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Aperitivo Americano


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#91 tanstaafl2

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Posted 27 June 2012 - 10:24 AM


thanks, campus five. and also for the spray tip - I was about to ask how one goes about "rinsing" the glass!


The low tech approach consists of adding a small amount of absinthe/pastis to the glass, rolling it around to coat the inside of the glass, and discarding the remainder.


If one wants to jazz it up a bit I have found a small, usually metal, spray bottle makes a nice touch. Think a small fancy bottle a bit like an old timey perfume bottle with which to spray the glass or surface of the drink when called for. Don't know where you might find it online. One of my local liquor stores carries them.
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#92 thampik

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Posted 28 June 2012 - 02:31 PM

Just had the Suze and Absinthe delivered and tried out the "real" White Negroni using EvergreenDan's ratios - I can see the difference the Suze makes to the drink.

I aim to try out the Corpse Reviver #2 tomorrow with Absinthe - might have to use the "low-tech" rinse approach :raz: in the absence of a spray bottle.

#93 thampik

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Posted 29 June 2012 - 02:17 PM

As I had no lemon juice, I ended making a Vesper with Cocchi. Really enjoyable.

#94 FrogPrincesse

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Posted 30 June 2012 - 12:28 PM

A couple of drinks with Cocchi Americano last night.

Zephyr (Benjamin Schwartz, via Bartender's Choice app): gin, cocchi americano, and green chartreuse.


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Intensely aromatic, in the same vein as the Ice Pick I tried a few days ago (different ingredients though).

For him I made an old-fashioned variation created by Candelaria, a Parisian bar, with bourbon, bonal, cocchi americano, and orange bitters.


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They wonder in the article why it's called a Mountain Man. I suspect that it has to do with the use of Bonal gentiane-quina. Gentian is considered a mountain plant, at least in France.

#95 thampik

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Posted 30 June 2012 - 01:23 PM

mkayahara - the Corpse Reviver #2 does indeed taste a lot better with Cointreau and Absinthe; I particularly liked the aniseedy note.

However I am finding the drink difficult to love - mainly I think because the lemon (freshly squeezed) seems to really take over the drink (I am using equal quantities of Gin, Cointreau, Lilet blanc and lemon juice).

#96 Van Stratten

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Posted 30 June 2012 - 05:01 PM

I shouldn't sound like a contrarian with my very first post on this forum, but personally I'm going back to Lillet. Two of my top ten cocktails call for Lillet blanc: the popular Corpse Reviver #2 and the not-as-popular 20th Century Cocktail. I think Cocchi Americano is fine, if unremarkable, in a Corpse Reviver #2. But in a 20th Century Cocktail - and I double checked tonight after a two month hiatus - it is absolutely dreadful. Terrible. That drink is (in my opinion) much, much better with a fresh bottle of Lillet. When I first opened the Cocchi Americano and tried it in a 20th Century Coctail, I thought I was drinking the cocktail with an old, stale bottle of Lillet. I let the Cocchi Americano oxidize a couple months in the fridge but that didn't help. Since I believe the CR2 is no better (if that) with Cocchi Americano, I will happily switch back to Lillet blanc.

This kind of surprises me because on its own I think Americano is delicious. Unadorned in a glass it's a hands down winner next to Lillet blanc. But in two of my favorite mixed drinks, I believe it is a poor runner up to the original. That said, I look forward to finishing the bottle I have straight and not mixed.

#97 FrogPrincesse

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Posted 01 July 2012 - 10:15 PM

By itself Cocchi Americano is quite delicious. Just one large ice cube and a blood orange zest. That was my drink tonight.


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#98 tanstaafl2

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Posted 02 July 2012 - 07:12 AM

By itself Cocchi Americano is quite delicious. Just one large ice cube and a blood orange zest. That was my drink tonight.


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I like it with a splash or two of soda but I agree it is quite nice. Then again I like Lillet and Bonal that way as well. Of the three Bonal may be my favorite.
If you pick up a starving dog and make him prosperous, he will not bite you. This is the principal difference between a dog and a man. ~Mark Twain

Some people are like a Slinky. They are not really good for anything, but you still can't help but smile when you shove them down the stairs...
~tanstaafl2

#99 Chris Amirault

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Posted 01 September 2012 - 06:09 PM

Enjoying a drink I found on Kindred Cocktails by Kyle Davidson of the Violet Hour. He calls it The Dry Season, a perfect drink for this early fall evening:

1 oz blanco tequila (he says El Tesoro, I had Espolon)
1 oz mezcal (he says DM Vida, I have DM Chichicapa)
1 oz Cocchi Americano
1/2 oz Aperol

Stir; strain; up.
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#100 Chris Amirault

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Posted 01 September 2012 - 06:21 PM

I shouldn't sound like a contrarian with my very first post on this forum, but personally I'm going back to Lillet.


