146 replies to this topic

[budrichard]

"because the aromatic grease is sucked up the hood and vented away "

Actually most of these hoods and ducting arrangements have grease traps where the radial velocity imparted by the fan or fans causes the grease intrained in the air to deposit. These 'traps' must be periodically cleaned or a fire could occur. Inspection of the duct work periodically should also be done.
I have Viking dual fan unit and inspect/clean at least two times a year.-Dick

[paulraphael]

It should also be mentioned that Steven (and probably many other eG members -- but, alas, not I) has a powerful externally-vented hood over his stove.

And there are others among us who like a house that smells like meat.

[Hest88]

Well, I tried the method this weekend and it was a dismal failure. I think in part my steak was a bit too thin, but also, even though I had the burner on something closer to low than medium, it was still too hot. I think I'll have to tweak my methods further.

[C. sapidus]

I tried this tonight. We had two boneless ribeyes, probably two inches thick at the minimum (six bucks a pound at Costco). We cooked one in a cast iron skillet, the other in a copper sauteuse. The cast iron ran a bit hot, but the copper pan maintained a steady low-medium. Since the “steaks” were so thick, we finished them in a 170F oven for about 15 minutes.

Call us philistines if you must, but the whole family preferred our usual approach: briefly marinate steak with soy sauce, garlic, and black pepper; sear over a hot grill; and finish in a cool oven. We enjoyed the experiment, though, and to be fair, little remained of 4.5 pounds of ribeye.

[budrichard]

"Call us philistines if you must, but the whole family preferred our usual approach: briefly marinate steak with soy sauce, garlic, and black pepper; sear over a hot grill; "

If you like that treatment, you may want to try this, http://www.dalesseasoning.com/ . A favorite of ours for years.-Dick

[paulraphael]

Not surprising if an approach that works well on $20/lb meat and $60/lb meat isn't ideal on $6/lb meat. I've paid more than that for cat food!

[Dave Hatfield]

Here's another take on cooking a thick steak. Heston Blumenthal of the Fat Duck.

This link takes you to a BBC recipe page. The recipe is abbreviated, but you can get the idea.

Brown the outside with a blow torch, then cook a 55 degrees C for 20 hours.

What the recipe doesn't say, but what he did on the TV show was to cut the steak into about 1 inch slices after it came out of the oven then fry it in a very very hot pan very briefly, just enough to form a crust.

Has anybody tried this?

PS: interestingly he tested steaks from 6 different breeds of cattle. Long horn came out on top. This was in the UK where thew beef is grass fed.

[Dave the Cook]

Not surprising if an approach that works well on $20/lb meat and $60/lb meat isn't ideal on $6/lb meat. I've paid more than that for cat food!

Um. It works just fine.

[kutsu]

Here's another take on cooking a thick steak. Heston Blumenthal of the Fat Duck.

This link takes you to a BBC recipe page. The recipe is abbreviated, but you can get the idea.

Brown the outside with a blow torch, then cook a 55 degrees C for 20 hours.

What the recipe doesn't say, but what he did on the TV show was to cut the steak into about 1 inch slices after it came out of the oven then fry it in a very very hot pan very briefly, just enough to form a crust.

Has anybody tried this?

PS: interestingly he tested steaks from 6 different breeds of cattle. Long horn came out on top. This was in the UK where thew beef is grass fed.

He gets the beef from Richard vaughan at Huntsham farms and I can vouch for how nice it is!

[Camano Chef]

Has anyone tried this sous vide finished with pan or grill searing?

[sickchangeup]

Yeah, I did that. 1.75" 21 day age boneless shell steak. 3 hours @131F in S-V. Then finished by following FG's method of medium heat, and going fat strip first. This I just left on for as long as I felt it was needed, since it wasn't really cooking the steak any. Then I switched to the presentation side, but didn't go the full 10 minutes cause I was worried about overcooking. I actually brushed the pan and steak with avocado oil first before throwing knobs of butter into the pan and basting at medium-high heat.

