Its the safest way to thaw and cook.

Hi there, I disagree and say you're being too cautious :laugh:

As I requoted here -- http://egullet.org/p1907543 -- it seems perfectly safe and prudent to cook items from a frozen state.

Do you have any published information to the contrary?
So we finish the eighteenth and he's gonna stiff me. And I say, "Hey, Lama, hey, how about a little something, you know, for the effort, you know." And he says, "Oh, uh, there won't be any money. But when you die, on your deathbed, you will receive total consciousness."

So I got that goin' for me, which is nice.

#398 FeChef

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Posted 12 February 2013 - 08:50 PM

Im sure others will disagree, or say im being to cautious, but I always thaw meats/poultry,fish in a bucket of cold water for 30 min per pound to thaw, then i SV. Its the safest way to thaw and cook.

Hi there, I disagree and say you're being too cautious :laugh:

As I requoted here -- http://egullet.org/p1907543 -- it seems perfectly safe and prudent to cook items from a frozen state.

Do you have any published information to the contrary?


No i must have not got the memo that stated i needed published information to have an opinion :raz:

But If your so confident on cooking straight from frozen, im sure you wouldnt mind cooking a frozen 3" chuck roast to 131F from frozen for 24 hours. Let me know how it turns out.

#399 Paul Kierstead

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Posted 12 February 2013 - 09:23 PM

There is chuck roast fish now? Freaky!

#400 DouglasBaldwin

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Posted 12 February 2013 - 10:12 PM

From a food safety perspective, there is nothing wrong with cooking from frozen. In fact, many food scientists recommend cooking from frozen; for example, O. Peter Snyder --- a food scientist I respect a lot --- recommends cooking your holiday turkey in the oven from frozen at http://www.hi-tm.com...cook-frozen.pdf . (Something most people are aghast to hear.)

Some believe that the is a noticeable difference in texture, when cooking sous vide, between thawed and frozen; but I'm skeptical about this. Perhaps someone on here will do a blind taste test to find out. Either way, this is a taste and not a safety issue.
My Guide: A Practical Guide to Sous Vide Cooking, which Harold McGee described as "a wonderful contribution."
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#401 Merkinz

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Posted 13 February 2013 - 12:33 AM

Anyway, anyone have any recommended times & temps for pork belly? Specifically for a traditional braised texture that will then be portioned then deep fried.

Thanks


anyone? :wacko:

#402 rotuts

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Posted 13 February 2013 - 06:07 AM

if 'braise' means well done:

Baldwin says:

Well, slow: 160 x 24

Well quick: 175 8 - 12

best of luck!

#403 jmasur

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Posted 13 February 2013 - 06:40 AM

I'll try to take a picture soon. FWIW, the heating element is a Marshalltown 742G 1000w bucket heater, attached at about a 45-degree angle, and the circulator is a Hydor Koralia 240gph aquarium pump, positioned at the aperture of the bucket heater, pointing down the barrel of the protective sleeve. I sorta wished I'd gone with the 425gph, but it seems to work fine.


Pictures attached as promised -- one mounted in the cooler, the other removed and sitting on top. In the mounted one, you can see the grooves I melted in with a soldering iron for the cords, most easily, to the left of the cord for the circulator. (The discoloration on the cooler above the bracket is duck tape residue.) I drained the cooler partially before taking the picture.

Also any metal that is not Stainless steel will either rust or degrade aswell. Even if the metal doesnt submerge in the water bath the steam rising will get in and cause it to rust. An example of metal degrading is aluminum. I had to make a bracket out of aluminum 1/4 inch aluminum strip and even though aluminum doesnt rust, I started to get calcium build up on it within one 24 hour session. The calcium clings to it like a magnet would to metal. After brushing off all the calcium, there was pits in the aluminum bracket. I probably wont get much more use out of the bracket and will have to special order some 1/4 strip in stainless steel for long term use.

It doesn't show well in the pictures, but my aluminum mounting bracket is getting what appears to be calcium or other mineral buildup as well. (I keep this setup in a house in the mountains, where the water supply is probably similar to bottled spring water.) I don't think it's dangerous, and it's not like the setup is a work of art, Eventually, I'll probably replace with stainless.