Welcome, Van Stratten. Allow me to take a different approach to your contrarian one. :wink:

If you snoop through this topic, you'll find many examples of cocktails where the specific characteristics of Cocchi Americano are perfect, if not extraordinary. I agree that the two you mentioned have not yet produced the sorts of results I'd have hoped for with the CA. But perhaps we've got it backwards, trying to shoehorn Cocchi Americano into those well-worn loafers, CR#2 and 20thC. I dunno.

What I do know is that there are many great CA drinks out there. The Dry Season, about which I just posted, The Kina Cocktail, these two drinks using the Jerry Thomas Decanter Bitters, Dave Wondrich's Weeski, the PDT Brown Bomber and White Negroni... I could go on: these are all remarkable drinks that are either classic (or contemporary but founded on classic principles) that depend on Cocchi Americano utterly.

An example of my own devising: I came up with the Lindberg's Baby recipe for a fundraiser here at which I was host bartender, and it showcases every good feature of the Cocchi Americano (as well as the outstanding Ransom Old Tom gin):

1½ oz Ransom Old Tom gin
1 oz Cocchi Americano
scant ½ oz Marie Brizard Apry apricot liqueur
dash Scrappy's or Fee's grapefruit bitters
dash Bitter Truth Jerry Thomas Decanter or Angostura bitters


No need to throw out Lillet or CA. Each has a rightful place, methinks.
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#101 slkinsey

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Posted 02 September 2012 - 08:09 AM

I tasted all the white gentian imports available (Suze, Avèze, Salers) and our conclusion was that Suze was probably best for sipping or mixing with seltzer, but that Salers worked better in cocktails, having a more straightforward and present gentian profile. My "Haus Alpenz White Negroni" consists of Hayman's Royal Dock gin, Cocchi Aperitivo Americano and Salers Aperitif in 3:2:1 ratio.

At Fred Yarm's suggestion, I've been subbing the new Salers liqueur for Suze. I enjoyed the White Negroni, but it could be more more bitter and a bit less sweet to really warrant the Negroni name, even with Cocchi. I'll swap the ratios next time.


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#102 EvergreenDan

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Posted 02 September 2012 - 03:33 PM

Lindberg's Baby

1½ oz Ransom Old Tom gin
1 oz Cocchi Americano
scant ½ oz Marie Brizard Apry apricot liqueur
dash Scrappy's or Fee's grapefruit bitters
dash Bitter Truth Jerry Thomas Decanter or Angostura bitters

Yikes. I'm scared, although you seldom steer me wrong, Chris. Corriander, orange, apricot, juniper, grapefruit, pie spice, oh my. That's a pretty advanced cocktail for a fundraiser. How did it go over with mere mortals?
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#103 Van Stratten

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Posted 04 September 2012 - 06:25 PM

I shouldn't sound like a contrarian with my very first post on this forum, but personally I'm going back to Lillet.


Welcome, Van Stratten. Allow me to take a different approach to your contrarian one. :wink:


Thanks, Chris. I ended up finishing the bottle of Cocchi Americano I had by drinking it plain (or "neat" to use the popular euphemism), and thought again that it was very good by itself. Something that tastes that good must mix well with something. I'll need to experiment with it again. Maybe that Kina Cocktail or White Negroni should be next.

And I have to back track on the harsh criticism I made about it. I recently opened up a new bottle of Lillet Blanc, made a 20th Century Cocktail with it, and it tasted just as "flat" as the ones I made with C.A. I was stunned. I thought I had that drink perfected, but I guess not. I haven't made it again but I suspect the problem is that I made the bad ones with too much creme de cacao. I had settled on Gary Regan's 3:1:1:1 ratio as the best version, but I'll need to tone down the creme de cacao a bit or go back to Dr. Cocktail's 6:3:3:2 ratio. More experimentation is needed (...the horror).

#104 mkayahara

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Posted 04 September 2012 - 07:08 PM

My husband has been on a real Bourbon kick lately, ever since discovering that it's the one kind of whiskey he likes, so when I showed him the Bourbon Dynasty in David Wondrich's Killer Cocktails, his first reaction was, "Yes, make that one." So I put the Cocchi through its paces as a substitute for Lillet once again, to great effect. The drink is on the same template as the Weeski, with Bourbon instead of Irish (Maker's Mark specified; I used Evan Williams), cassis instead of Cointreau, and Peychaud's instead of orange bitters. I usually up the liqueur to 1/4 oz. from 1 tsp. in these recipes, because I sometimes find it a touch too dry otherwise; I guess that gives me a sweet tooth around these parts. Anyway, adjusted thusly, this was a very lush, lovely cocktail.
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#105 Chris Amirault

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Posted 04 September 2012 - 07:15 PM


Lindberg's Baby

1½ oz Ransom Old Tom gin
1 oz Cocchi Americano
scant ½ oz Marie Brizard Apry apricot liqueur
dash Scrappy's or Fee's grapefruit bitters
dash Bitter Truth Jerry Thomas Decanter or Angostura bitters

Yikes. I'm scared, although you seldom steer me wrong, Chris. Corriander, orange, apricot, juniper, grapefruit, pie spice, oh my. That's a pretty advanced cocktail for a fundraiser. How did it go over with mere mortals?