On the second side, I only left it a minute or so, removing it cause I didn't want to move beyond the medium rare.

Worked beautifully, although I'm not a good photog:


The steak out of the pan, resting.


On the plate.

Takes about a minute for the meat to turn red, was worried when I first cut into the meat cause it was brown. But after oxygen get's to it, it goes rosey. I feel I can actually leave the steak in the pan for a little longer next time, cause I gave the meat a long enough rest out of the bag that it was fine to push it a little harder than I did, for an even nicer crust.

I'm pretty certain I'll be going this route in the future, assuming I have 3+ hours to do it of course. I'm not one to allow myself to eat the fat rim, but if I was (or if I snuck a bite)... man, that fat is (theoretically) good eats after SV, the third through fifth pieces above show it quite nicely.

[TheFanatic]

I am a true believe that the perfect steak is rare or medium rare. Anything beyond that is cooked improperly. That being said, using this method for grilling a steak can improve steaks cooked beyond medium rare as well.

My favorite steak of all time is the bone in ribeye and that is exactly what I cooked for this meal. This particular steak was indeed a monster. I put my cell phone into the picture for reference. My cell phone is a standard Motorola Razr.



Another angle to get the idea of the shear size of this thing



The steak will sit out for about an hour to come up to room temperature. I'm not sure as to the science behind it, but I never throw a cold steak onto a blazing hot fire. I'm not kidding when I say blazing. You'll see that in a bit.

All I did was add a little coarse salt and fresh cracked black pepper to this bad boy. To some this is all one needs. Normally I marinade my steaks, even filets. The key is using the right kind of marinade for the right kind of cut. But for this one, and for my first demonstration here I went with a simple, almost pure steak.

The real trick to cooking the perfect steak is two zone cooking. Coals on one side. Nothing on the other. Sear the outside on each side to form a nice crust to seal the juices in, then pull off the heat to the side with no coals, put the lid on and bake till desired doneness.

And when I say sear, I really mean sear. I don't jerk around with searing. I get the coals flaming hot and then I pour on some sort of veggie oil and flame sear my steaks. ***Disclaimer - I do not recommend doing this near siding, a wood deck or anything else that could melt or catch on fire. Also avoid doing this in high wind. I almost learned that one the hard way.



To give you some perspective in the day light. Here is a picture of me grilling steaks at my folks this last Summer. This is the flame searing process and thus the necessity for the disclaimer:



The hardest part is having the patience to let that expensive cut sit over those flames without flipping it. Sear for a 60 seconds and rotate 90 degrees and sear for another minute for nice grill marks. I don't really care about grill marks so I just sear it.

For this steak I seared it and then pulled it over to the side with no coals for maybe 5 minutes. Realize that this bad boy was close to 24 ounces. Smaller steaks (and more importantly thinner steaks ) will take less time to bake to the desired doneness.

Now comes a very critical step. Resting. You just created a nice crust to seal the juices in. You just pulled that steak off a hot grill. Those juices are in a very excited state. They are moving a million miles an hour inside that steak. If you slice it now all the juices will run out before you get to your 3rd bite. So for all of you who use a big grill fork to flip steaks, throw those steaks and the fork in the trash and get a good set of tongs.

The ideal resting place would be on a cooling rack for cookies so that the juice that does leak out (and there always will be just a little) will not soak through the crust on the bottom. I'm not that anal. I just put it on a plate to rest. More perspective on the size of this thing. It is resting on a standard size Fiestaware dinner plate.



A steak of this size needs to rest about 5 minutes. It should rest long enough to allow the juices to settle down but not too long so that it gets cold. Just till those all important juices calm down.

Those of you who are not fans of rare or medium rare steaks usually get to this point and assume that the blood and juice is going to leak all over the plate when I slice it open. I will prove you wrong with what I like to call the money shot



And here's an even closer view of the money shot



Normally I like my steaks just a little redder than that, but this thing was so huge that I baked it for a little longer than it probably needed. Despite that, it was juicy and delicious from the first bite to the last. And to the detriment to my arteries, I ate the whole thing....