Attached Images

  • 2013-02-10 06.46.15.jpg
  • 2013-02-10 06.47.36.jpg


#404 rotuts

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Posted 13 February 2013 - 06:57 AM

has heat ever caused this pump to fail? what temps and times do you use?

does the upper part of the bracket fit into the side of the cooler? Im at work thinking about my newer "cooler extreme" set up Ill need some day once my Early generation FMM completely rusts out. Its my understanding that the current FMM is stainless steel.

#405 jmasur

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Posted 13 February 2013 - 07:06 AM

If you look at the mounted picture (the first one), you'll see that there are extruded ribs to either side of the bracket. There's a third between them, obscured by the bracket itself. Basically, the bracket grabs onto that.

I have not experienced a pump failure, but I only set this up a couple of months ago. My most extreme temperature uses have been with potatoes, which I've cooked at up to 185F for up to a couple of hours. My most extreme time use has been short ribs at 132F for 68 hours (I would've done 72, but started the cook at 10pm and had guests at 6pm three days later).

#406 paulpegg

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Posted 13 February 2013 - 08:20 AM

I have posted this a number of times but here it is again. http://lesmarmitonsn...s-vide-cook.pdf i built this setup in 2010 and have been using it constantly ever since. Read the addendum a the end for info on pumps.

Best,

Paul
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#407 FeChef

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Posted 13 February 2013 - 08:21 AM

I have posted this a number of times but here it is again. http://lesmarmitonsn...s-vide-cook.pdf i built this setup in 2010 and have been using it constantly ever since. Read the addendum a the end for info on pumps.

Best,

Paul

404 not found.

#408 rotuts

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Posted 13 February 2013 - 08:47 AM

Im also interested in the .pdf many thanks!

#409 Reignking

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Posted 13 February 2013 - 09:58 AM


My SV question -- if you bought pre-vacuum-packed frozen fish, would you thaw it for three days, and then SV it? Or thaw, drain, re-seal? Or just go straight to the SV?


Im sure others will disagree, or say im being to cautious, but I always thaw meats/poultry,fish in a bucket of cold water for 30 min per pound to thaw, then i SV. Its the safest way to thaw and cook.


I'm concerned about the quality, though, in the thawing process.

#410 paulpegg

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Posted 13 February 2013 - 10:39 AM

I have posted this a number of times but here it is again. http://lesmarmitonsn...vide-cooker.pdf i built this setup in 2010 and have been using it constantly ever since. Read the addendum a the end for info on pumps.

Best,

Paul


Sorry, the link was misspelled. Try it now.
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Les Marmitons of New Jersey

#411 FeChef

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Posted 13 February 2013 - 11:09 AM


I have posted this a number of times but here it is again. http://lesmarmitonsn...vide-cooker.pdf i built this setup in 2010 and have been using it constantly ever since. Read the addendum a the end for info on pumps.

Best,

Paul


Sorry, the link was misspelled. Try it now.


Thanks. I used the same project box from radioshack for my pid controller but mounted mine in a different location. I like how you used a temp probe clip to mount the pid controller probe. Didnt think of that, thanks.

#412 PedroG

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Posted 13 February 2013 - 05:33 PM


I have posted this a number of times but here it is again. lesmarmitonsn...s-vide-cook.pdf i built this setup in 2010 and have been using it constantly ever since. Read the addendum a the end for info on pumps.

Best,

Paul

404 not found.

Here is the correct link: www.lesmarmitonsnj.com/sous-vide-cooker.pdf
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#413 Todd in Chicago

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Posted 18 February 2013 - 07:27 PM

PedroG....

Thanks for the temp/time as in http://egullet.org/p1898461 , had those on Saturday night and they were indeed as succulent as you have said!  Thanks for the temp/time combination you posted on eGullent and on modernist cooking db - 03:30 @ 55.0°C / 131°F.  I COMPLETELY agree with you, a reproducible success!

PedroG style (temp/time) lamb chops with a demi-glace wine reduction, golden beets with blue goat cheese, and vadouvan curry carrots.  A great Sat night meal!

Thanks PedroG!