They loved it -- the first drink we ran out of that night. (Not so with another drink of my concoction, FWIW...) I think this libation is one of my best, a favorite for me and many guests.
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#106 cadmixes

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Posted 07 September 2012 - 06:42 PM

An example of my own devising: I came up with the Lindberg's Baby recipe for a fundraiser here at which I was host bartender, and it showcases every good feature of the Cocchi Americano (as well as the outstanding Ransom Old Tom gin):

1½ oz Ransom Old Tom gin
1 oz Cocchi Americano
scant ½ oz Marie Brizard Apry apricot liqueur
dash Scrappy's or Fee's grapefruit bitters
dash Bitter Truth Jerry Thomas Decanter or Angostura bitters


No need to throw out Lillet or CA. Each has a rightful place, methinks.


I had to sub Ransom for the imperfect combo of Hayman's and Botanist but this is some nice work, Chris.

#107 Keith Orr

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Posted 07 September 2012 - 10:39 PM



Lindberg's Baby

1½ oz Ransom Old Tom gin
1 oz Cocchi Americano
scant ½ oz Marie Brizard Apry apricot liqueur
dash Scrappy's or Fee's grapefruit bitters
dash Bitter Truth Jerry Thomas Decanter or Angostura bitters

Yikes. I'm scared, although you seldom steer me wrong, Chris. Corriander, orange, apricot, juniper, grapefruit, pie spice, oh my. That's a pretty advanced cocktail for a fundraiser. How did it go over with mere mortals?


They loved it -- the first drink we ran out of that night. (Not so with another drink of my concoction, FWIW...) I think this libation is one of my best, a favorite for me and many guests.


I loved it too! Had one at Teardrop Lounge here in Portland tonight!

Posted Image

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#108 Chris Amirault

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Posted 27 September 2012 - 06:33 PM

Thanks, guys. I was pretty honored that Daniel Shoemaker asked to include it on his menu at Teardrop.
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#109 eas

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Posted 18 January 2013 - 03:35 PM

Writing here as US importer for Cocchi Americano (Bianco), we are just now rolling out in the US their Americano Rosa. Where the Bianco has a wine base of their estate Moscato, the Rosa is a blend of Brachetto d'Acqui and Malvasia di Castelnuovo Don Bosco. Both variatals give notes of white rose and summer berries, strawberry in particular. If you'd like to taste one of the base wines, seek out the Cocchi Brachetto d'Acqui we sell in select markets. Enjoy!

#110 Yojimbo

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Posted 18 January 2013 - 06:56 PM

Thanks, Eric!

Any inside tips on how mixing with the Rosa formula differs from the straight Bianco?
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#111 eas

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Posted 18 January 2013 - 07:06 PM

Hi Yojimbo - in the standard 2:1 mix with soda on ice, use lemon peel instead of orange slice. To my well worn palate there's something ambrosia coming out of that wine base - caveat that I sell and sometime drink the potion - decide for yourself...!

#112 FrogPrincesse

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 01:05 PM




Lindberg's Baby
1½ oz Ransom Old Tom gin
1 oz Cocchi Americano
scant ½ oz Marie Brizard Apry apricot liqueur
dash Scrappy's or Fee's grapefruit bitters
dash Bitter Truth Jerry Thomas Decanter or Angostura bitters

Yikes. I'm scared, although you seldom steer me wrong, Chris. Corriander, orange, apricot, juniper, grapefruit, pie spice, oh my. That's a pretty advanced cocktail for a fundraiser. How did it go over with mere mortals?


They loved it -- the first drink we ran out of that night. (Not so with another drink of my concoction, FWIW...) I think this libation is one of my best, a favorite for me and many guests.


I loved it too! Had one at Teardrop Lounge here in Portland tonight!


I was a little scared too but ended up trying Lindbergh's Baby the other night. I used Hayman's Old Tom gin, Cocchi Americano, Rothman & Winter orchard apricot liqueur (about 3/8 oz), grapefruit bitters made by a friend, and Jerry Thomas decanter bitters.

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I am sad to report that I did not care for it. It was too sweet and had a weird candy flavor from the R&W apricot liqueur and Cocchi Americano combination. I was expecting something elegant and aromatic. The original Charles Lindbergh cocktail from the Savoy Cocktail Book, reproduced below with Erik's tasting notes for reference purposes, only has a small amount of apricot. But I recognize that the Ransom Old Tom gin may be quite different from Hayman's, which may be the source of my problems. Also, although I like R&W as a subtle accent, I don't care for it in larger amounts.

