148 replies to this topic

[Tri2Cook]

He didn't say the show should have catered to him, he said it wasn't what he thought it was going to be. He was asked here what he would have liked it to be, he answered. He didn't say it should be that, he said he would have liked it to be that. I don't see what's so hard to understand about that.

[KatieLoeb]

Exactly. Thank you for expressing that far more eloquently than I could have hoped to. I don't understand why everyone is harshing on Seth so fiercely. Surely our opinions of him are far more well informed having seen his posts here prior to and following the episode. "Reality TV" is anything but. Let's remember that what we see has already been edited and packaged for "mass market" appeal. I defy anyone to sign up for a reality program and be cut off from real life as they know it for weeks or months on end and behave "normally". I know I couldn't handle it.

[Emily_R]

In fact, I was not harshing on Seth for anything he did on the show, but instead for the tone of his comments throughout this post. After going back and reviewing them all, it is a series of: Shitty GE equipment, shitty ingredients, shitty challenges that he wasn't trained in and shouldn't have to do because that’s not what he likes to do or values... That plus a line of self-important and superior comments along the lines of "I was more against lowering myself to the challenges" and comments along the lines of "If there were any challenges suited to my wheelhouse, only 2 or 3 other cheftestants would have been able to put up a plate besides mine." And then there’s the “whether or not I acted like a fool and caused a lot of tension, this show was destined to suck from conception.”

To me that adds up to a lack of recognition that a) whether the show sucked for him does not speak to whether it sucked for the *audience* and b) that his superior skills are ultimately not the only currency that matters, or that even should matter. Tritocook and Katie, you argue that he never said he claimed the show should have been structured differently. I just can’t help but read the the long chain of putting down the show and building up himself as exactly that.

I have no doubt being on a reality TV show is extremely stressful, but again, right now I'm not talking about his actions on the show itself. Furthermore, I have no doubt he makes wonderful contributions to the pastry board, and I hope he continues to, as I'm sure his tone contributing to other threads is quite different. But he is choosing to post to this particular thread, and I think I’m entitled to my opinion about the attitude I think those posts convey.

[Sethro]

"Cook the best food" was a snarky answer for me to give, sorry about that.
My wheelhouse is modern and eclectic technique, I guess. All things being equal, I should have the knowledge to do almost everything faster than everyone else. Like with a microwave, a gastrovac and LN I can have cake, sauce and ice cream in 12 minutes. I mean I time tested myself on every technique, and I honestly believe that the only thing slowing me down (in some challenges in particular) was constant equipment failure/disappearance and ingredient withholding (without warning).
Obviously, its still possible I would have found something else to bemoan or still might have gone home early, but in several specific cases I was directly hobbled by the producers mid-cooking time. You think its coincidence that on one challenge the first three to shop were the top three, and the last three to shop were the bottom three?

The show had major problems, the challenges were mostly broken by their own rules and standards, and I truly believe it was not a fair competition. I couldn't have cooked any better under the circumstances, but of course I could have behaved like a sane adult and not soured the soup. It was a mess all around.

Obviously I have some personal problems but cooking ability isn't one of them. I believe I have a superior ability to adapt to unexpected challenges and the necessary knowledge of food science to make almost anything work. I believe if it were a fair competition I would have cruised through in the top three in every challenge right up until the first wedding cake or showpiece elimination, at which time I'd have probably go home. Which would have been fine with me. Its the fact that the challenges that should have been the easiest and most fun for me ended up disastrous for reasons outside my control that is so frustrating. I feel like I was robbed of the chance to put up amazing food on national tv, and that was the ultimate heartbreak. If a million people watched this show and saw me cook like that, then I'll now have to cook for a million and one more before I can exhale.

My hope is that as many of the people who HATE who I was and how I cooked on the show, come out to see me in person. I think they would be surprised by how happy I look in the kitchen, and how that joy is visible in my cooking. My cooking is intended to be a celebration of nature and humanity, I really mean that. Just thinking about what it means to me makes heart pump harder.

I won't insult anyone with false humility, because I don't regret being myself, warts and all. I just wish you could all understand how badly I want to cook for you. Cooking for people is my drug of choice, especially people like you guys who care enough about food to think about it and talk about it and keep it dear to you. Its why I went on the show, and its why the failure was so crushing.

