11 replies to this topic

[Jason Perlow]

Dale DeGroff formulated the Flaming Orange Gully for eGullet.com back in January of 2003.

While we love the F.O.G, and Dale is a genius mixologist, I think its time for a new eGullet cocktail craze. Care to take a swing at it?

[MiguelCardoso]

If possible, given that this is the Internet, could it include ingredients that could also be found in Europe? Dale DeGroff is justifiably revered here in Portugal and, so far as I know, his superb recipes are always admirably universal. Still, I'm sure I'm not the only European e Gulleteer frustrated by trying to find the Velvet Falernum Syrup he did so much to enhance and make available.

By the way, I know from experience, from colleagues' trials and the sobering example of all the IBA competitions, how very difficult (read: impossible) it is to come up with a "new" cocktail, unless you're a genius.

As an addition to Jason's enciting provocation, could I suggest another equally welcome invitation, in case an invention is too much grief? Do you know of any small, simple ways to improve (or make more interesting) the usual, classic cocktails we serve?

Over the years, these have been my greatest inspirations. For instance: the lemon/lime/Meyer lemon choice and percentages in Margaritas. Or, from a great bartender at the old Oak Bar at the Algonquin in the early Eighties, the addition of a small drop of Pernod (via a "pipette" using a simple straw) to Dry Martinis - gin, of course. :)

[paul mitchell]

Well I've got a lot of suggestions for kid mocktails.

[Rachel Perlow]

I'm sure I'm not the only European eGulleteer frustrated by trying to find the Velvet Falernum Syrup he did so much to enhance and make available.

Believe you me, it is damn near impossible to find in the US too. That's why there's a separate recipe for it (in TDG article, and a scaled down version is discussed in the follow up thread) as well.

[balmagowry]

I'm sure I'm not the only European eGulleteer frustrated by trying to find  the Velvet Falernum Syrup he did so much to enhance and make available.

Believe you me, it is damn near impossible to find in the US too. That's why there's a separate recipe for it (in TDG article, and a scaled down version is discussed in the follow up thread) as well.

Speaking of things that are hard to come by in the US - damn, I hate being so late chiming in on this, I only wish I'd been around when it was actually happening - I've been going over the Flaming Orange Gully threads and would be interested in anyone's take on why Dale would have used Angostura Bitters rather than Orange Bitters. I can see where the latter, on the face of it, might sound like too much of the same thing - would you like some orange with your orange and orange? - but I have a feeling it would be a marvelous addition to the "layering" of flavors; subtle yet complex. Of course, [A] I haven't tasted the original, or tried to reproduce it, yet; and [B] I have a strong prejudice in favor of Orange Bitters because I make my own and am rather proud of them. So I can't pretend to be either objective or competent... just curious. All I know is, my fantasy of the drink is flavored this way and I can't seem to do a damn thing about it - the stubborn palate of my imagination keeps telling me, ain't broke don't fix it.

[Gary Regan]

Wow! All these questions/comments so early on a Monday. Thanks to you all. Mardee is going to reply seperately and we're in different offices so I can't predict when she'll get back to you all.

First, we'd be honored to creat a new e-gully cocktail. Thanks for asking. Just give us until Friday. Okay? And we'll do our best to make sure the ingredients are available world-wide. I don't suppose a scotch and soda would suffice, would it? Thought not.

I can't speak for Dale, of course, but I know that he uses orange bitters quite frequently, so he must have been looking for the different nuances that come from Angostura when he created the drink. And while we're on the subject, here's some shameless self promotion: Regans' Orange Bitters No. 6 should be on the market in the near future. You'll be able to get then from the Sazerac Company in New Orleans (the same people who make Peychaud's), and also from their www.buffalotrace.com web site.

Miguel: Your tale of the bartender who added drops of Pernod to your Martini is a perfect example of making variations on the classics. We had a friend over recently who said they'd like a Manhattan, but they'd like a sweeter version--we merely added some Grand Marnier to the drink.

The other way you can "play" with recipes is to simply take one ingredient out of a recipe, and replace it with another, but you must be careful: If you take a liqueur out of a recipe, replace it with another liqueur, etc. You must also watch that you don't destroy the balance. Here's an example:

We took our basic Margarita recipe, took the Cointreau out, and replaced it with Disarrono amaretto. However, the Disarrono is far sweeter than the Cointreau, so we had to add omre fresh lime juice to achieve balance. Sounds complicated, but it's pretty easy. Honest. Taste the 2 ingredients side by side and your taste will guide you.

[MiguelCardoso]

Wow, Gary!

I just tried your modified, custom-made Margarita (one of the advantages of working at home, what?) and it's tremendous. Thanks ever so much!

And this is a strict orthodox Margarita-drinker speaking (Cointreau, new 100% agave tequila, unwaxed, untreated, freshly squeezed lemon and lime juice, half and half; "fleur du sel" on the rim) so I take of my hat to you. Not eating it yet, but just about! :)

[Gary Regan]

I guess it's after 8:30 p.m. in Portugal, but it isn't yet 3 p.m. here--and it's Monday to boot--and now you've got me wanting a Margarita . . .

[MiguelCardoso]

Well, it's God's work, Gary - and we are but the instruments. Do not deny your Creator and go ahead! :)

[slkinsey]

Regans' Orange Bitters No. 6 should be on the market in the near future.

This is great! I'll definitely be seeking this out when it's on the market. I love all kinds of bitters, and think that the role they play in cocktails is underappreciated to say the least. In my book, it just isn't a Manhattan without bitters, and too many new cocktails leave out this wonderful accent and point of interest.

It will be very interesting to taste the your orange bitters, as all I have had thus far is the Fee Brothers' incarnation. As much as I like their orange bitters, I think their "old fashioned" bitters is even better -- I like it a lot more than Angostura.

[Cusina]

It's only 1:30 here and I want one too. Sounds heavenly. At least I'll be able to alter my menu to accomodate some at dinner.

[balmagowry]

I love all kinds of bitters, and think that the role they play in cocktails is underappreciated to say the least.  In my book, it just isn't a Manhattan without bitters, and too many new cocktails leave out this wonderful accent and point of interest.

Hear, hear! And it sure isn't a Champagne Cocktail ("such a happy drink") without 'em, either. (In fact, that's what led me to make my own in the first place - we were dead set on making Champagne Cocktails and for the life of us we couldn't find Orange Bitters in the NY area; and in the high and far-off times before the world wide web, that was a stumper!)