I added a grapefruit twist after tasting, in an effort to add some acidity. I also boosted the bitters a little bit but the cocktail still did not come together for me.

I haven't tried the original but seeing it described as a "girly drink" is not very tempting to me!

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Charlie Lindbergh Cocktail

2 Dashes Orange Juice. (2/3 tsp Orange Juice)
2 Dashes Pricota. (2/3 tsp Rothman & Winter Orchard Apricot liqueur)
1/2 Kina Lillet. (1 oz Cocchi Americano)
1/2 Plymouth Gin. (1 oz Plymouth Gin)

Shake (stir?) well and serve in cocktail glass. Squeeze lemon peel on top.

I can only assume this is named after Charles Lindbergh, the aviator who flew the first successful non-stop flight between New York and Paris in May of 1927.

The cocktail itself seemed a bit, uh, "girly". Nice enough, and all, but more of the sort of drink you'd buy for that cute girl you are trying to impress, than the sort of thing you'd have as a brace up after crossing the Atlantic.

If you want to play along and don't have Cocchi Americano, I'd again suggest 1 oz dry vermouth, dash angosutura, dash maraschino liqueur, and an orange twist squeezed into the tin. It's pretty close and might even be better in this particular case.


Edited by FrogPrincesse, 22 January 2013 - 01:26 PM.


#113 mkayahara

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 02:36 PM

But I recognize that the Ransom Old Tom gin may be quite different from Hayman's, which may be the source of my problems.

Indeed, that's your problem right there.
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#114 FrogPrincesse

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 03:52 PM


But I recognize that the Ransom Old Tom gin may be quite different from Hayman's, which may be the source of my problems.

Indeed, that's your problem right there.



I see.

I did not realize that Ransom was a different style of Old Tom gin with, based on what I just read in the Old Tom Gin thread, strong botanical and malty flavors. I will know for next time. The baby *almost* ended in the sink but I finished my glass out of respect for Chris! :smile:

#115 Keith Orr

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 05:03 PM

I've had the Lindberg's Baby made with Chris's recipe and Ransom Old Tom and I had no urge to pour it anyplace but down the hatch. It's a keeper for me.

It also makes a fine Tom Collins though you may want to cut back on the sugar just a bit.

I'm a big fan of the Ransom Old Tom Gin. You have the added bonus of supporting Tad Seestedt, the owner, one of the nicest people anywhere. Tad's been around the Oregon Wine and Spirits business for years, but finally found overnight success with the Old Tom. He also produces some fine Oregon Wines.

Posted Image

Edited by Keith Orr, 22 January 2013 - 05:06 PM.


#116 Chris Amirault

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 05:36 PM

As said above, the Ransom and Hayman's are radically different, and I can't imagine that drink being made with anything other than the Ransom. It was built precisely for that spirit. Save the Hayman's for a terrific Martinez.

I've never used the R&W apricot in the drink, so can't comment on that. Will have to seek it out!
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#117 FrogPrincesse

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 06:18 PM

Thanks Chris. What does the cocktail taste like, when made properly?

#118 Chris Amirault

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 06:46 PM

Tough question! If you've never had the Ransom, it's nearly impossible to explain, I'm afraid. Matt? Someone? Bueller?
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#119 mkayahara

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Posted 23 January 2013 - 09:56 AM

Yeah, I'm not good with tasting notes at the best of times. I would describe Ransom Old Tom as a bit malty (but not as much as, say, Geneviève), but also bright and floral. It's substantially more aromatically complex than Hayman's and (as I recall), fuller-bodied. Ransom Old Tom really is sui generis, IMO.

Edit: Does it help to think that my favourite use for Hayman's is in a Martinez, while my favourite use for Ransom is in an Old Fashioned with lavender bitters, a Chartreuse rinse and a lemon twist?

You gotta get a bottle.

Edited by mkayahara, 23 January 2013 - 09:58 AM.

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#120 Yojimbo

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Posted 23 January 2013 - 09:56 AM

Tough question! If you've never had the Ransom, it's nearly impossible to explain, I'm afraid. Matt? Someone? Bueller?


I'll take a crack at it -- whereas Hayman's has mostly a sweetened, oilier London Dry profile (my personal take, feel free to differ), Ransom is drier, with all the botanicals of London Dry (heavy on the cardamom and bitter citrus) and the added malty and resinous character of a genever (I'd say its closest American cousin is Anchor's Genevieve, but it doesn't have quite the paint-thinner character -- I actually mean that in a positive way -- that Genevieve has). Nothing against Hayman's, I made some fine cocktails with my bottle, but Ransom is really a whole different take on Old Tom, and a knockout. You'll just have to try it and see!
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