Anyways, I'll be starting a cooking blog soon with tons of pics, in-depth recipes and maybe even technique vids. I hope you guys will check it out and maybe start to see me in a different light. Also I may have a few guest-chef dates popping up in a city near you in the future, and I'd love to see many eGulleters in the house. Of course it matters to me how I am perceived, and I plan on winning you all back with cooking (and love). Don't forget that this is the same guy who convinced Management at not one but TWO restaurants I worked at that eGulleters would receive a 10% discount on the entire check, just for being awesome. I've done personalized tasting menus for eGulleters by request, and enjoyed it immensely. I care deeply about the people who support my cooking, and I believe eGullet still has potential to improve the cooking community and bring cooks and eaters together.

Thank you so much to those giving me the benefit of the doubt, kindness and support. To those with valid criticisms, I hear you loud and clear, and I won't stop trying to achieve my potential, not only as a cook but as a chef. To those with blind rage towards me, I feel sad for us both. Being hated is draining, but hating drains you entirely. Anyways, that was tv and now comes reality. Now its time to cook.

Edited by Sethro, 17 October 2010 - 10:00 AM.

[GwennP]

Well said,Sethro

[KatieLoeb]

Good on 'ya, Seth. You are passionate about what you do. I respect that. I try to be the same way behind the bar. I wish you success in moving forward and recovering from this disappointing experience, both personally and professionally. If you're ever coming to Philly, let me know. I'd love to buy you a drink!

[Brioche57]

Sethro -
Along with your talent in pastry you have proven (here) to be an excellent writer as well. It appears to me that what might be best for you as you move forward, and you will move forward from this experience, is that you find an investor as passionate as you are so that you can create AND control the way you want to cook.

I know that is not as easy as it sounds, however from my own personal experience (I always considered my self the "second bannana") when that happens you will find the fulfillment and creative outlet you deserve.

[yaslh]

It’s so easy to criticize from the stands. Easy to pick apart Seth's participation on the show, his reactions, his missteps without really knowing what truly transpired behind the camera. It's a little on the arrogant side to dissect his character or define his persona from those few unfortunate minutes on TV. I honestly feel repulsed reading the sanctimonious and self-righteous attacks towards Seth. I'm sure that those who are throwing stones at him have never had an outburst of frustration in the kitchen. I'm sure you always remain impeccably calm and always have the most mature reactions under any stressful situation. Good for you! Just have a little bit more of grace when judging others, particularly a fellow pastry chef( who,in addition, has an obvious passion and talent). I taste a little schadenfreude here...

[Kat Tanaka Okopnik]

yaslh -

I've been won over by sethro's last, very classy response in this thread, but seriously - it wasn't one outburst, it was a string of them. And with lots of other "cheftestants" who were under their own individual experiences of pressure. Seth himself said, "but of course I could have behaved like a sane adult and not soured the soup. It was a mess all around."

I think he's amply defended himself for what was defensible, and owned up to what could have been better. Time to let the thread move on from Seth, and on to the rest of the competition, no?

(Or, if we're going to focus on Seth - how's your mother, sir? I hope she's doing as well as one can hope, given the circumstances.)

[Shelby]

I'm sad that Gail had to raid her great gramma's closet for that blue dress.

[Chris Hennes]

I wonder how much Gail was authorized to offer for that immunity deal.

[oakapple]

I wonder how much Gail was authorized to offer for that immunity deal.

I wondered that too. I am guessing that $5,000 (which Zac took) was not the last, best offer.

I certainly wouldn't have given up immunity for the first offer of $1,000, and I am not sure I would even have done it for $5,000, but it turned out well for him. At this point, Morgan, Yigit and Zac are looking like the three best chefs there.

Incidentally, I think that both the wedding cake and the "pastry dress" were reasonable challenges. Even Johnny Iuzzini said he had done a pastry dress, and wedding cakes are CLEARLY "desserts" by any rational definition.

Now, the quickfire was dumb, in that they had to prepare a savory dessert using one pot, and most of the usual tools were off limits. That was Top Chef at its worst, where there were artificial limitations that no chef would face in real life.