[Magictofu]

I thought flames were to be avoided for both flavour and health reasons. Any comments on that?

[TheFanatic]

I thought flames were to be avoided for both flavour and health reasons. Any comments on that?

Some say that too much charring can lead to stomach cancer. What doesn't lead to cancer? Also, the point is to get a sear and not a char.

As for flavor and flames, I gotta say I have never heard that one before....

[judiu]

I thought flames were to be avoided for both flavour and health reasons. Any comments on that?

Some say that too much charring can lead to stomach cancer. What doesn't lead to cancer? Also, the point is to get a sear and not a char.

As for flavor and flames, I gotta say I have never heard that one before....

It would depend on what CAUSED the flames, I believe; if the flame up is due to lighter fluid, yeah, the flame would impart a nasty taste to the meat. Since you used a neutral vegetable oil, I don't think it would leave an 'off' flavor.

[Magictofu]

I think it's something about the black residue left on the meat... some kind of bitter compounds.

I should study bio-chemistry one day!

[slkinsey]

Soot. If you have actual flames, you're going to get soot.

[TheFanatic]

Soot.  If you have actual flames, you're going to get soot.

Soot?!?! Really?

Try the method and get back to me on how much soot you detect in the flavor. Make sure you take a pic of the outside as well so we can tell if you did it correctly...

[Alcuin]

Soot.  If you have actual flames, you're going to get soot.

Soot?!?! Really?

Try the method and get back to me on how much soot you detect in the flavor. Make sure you take a pic of the outside as well so we can tell if you did it correctly...

I'd be afraid I'd get bitter tasting char rather than a delicious maillardized crust. How do you make sure you don't burn the outside of the meat with a technique like this? It seems to me there are ways to ensure this that allow for more control.

[joesan]

The inside of your steak looks great but the outside looks a little (actually a lot ) burnt to me...

But I think with this kind of thing I think that beauty is in the eye of the beholder.



Anyway I tried the Ducasse method that the OP refrers to the other night but I ended up with a pretty tough piece meat. I think it was more likely to be the fault of the meat but I think I'll stick to the sous vide then flash grill method since that gives me consistently good results.

It's always good to experiment though.

[TheFanatic]

Soot.  If you have actual flames, you're going to get soot.

Soot?!?! Really?

Try the method and get back to me on how much soot you detect in the flavor. Make sure you take a pic of the outside as well so we can tell if you did it correctly...

I'd be afraid I'd get bitter tasting char rather than a delicious maillardized crust. How do you make sure you don't burn the outside of the meat with a technique like this? It seems to me there are ways to ensure this that allow for more control.

It's not hard to lift up the steak and look at the underside....That's what those tongs are for...

[slkinsey]

Soot.  If you have actual flames, you're going to get soot.

Soot?!?! Really?

Try the method and get back to me on how much soot you detect in the flavor. Make sure you take a pic of the outside as well so we can tell if you did it correctly...

Yes!!!! Really! This is pretty easy to see, just by looking a the underside of a pan you have used over a dirty flame (as opposed to a clean flame like from a gas stove). And the effects of a dirty flame on flavor are well-understood, which is why good kitchens don't want their cooks flaming pans for more than a few seconds

Some people like that flavor, so whatever floats your boat. Burger King, for example, differentiates itself on the basis of putting a little soot on its burgers. I can't say that I mind it myself in every context, but it's not something I'd be likely to do with an expensive dry-aged prime steak. More to the point, you don't really need the flame to get the extra-high heat you want for searing. I'd much rather have the high heat from properly configured and tended coals instead. Although it does produce flame, it's not clear to me that dumping the vegetable oil is boosting heat all that much.

[mtigges]

it's not clear to me that dumping the vegetable oil is boosting heat all that much.

It's actually likely reducing it.

[Alcuin]

Soot.  If you have actual flames, you're going to get soot.

Soot?!?! Really?

Try the method and get back to me on how much soot you detect in the flavor. Make sure you take a pic of the outside as well so we can tell if you did it correctly...