Todd in Chicago

Attached Images

  • Lamb-chops.jpg


#414 PedroG

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Posted 19 February 2013 - 04:09 AM

Yum-yum! Looks delicious!


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#415 rotuts

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Posted 19 February 2013 - 05:13 AM

you sure can say that again.  Trader Joses has some stunning frozen racks  (From Canada, no less)  that would work perfect for this!



#416 scubadoo97

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Posted 19 February 2013 - 06:16 AM

That lamb looks wonderful. Can't wait to get my replacement SideKIC to try this

#417 paulpegg

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Posted 19 February 2013 - 07:38 AM

That lamb looks wonderful. Can't wait to get my replacement SideKIC to try this

Yes it does. Here is my version that I did for Valentine's dinner. i used a New Zealand rack from Restaurant Depot. The rack was given a dose of salt, pepper and garlic powder, bagged,  SV at 53C for 3 hours, then seared, coated with honey and mustard and herbed bread crumbs per Thomas Keller's Ad Hoc at Home and finished for 10 minutes in a 220C (425F) oven. The sweet potato was cut in half, coated with EVO and roasted cut side down for 30 minutes in the same oven. The bok choy was cut in half, seared cut cut side down with some garlic slivers in some canola oil and then covered and steamed in the same pan with a half cup of chicken stock.

 

I like my meats rare and have found that 53C is just right for red meats.

 

lamb-rack-4-web.jpg


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#418 Todd in Chicago

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Posted 19 February 2013 - 10:48 PM

That lamb looks wonderful. Can't wait to get my replacement SideKIC to try this

Yes it does. Here is my version that I did for Valentine's dinner. i used a New Zealand rack from Restaurant Depot. The rack was given a dose of salt, pepper and garlic powder, bagged,  SV at 53C for 3 hours, then seared, coated with honey and mustard and herbed bread crumbs per Thomas Keller's Ad Hoc at Home and finished for 10 minutes in a 220C (425F) oven. The sweet potato was cut in half, coated with EVO and roasted cut side down for 30 minutes in the same oven. The bok choy was cut in half, seared cut cut side down with some garlic slivers in some canola oil and then covered and steamed in the same pan with a half cup of chicken stock.

 

I like my meats rare and have found that 53C is just right for red meats.

 

attachicon.giflamb-rack-4-web.jpg

Nice!

 

I like the Thomas Keller treatment after the sous vide.  I'll have to try that.

 

Todd in Chicago



#419 scubadoo97

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Posted 20 February 2013 - 03:56 AM

Paul, your lamb looks excellent. The combination of SV, searing and brief roasting gives the meat a traditional roasted appearance.

Edited by scubadoo97, 20 February 2013 - 03:56 AM.


#420 EnriqueB

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Posted 21 February 2013 - 03:27 AM

Yesterday I finished teaching what I think was, as far as I know, the first sous-vide course for home cooks in Spain.

 

Six hours split in two days in a demo kitchen for 18 people. It was a real challenge to multitask so as to address the required theory as well as preparing the dishes with degustations for everyone and answering many questions, all in a kitchen I was not familiar with. So the first day was a bit chaotic but I managed to organize things pretty well the second day.

 

We cooked tender meat (chicken breasts 56ºC with miso-butter-mirin-chicken glace sauce), tough meat (ibérico pork cheeks 65ºC for 36 hours, cooked prior to the course, with celery root puree and pickled apple slices, adapted from chefsteps), fish (salmon cured with citrics and cooked on lemongrass & coriander seeds infused oil at 43ºC, adapted from Keller), seafood (shrimps at 51ºC with butter and coriander seeds), soft-boiled eggs at 75ºC (fast method), vegetables as side dishes (green asparagus with evoo, butter-glazed carrots and leeks), and a dessert (vanilla crème anglaise at 82ºC with banana cooked skin-in also at 82ºC).

 

Many theory and tricks I showed were learnt here, from how to seal with liquids to egg tables and so on. This forum is a neverending source of quality information, thanks to everyone who has contributed and specially to PedroG whose tricks, tables and analysis have been extraordinarily useful.

 

A great experience that I expect to repeat.


Edited by EnriqueB, 21 February 2013 - 03:34 AM.






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