[Tri2Cook]

The quickfire "twist" was a low point for me. The savory challenge could have been really cool. I love working with traditionally savory items in my desserts and I was looking forward to seeing what people came up with. Then they throw in a "one pot meal" theme and take all of the fun right out of it.

The Black and White challenge, on the other hand, would be really fun to do. That's the type of challenge I would like, boundaries but no real restrictions. "Do whatever you want with whatever you want as long as it fits in this box."

I enjoyed seeing Michael Laiskonis as a guest judge. He's on my short-list of pasty heroes. Now if they'd just do Pastry Chef Masters...

[Holly Moore]

Most clever product placement concept ever - only able to use one pot so Dawn was "essential" to clean said pot.

What didn't make sense is that deep frying Zac's panko coated whoppie pies turned them a golden brown. That should have eliminated him from winning a black/white competition. I was hoping someone would do settable type reproductions - black or white cubes with the raised type in the contrasting color.

Curious what else could have been used, other than chocolate, for black. I was thinking licorice, but combined with what?

[Tri2Cook]

There's not a lot of actual black, especially that will work in a sweet setting. Licorice, black sesame paste, black cocoa, some coffees, teas and chocolates are pretty close. Tough color but doable. Any dark purple ingredient that works with dark chocolate could be tweaked in a ganache or sauce or something. It would be fun. Maybe a black sesame pain de genes with a ginger parfait or ice cream and a few other components to pull it together as a complete dessert. Licorice would be fun to work with but would require a lot more restraint than some of the other flavors available in black to do well.

[GordonCooks]

Well said Sethro, kudos,

Edited by GordonCooks, 21 October 2010 - 11:31 AM.

[Pierogi]

Most clever product placement concept ever - only able to use one pot so Dawn was "essential" to clean said pot.

What didn't make sense is that deep frying Zac's panko coated whoppie pies turned them a golden brown. That should have eliminated him from winning a black/white competition. I was hoping someone would do settable type reproductions - black or white cubes with the raised type in the contrasting color.
...

I had both those same thoughts myself.

With the whoppie pies, especially. The judges were so all over Heather H. and Erica for using dark reds and purples, but let Zac slide on the obviously brown panko. To me the reds and purples were a whole lot closer to black than the brown was....

[IndyRob]

My only problem was that the judgement of black and white became entirely subjective in the end. As I was doing the play at home version in my head, I threw out a few things as 'not black enough'. Things that actually would've turned out to be acceptable.

For the quickfire, I think cooking with a single pot is a valid challenge. I think that regardless of specialty, a cook should be able to come up with something good without all the gizmos. On 'Masters' I think Hubert Keller made good use of a dormroom bathtub. Having to cook in a deficient environment is certainly something that could be encountered in real life.

It's great to be able to create great things when you have everything you want, but that rarely happens in real life. To me, it's far more impressive when someone can indeed make a silk purse out of a sow's ear.

Edited by IndyRob, 21 October 2010 - 03:47 PM.

[LizD518]

For the quickfire, I think cooking with a single pot is a valid challenge. I think that regardless of specialty, a cook should be able to come up with something good without all the gizmos. On 'Masters' I think Hubert Keller made good use of a dormroom bathtub. Having to cook in a deficient environment is certainly something that could be encountered in real life.

I don't have a problem with "cook with one pot" as a challenge, or with "use vegetables as the main ingredients in your dessert" as a challenge. I thought putting the two of them together was unnecessarily restrictive though.

[Genkinaonna]

I was also a little annoyed with the lack of consistency in the black and white challenge. I could see the blackberry creme brulee as clearly purple, but Zac's whoopie pies were just as far off. It seems like the judging is a little bit arbitrary...

I thought the one pot challenge and the savory challenge would have been more suited to two separate quickfires, and the unceasing Dawn product placement was super annoying and invasive.

But I'll still keep watching, if only to be snarky and critical!

PS- Seth, thanks for that last post, I'm glad you seem to have your head on a lot straighter than they showed you on the show...you clearly have talent as a pastry chef and hopefully your next adventure will go a little smoother!