I'd be afraid I'd get bitter tasting char rather than a delicious maillardized crust. How do you make sure you don't burn the outside of the meat with a technique like this? It seems to me there are ways to ensure this that allow for more control.

It's not hard to lift up the steak and look at the underside....That's what those tongs are for...

Indeed. My point was that once you get the tongs in there, you might be past the point of no return.

[Magictofu]

Flames aside, I think the pictures of the interior or the steak produced by TheFanatic speak for themselves about the two zones method on a BBQ (which is similar to the pan to oven method). This technique is very popular for good reasons.

[slkinsey]

Absolutely. And you do need very high heat for this technique to work that well. Extremely high heat will give you a nicely maillardized crust on the outside without very much penetration into the steak.

[jmolinari]

Used Ducasse's method on a prime ribeye from Costco tonight. The method is good, and makes a nice steak, but good lord, the cleanup of the stove is going to be AWFUL. I don't think i'll use this method again!

[OliverB]

how timely can things pop up on the computer! I just bought a rib roast that - in hindsight - is way too big for us, I'll most likely cut it in half and try this method! And if not today, then certainly next time I have a big fat steak in the house! Looks delicious.

I usually do the sear and low oven thing, looking forward to a different way. The butter should add a real nice flavor too! Thanks for all the pictures too, nice little tutorial.

[markk]

As Alain Ducasse noted in the New York Times in 2002 (article here, discussed here), the standard American method of preparing steak involves high heat. I'd say that 99% of steaks I've had at steakhouses and in people's homes have been cooked either on a grill, under a broiler or in a very hot skillet. Yet, some of the best steaks I've ever had have been served at Ducasse's restaurants (and at other restaurants that use similar methods, such as Tom Colicchio's Craft places), where the steaks are prepared using relatively low heat.

Demonstrating this method -- which I think is perhaps the best way to make a steak and has the advantage of being easy to do in the home kitchen with no special equipment -- is something I've been meaning to do for the past six years, ever since that article came out. The other day, though, inspired by the arrival of a USDA Prime 28-ounce dry-aged bone-in rib steak product sample from Lobel's, I decided to do it. Lobel's is arguably the world's preeminent butcher, and Ducasse the world's preeminent chef, so I thought it would be fitting to introduce the method to this fine piece of meat.



One of the points Ducasse makes is that when you have a piece of meat this good, it's a shame to burn it. He prefers, as do I, to get a good crust on the steak with no charring. Once you char a steak, you're substituting the carbonized flavor of burnt flesh and fat for the, in my opinion, more delicious "roasty" flavor of the Maillard reaction and the beef itself.

Okay, so here's the Ducasse method of making a rib steak, as interpreted by me. This is a 45-minute process, assuming you start with a steak that has been allowed to come up to room temperature or that at least has been out of the refrigerator long enough to take the chill off it. The method starts with a skillet -- in my case cast-iron but any good skillet works fine as does a pot like a rondeau -- heated to a medium heat. The steak is started on its edge. The reason for this is twofold: first, it renders the fat so you're able to cook the steak in beef fat (this echoes Ducasse's principles of flavor reinforcement, which are nearly universal in his cooking); second, it creates an appetizing appearance on the edges.



Note that there was no salt or anything added to the steak before cooking, and that the pan is dry -- no oil etc. You're just putting the steak in the skillet on its edge. If you have a big fat steak (a lot of restaurants would call this a cote de boeuf) then at first it will stand on its edge without help. But eventually you'll have to get creative with the geometry by leaning and propping the steak against the sides of the skillet in order to keep it upright while exposing as many parts of the edge as possible to the heat. If you're willing to stand there with tongs and secure the meat in various positions for 10 minutes you'll get an even more uniform and beautiful crust. Here's how this process unfolds during the first 10 or so minutes of cooking:







Now it's time to cook the steak on its flat faces, 10 minutes on a side. The way I prefer to do this, which is not exactly the same as how Ducasse recommends in the Times but is something I've seen done in restaurant kitchens, is to dump out enough of the beef fat so that there's a thin coating of it left in the pan, plop the steak on its flat face, and add a couple of tablespoons of butter.



A lot of people recoil at the notion of using butter as a cooking fat with steak, but I've found that butter has two excellent properties: 1- butter, more than most any other fat I know of, is a huge aid to the Maillard reaction, and 2- the combination of butter and beef fat makes a tastier cooking medium for steak than oil.

Now, after about 10 minutes the butter has browned to the point where, if we don't do something, it's going to start imparting burnt flavors to the steak.



In the first stages of browning, butter has desirable flavors. But eventually, even with medium heat, it breaks down. So it's time to renew the butter by dumping the cooking fat and adding another couple of tablespoons. I believe Ducasse recommends only adding the butter towards the end of cooking, but I think the steak comes out a little better when you use butter all the way through to coax a little more of the Maillard reaction from the steak.

So we are at the 20-minute mark. We've browned our edges and cooked one side of the steak in a mixture of beef fat and butter for 10 minutes over medium heat. We've dumped the fat and flipped the steak. Witness the crust:



Once I saw that crust -- beautifully browned but not at all charred -- for the first time I became a believer in the Ducasse method. But it gets better. Now you add some more butter, let it melt, and spoon it over the crust (aka basting). This is also when I sprinkle the steak liberally with coarse salt. I know this is much, much later in the cooking process than anybody will tell you to salt a steak, but I find that it yields good results.

Here we are about to baste.



And the crust gets even better after basting.



Continue to cook for about another 10 minutes, basting occasionally if you like (though you've derived most of the basting benefit from the first baste).

Now we are almost at the 30-minute mark, so the last thing to do is flip the steak and baste (and salt) the other side.



Now the steak will have to rest for 15 minutes in a warm place (the Ducasse rule of thumb is to rest meat for half as long as you cooked it) before being carved. I use a warm plate near the stove. A 150-degree oven is also an option, and if you use on oven you can rest even longer without worrying about the steak getting too cool to be appetizing.




After 15 minutes our home fries are done and our steak is well rested.



There are fancier ways to carve a rib steak than the way I do it, but this is really simple. You just cut out the bone with a paring knife, then slice the steak. Note that here I use a santoku knife but that's not an expression of personal preference. I don't really like santoku knives. It's just that this happens to be the most recently sharpened knife in my kitchen.







If you look at the Times piece, there are some slight variants between the instructions there and the way I do it. In part that's because I'm not good at following instructions and in part it's because I've seen some variation in actual Ducasse restaurant kitchens where I've spent time watching the line cooks cook steaks. Most of all the method affords a lot of flexibility, so a little more or less flipping, turning and time won't have a huge impact the way it might on a super-hot charcoal grill or under a Jade upright broiler.

A good variant of this method is the one Dave Scantland chronicles in the Daily Gullet in "The Chronicles of Chuck."

I saw this thread revived, read the original post, could not remember ever having seen this thread before (though I'm sure I must have) and thought to myself, "That's EXACTLY how I cook a big steak!", though my one variation is that while the steaks are cooking (one to a pan), I heat up some small, round, "cake-cooling" racks in the oven, so that when it's just a couple of minutes before the steak has to come off and rest, I lift the steak with something hot, slide the hot cake-cooling rack under it, and replace the steak on the rack - so it's lifted above the pan (if there's so much fat that the steak is touching fat, I remove it). At this point the steak finishes cooking from being 1/2 inch above the hot pan, and as the pan cools, the steak rests - it works out great:



You should only know that I don't know what I did wrong - this steak was waaay overcooked. I don't know where I bungled it. I like 'em dripping red inside, even rarer than the one in the original post, and except for this time, I always get 'em that way. Oh, well.

Edited by markk, 14 February 2009 - 01:53 PM.

[Michael B]

Not surprising if an approach that works well on $20/lb meat and $60/lb meat isn't ideal on $6/lb meat. I've paid more than that for cat food!

I never pay more than $1 a kg (about 15c US a pound).

It is good to be a farmer.