[mcohen]

Obviously I have some personal problems but cooking ability isn't one of them.

When the producers selected the contestants, do you think the producers for the show knew that you had these personal problems and were thus a ticking timebomb or were they surprised by your mental break down?

[Mithril]

I have a half batch of Eric's winning nutella/peanut butter/chocolate/rice krispie treat dessert from the bake sale challenge setting up right now. It's supposed to sit overnight, unfortunately. The nutella layer was delicious when I was licking the spoon.

The recipes available on the Top Chef website are interesting; they don't seem to have been edited for the average home cook. The measurements are mostly in grams, and the recipe calls for spreading the Rice Krispie treats out in a full sheet pan. I just wonder how many people out in the world realize that the largest a home chef generally gets is a half sheet. On the Food Network recipe reviews, people always complain about it if the recipes are by weight instead of volume. Oh, and the sugar for the Rice Krispie treats (not melted marshmallow) is cooked to soft ball stage without any temperature listed.

[dhardy123]

I did the same recipe and it turned out well. I saw him using a full pan, so I was prepared for that.

The only changes I would make would have been to do a bit more of the rice krispie base. My bar seemed a bit top-heavy...too much chocolate/PB/Nutella and not enough base. Other than that it was perfect.

By the way you can find the recipe in the Baked cookbook, except without Nutella.

[Mithril]

I am not too sure whether I like them or not, so I had to make another batch so I can keep sampling until I figure it out

The show this week was pretty good. I was happy to see Heather leave, because I really like Zac but I thought she was bringing him down attitude-wise. It seems like a pastry chef should know how to make a thin tart crust in her sleep, so it was a good choice. Morgan's team really did make a better looking bakery and I'm glad Eric hung on one more week.

[Bricktop]

The reaction of the so-called "Team Loser" to the verdict was the high point of this season for me.

[IndyRob]

I am not too sure whether I like them or not, so I had to make another batch so I can keep sampling until I figure it out

The show this week was pretty good. I was happy to see Heather leave, because I really like Zac but I thought she was bringing him down attitude-wise. It seems like a pastry chef should know how to make a thin tart crust in her sleep, so it was a good choice. Morgan's team really did make a better looking bakery and I'm glad Eric hung on one more week.

I wouldn't say that I was happy to see Heather go, but it did seem inevitable - especially once her team lost. Just being a home cook I've made good mousses and ganaches without a fail. Not all of my crusts have been been up there. That's the sort of thing that should make a good pastry chef shine. And she went her own way with it. The fact that it failed in not one, but two dishes means that, IMHO, this was one of the least controversial Top Chef eliminations ever.

[YWalker]

To her credit, I thought that Heather showed real class by making it clear that she was responsible for the poor quality of the crust in Yigit's dish as well as her own.

I was sorely disappointed by this week's episode. I think the banning of chocolate would have been a perfectly legitimate twist to throw in there if they had warned them at the outset of the challenge. I could have even been OK with it when they entered the store. That was just a nasty twist to do it after they had already left the store and had no opportunity to purchase other ingredients. Zac and Danielle were given a huge advantage in having adequate planning time and shopping time just because they had happened not to use chocolate. I think it just broke Eric and Yigit's spirit.

I was really sorry to see Eric go. While I think that the championship will go to Morgan or Yigit, I would have loved to have seen him make at least the top 3. If given the opportunity to go to a bakeshop owned by any of the contestants, I would most like to go to Eric's. I just think his flavors would be great and accessible. If I were to be having a big affair catered, though, I think that Zac would do a great job --- it would definitely be fun and memorable event. I do think that Seth would be able to pull off the most amazing affair, however, and that Morgan would do an excellent job as well.

[Holly Moore]

I enjoyed it with the exception that there were a couple of the pastritestamts that were far less qualified and seemed set up to fail. I'm sure it was intentional casting and a common ploy, but lessened my enjoyment.

[annabelle]

I'm pleased to see Hubert Keller there and that Johnny shaved off those awful sideburns. I have to say that I wish there were more European-trained chefs. The American chefs and their "I'm the baddest chef in the kitchen, yo!" attitudes get on my last American nerve. If you're going to act like a pompous bad-ass, have the skills to back it up.